[MBTI General] INFP/INFJ Friendship's End

[Eilonwy]

[MENTION=16382]Ene[/MENTION], I wanted to share something with you because I found it interesting and informative and thought you might find it so, too. I've been told that my answer to you reads as if I took the OP at face value, which is what I did. I didn't try to go deeper and look at things from different angles. I find that interesting because I had made a decision quite a long time ago to believe what people tell me--to take them at face value--because what they tell me is what they believe from their point of view. I know that I'm not successful at it all the time, but I was in this case. And I'm not sure if that's a good thing or not. However, it does provide one view point out of many, so in that way it's useful.

 

[Ene]

[MENTION=16382]Ene[/MENTION], I wanted to share something with you because I found it interesting and informative and thought you might find it so, too. I've been told that my answer to you reads as if I took the OP at face value, which is what I did. I didn't try to go deeper and look at things from different angles. I find that interesting because I had made a decision quite a long time ago to believe what people tell me--to take them at face value--because what they tell me is what they believe from their point of view. I know that I'm not successful at it all the time, but I was in this case. And I'm not sure if that's a good thing or not. However, it does provide one view point out of many, so in that way it's useful.

I appreciate you sharing that. I have no problem with your taking things, posts or people at face value. I'm going to use an artist's metaphor. Sometimes, not in every case of course, people dig deeper and end up so busy looking at the frame that they fail to see the picture. I have no problem with people who make inquiries to form a more complete picture. I have no problem with those who get hung up the frame. I just realize that they don't get that they don't get it. But, hey, I'm sure I'm like that sometimes, too. I'm not keen on emotional rants, verbal onslaughts or unfounded accusations. So having said that, I like that you take people at face value. It's refreshing. You should be free to express your honest opinion. It shouldn't matter if others think you need to "dig deeper." Who's to say that their perception is more accurate than yours. I may sound very Ni in saying this, but trust your own impressions, your own mind

 

[Eilonwy]

I appreciate you sharing that. I have no problem with your taking things, posts or people at face value. I'm going to use an artist's metaphor. Sometimes, not in every case of course, people dig deeper and end up so busy looking at the frame that they fail to see the picture. I have no problem with people who make inquiries to form a more complete picture. I have no problem with those who get hung up the frame. I just realize that they don't get that they don't get it. But, hey, I'm sure I'm like that sometimes, too. I'm not keen on emotional rants, verbal onslaughts or unfounded accusations. So having said that, I like that you take people at face value. It's refreshing. You should be free to express your honest opinion. It shouldn't matter if others think you need to "dig deeper." Who's to say that their perception is more accurate than yours. I may sound very Ni in saying this, but trust your own impressions, your own mind

Just to clarify, no one was telling me to dig deeper. I asked for an honest assessment of how my post read so that I could get a better idea of...well, how my post read.

 

[skylights]

I think you've made some very valid points here. Thank you.

Thank you, and you're welcome. If I've interpreted correctly, it just seems to me like one of those things that just can't be, like having a crush on someone who's already taken, and with maturity you learn that you just have to do your best to remove yourself from those people until you can "recalibrate" yourself and address your internal need for whatever you see that person fulfilling, so you don't turn it into a pressured burden on someone who's already got a full plate. I think ideally the INFP would figure out that she wants more than the INFJ is ready and willing to give and she would distance herself, and she would understand that someone's life already being full has virtually nothing to do with how valuable she is. But as I was mentioning, I think those things are perhaps less native to Fi, being able to figure out the "most mutually beneficial interpersonal distance", if that makes sense, and being able to distance oneself appropriately. I think it's a compliment, though, that she finds the friendship so compelling. Clearly there's something there that speaks deeply to her.

 

[Ene]

Just to clarify, no one was telling me to dig deeper. I asked for an honest assessment of how my post read so that I could get a better idea of...well, how my post read.

Okay, thanks. Your post read quite well to me thank you for helping me to "see."

 

[Ene]

Thank you, and you're welcome. If I've interpreted correctly, it just seems to me like one of those things that just can't be, like having a crush on someone who's already taken, and with maturity you learn that you just have to do your best to remove yourself from those people until you can "recalibrate" yourself and address your internal need for whatever you see that person fulfilling, so you don't turn it into a pressured burden on someone who's already got a full plate. I think ideally the INFP would figure out that she wants more than the INFJ is ready and willing to give and she would distance herself, and she would understand that someone's life already being full has virtually nothing to do with how valuable she is. But as I was mentioning, I think those things are perhaps less native to Fi, being able to figure out the "most mutually beneficial interpersonal distance", if that makes sense, and being able to distance oneself appropriately. I think it's a compliment, though, that she finds the friendship so compelling. Clearly there's something there that speaks deeply to her.

I think you are very right and I believe that ultimately that was INFP's intention. Maybe she had trouble expressing it. Both ladies are kind people with good intentions. I like your way of saying it is just one of those things not meant to be, like having a crush on someone already taken.

 

[skylights]

I think you are very right and I believe that ultimately that was INFP's intention. Maybe she had trouble expressing it. Both ladies are kind people with good intentions. I like your way of saying it is just one of those things not meant to be, like having a crush on someone already taken.

Thanks. I tend to go with the thought that if it's not working despite good effort and good intention, then it's just not meant to be, at least not this go-round or in this manifestation. I hope it can turn out to be a good experience for both of them at least in terms of helping them see another facet of themselves, the one reflected in each other, and teaching them something about what they want and need.

 

[grey_beard]

The following is a somewhat true account. I DO NOT want bashing of either type. That's not why I'm posting this. What I want to know is... what misunderstandings, what functional clashes do you view as the reason behind the ending of this story? I look forward to hearing your input. Also, if you don't like the people descriptions, don't get all mad at me and stuff. They're real descriptions of real people. I didn't make these chracters up. I only do that in my lab over in the Fluff Zone

................................................................INFP/INFJ At Friendship's End..............................................................

An INFJ is researcing a particular subject online. She encounters an INFP who seems to have a good understanding of the subject, so she intiates contact. The two exchange several productive letters, discussing it, which leads to other subjects. They exchange letters about many topics and over the course of several months, a friendship develops. Sometimes they talk on the phone.

However, prior to the beginning of their friendship INFJ has a circle of close-knit friends in real life that are long term friends. She is involved in promotion of a cause that she believes in and is often called upon to be a spokesperson or make appearances on behalf of the group. Her friends are all a part of that group. In addition, she works full time and is part of a large extended family and is in a long-term relationship with an ISTJ.

INFP is retired and spends most of her days online, other than an occassional trip to the laundromat, grocery store or doctor's office. She putters around doing whatever she feels the need to do. She has never liked people and particularly dislikes ENFJs and ESTJs. She is shy around men and fumbles her conversation when she tries to talk to them.

INFJ is younger, stylish, admired in her community for her talent, her looks and her charity work. She's in a long-term relationship and has a family depending upon her. She is sought after wherever she goes and literally has to hide to escape the people who want to get to know her.

INFP's children are grown and she was never close to rest of her family anyway and the few that are left don't really bother to contact her. She has a lot of time on her hands.

INFJ realizes that INFP is different, yet she values her insight and input. When they first become acquainted INFJ is in a lull of activity and the two of them speak often. Still, she hasn't made INFP the top priority in her life. After all, she's an online friend who lives 6,000 miles away.

As time goes by, INFJ has little free time for getting online and answering emails or for talking on the phone for that matter and sometimes, she wants to use what little free time she does get, just to recalibrate herself. Still, she stays late at work often just to have a little while alone to really think about INFP's letters and give them a decent answer. Sometimes, she stays up to the wee hours of the night, knowing she has to get up before daybreak. She stays up to answer INFP's letters because she doesn't want to hurt her feelings or disappoint her. She thinks she's going the extra mile, but she can't keep up the pace. She has a lot less time to invest and sometimes, she just doesn't have the energy to answer a five page letter. Sometimes, she does and sometimes, she even writes one herself.

She starts to get hints from INFP that she doesn't really want to hear about INFJ's real life friends, her hobbies or etc., She doesn't want to hear about the weekend she spent with the real life friends of her inner circle anymore. She starts to believe that INFP only wants to hear about things that focus on her and their relationship.

Meanwhile, INFP is bothered by INFJ's "busy-ness". At first she tells her that she understands that her life is busy and she knows that she can't respond to "everything." She is, at first, unbelievable tolerant of the talk about the real life friends, about the interests, hobbies, etc. But eventually INFP feels that INFJ has time for everybody but her. She feels she is having to play "second fiddle" to the people in INFJ's immediate world. She doesn't want to hear about INFJ's close friends from the "cause." And thus, she begins to try to determine just "where she fits into INFJ's life." INFP is thinking that she is only an option in INFJ's life, while INFJ is a priority in hers. INFJ feels bad about it, but she can't change it. She had a busy life from the start and to her the fact that she even finds time for INFP at all is a great accomplishment. INFP tells INFJ that she is too "aloof" that she isn't letting her into the "inner circle" but INFJ can't let her into the inner circle. It's not a place she can just grant to people. She isn't sure how people get into the inner circle. They either have that certain "something" or they don't. She can't define it and although she tries to put INFP there. She can't, because INFP doesn't "get" it and she doesn't know how to help her "get it."

At first, when INFP starts asking "Where am I in your list of priorities? Where do I fit into your free time?"

INFJ is like "you fit." That's all that matters, but the subject won't go away. It crops up again and again. INFJ begins to feel like INFP is trying to "guilt" her into spending more time answering her emails and talking to her on the phone. She feels like INFP is trying to manipulate her and that she is nit-picking the subject to death and that she has become possessive. She isn't sure what INFP wants. She is giving her all of the tiem she can actually afford to give her, but INFP doesn't feel that way. She feels that INFJ puts too much time in with the group of people in her real life, the people she has spent several years builidng a relationship with, that she can physically touch and eat with and do things with.

INFP then sends INFJ a letter stating that she won't settle for just "second fiddle" that if she can't be a major part of her free time then she just doesn't want to communicate with her at all. INFJ responds, "Well, if that's the way you feel...okay, but remember, it doesn't have to be all or nothing; the door's always open." For two months INFP doesn't write and INFJ doesn't either because she thinks that's what INFP wants. Then one day INFP sends her a letter and says that she won't get so clingy this time, but within six months they are right back to where they were and INFP starts in again with wanting to know what priority she plays in INFJ's life. INFJ hates that. Why does it matter? She wants to know. "You're a part of my life and that shoudl be all that matters. You're my only online friend that gets more than an occassional private message."But it DOES matter to INFP. It matters a lot. She doen'st want to be second place to those real life people that INFJ hangs out with. She sends INFJ another letter talking about where does she fit in; she says INFJ spends frivoulous time with those unnessecary people, and then INFJ responds. "I do not like it when people try to manipulate, coeherce or control me. You shouldn't always concern yourself so much about where you fit into my life; you fit, so long as you want to, and that should be all that matters."

To that INFP replies. "You'll never have to worry about it again." And abrubtly ends all contact with INFJ. She unfriends her on facebook and sends her no more letters.

INFJ let's out a sigh and thinks, "Oh, well." Then she responds with one word. "Okay." She knows that she's killing the relationship, but at this point she doesn't care. She knows that in two months INFP is going to regret "cutting her nose off to spite her face," but again, at this point she doesn't care and she isn't sure she will care then either. If INFP comes back she will let her in again. She hasn't doorslammed her, but if she comes back, she will not even let her imagine that they are closer than online friends with 6,000 miles between them.

Then she thinks about pursuing and rebuilding the relationship, that maybe she was too hard on INFP but then she realizes that for the first time in a long time she doesn't feel pressured to answer her emails or that she has to worry about hurting her feelings and "Maybe," she thinks, "maybe it is for the best."

She thinks that INFP, despite her more mature years, is childish and that maybe INFP was right all along. Maybe she doesn't have time for her. Maybe she doesn't fit. She is sad because they had good conversation. She thinks about the lost friendship and feels a little like a failure but decides to just let it ride because if she pursues, if she happens to rekindle or knocks on the proverbial door and gets INFP to open, still, nothing will change. She knows that in time they will be right back there again.

She wonders how INFP feels and hopes that she is okay, but as for herself, she feels nothing except a need to understand which cognitive misfunctions led them to this place. She thought she would feel something but she doesn't.

[MENTION=16382]Ene[/MENTION] -- both the INFJ and the INFP need a smack upside the head with an INTJ laser-guided Hellfire Te missile.

1) YOU'RE 6,000 MILES APART. THAT'S sub-launched ICBM range, not "intimate friend" range.
2) INFJ already HAS A FULL PLATE OF COMMITMENTS: family, social cause, friends. THAT IS ALREADY ESTABLISHED and PRE-DATES THE INFP's friendship.
3) Neither of these is rejecting the INFP *AS* *A* *PERSON* : they are both impersonal "EXTERNALITIES" -- like gravity.
4) Couldn't the INFP have (no family obligations, time is their own) have *moved* closer to the INFJ?
5) Couldn't the INFP have reached out to other members of the INFJ social circle?

Real logistics are not personal rejection: but I have had an INFP falsely claim "logistics" to me to mask not wanting to interact with me. I guess all INFPs are individualistic, though, so maybe the analogy doesn't flow upstream.

Full Fi-laden disclosure: secretly, I feel sorry for both of you. Don't tell anyone, ok? I have a reputation to uphold...

 

[Ene]

[MENTION=16382]Ene[/MENTION] -- both the INFJ and the INFP need a smack upside the head with an INTJ laser-guided Hellfire Te missile.

1) YOU'RE 6,000 MILES APART. THAT'S sub-launched ICBM range, not "intimate friend" range.
2) INFJ already HAS A FULL PLATE OF COMMITMENTS: family, social cause, friends. THAT IS ALREADY ESTABLISHED and PRE-DATES THE INFP's friendship.
3) Neither of these is rejecting the INFP *AS* *A* *PERSON* : they are both impersonal "EXTERNALITIES" -- like gravity.
4) Couldn't the INFP have (no family obligations, time is their own) have *moved* closer to the INFJ?
5) Couldn't the INFP have reached out to other members of the INFJ social circle?

Real logistics are not personal rejection: but I have had an INFP falsely claim "logistics" to me to mask not wanting to interact with me. I guess all INFPs are individualistic, though, so maybe the analogy doesn't flow upstream.

Full Fi-laden disclosure: secretly, I feel sorry for both of you. Don't tell anyone, ok? I have a reputation to uphold...

Yes! Thank you. I like that Te missile. It makes perfect sense to me!

I especially identify with this "Real logistics are not personal rejection: but I have had an INFP falsely claim "logistics" to me to mask not wanting to interact with me. I guess all INFPs are individualistic, though, so maybe the analogy doesn't flow upstream."

Which leads me to believe that it WAS a clash of functions.

 

[Nijntje]

Wow, as an infp, i don't relate to this at all, friends come and go, it is the nature of things. I find it difficult to see myself putting those demands on someone else.

My best friends are the ones who know that i drop in and out of contact, but still love me and are able to pick right up where we left off.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

Looks to me like two people with different needs from the relationship. It's okay for 'INFJ' to desire low-maintenance relationships because she doesn't want to make time for (additional) high-maintenance relationships. But it's just as okay for 'INFP' to be looking for a more high-priority spot in someone's life, and to not settle for scraps if she wants a full meal.

I'd say it's not okay for INFP to tell INFJ she shouldn't hang out with other people if that cuts into INFP-time (even if INFP and INFJ were married I'd consider that a warning sign - it might just be a weirdly worded opening bid of 'dude, I'm lonely and I want to hang out with YOU because I miss you - can you clear your schedule a bit?' but it might be the beginning of a controlling relationship), but that it's also not okay for INFJ to disregard INFP as 'childish, despite being older' (INFP had legitimate needs and the situation, pure and simple, was that INFJ cared more about other things than meeting those needs - it's more intellectually honest to say 'I didn't want to spend the energy giving INFP what she wanted. I wish we could have had a mutually fulfilling relationship, but she needed what she needed and in the end my other commitments were more important to me than not disappointing INFP').

This (bolded) is exactly what stuck out to me as well, and sounded a few warning bells.

For the most part, I can relate to the INFP's side in the way that skylight described. I chalk it up to being least so instinct variant- and very occasionally (not often), with certain individuals, it does make me feel like a part of their people collection (I think Qlip is the one who has said this? because so variant folks tend to spread themselves thinner across more people) when I wish they craved more one-on-one time with certain individuals like I do myself. But I wouldn't try to guilt someone out of their own needs to accommodate my own- and if someone has a lot of friends and a full schedule, it's because it's serving some need they have. The very notion of someone trying to guilt another person out of their needs makes me feel very prickly- I realize it's not done with bad intentions, but I personally have a very short fuse for it. Overall the thing in the op is the kind of thing I'd file under 'incompatible'- just like the "having a crush on someone that's already taken"- and I'd move on.

 

[Forever_Jung]

While I appreciate your intentions for this thread, I find these sort of anecdotal things very hard to analyze. Was this your own experience as an INFJ? The INFJ in this story definitely was given more of an internal life in your account, so I thought it might be possible. If this wasn't your own experience, that makes this a story about two people communicating via the internet, told by one of the parties to an outside party, who is now recreating the story to people on the internet through a typological lens. I think A LOT gets lost in translation here, and quite possibly, the INFP's side of things gets lost (her characterization isn't very dynamic here).

After saying ALL of that, if this story is accurate, it seems like the INFP felt there was more of an attachment there than the INFJ felt.

I might be totally wrong here, but I find Fi-users a bit "all-or-nothing" with their attachments. I am, at least. They tend to be initially hesitant to let people in, but when they do, they put ALL OF THEMSELVES INTO IT. I only have a few REALLY close friends, and I find I am consumed by the attachment. I daydream about them, I relate their experiences to strangers as if it was my own experience (I don't mean I say the events happened to me, I just mean it feels like I DID experience it when I'm telling it) and I just feel fused with them. It's almost like I'm under their skin.

Mind you, they didn't ask for that level of commitment, I just have a hard time being friends "halfway". Sometimes I freak my friends out with very intense declarations of affection, which I totally mean, but can seem a bit daunting to match. And inevitably, if a friend can't match that level of intensity, things can feel weird. Because my feelings are very independent of theirs, I don't need reciprocation to express it. Hell, I don't even need to hang out with them, I spend a lot of time with them in my imagination.This makes me VERY prone to unrequited love, because once I get fixated on someone things just keep getting deeper and deeper, even when they start pulling back a bit. I feel a bit stalkerish sometimes.

I want to matter to them as much as they matter to me, and if I feel like I'm a minor player in their life, I start to pout and get a bit resentful. Usually I can keep this in check, because I know that's my own hang-up, but there have been a few times that I have spoke up, and the other person apologizes but says simply that: sorry, this is as far as we go. It really stings, not that I blame them. But it certainly causes my insecure and childish side to flare up. It's getting better with age.

If I had to extrapolate from my own experience (and I realize I'm technically an ENFP, but I'm pretty introverted for one), that is what I would guess is taking place. On the other hand, most of my friends complain I drift out of their life, then spontaneously reappear as if no time has elapsed. So I have a hard time relating to wanting so much of someone's time.

From a more NFJ perspective,I notice my ENFJ mom tends to pick-up clingers and then always blames them for misunderstanding her. She describes them as almost parasitic, even though she frames it in a cozy, feely "understanding" way. I'm just busy, I'm tired, I do enough for people as it is, don't they get that? Well no, because you don't seem like any of those things when you're interacting with them. You treat the people you despise the same way you treat the people you like. I sympathize with her, but when you are persistently encountering a problem like that (everyone thinks I am more committed to them than I actually feel), you should probably examine your own behaviour. It doesn't mean you were doing it on purpose, or it's your "fault", it just means you are repeatedly getting your wires crossed with people.

As I said, it's very hard to say.

 

[Flâneuse]

A few of my experiences as an INFP that might relate to what this one went through:
I'm really, really bad about idealizing friendships from the beginning and then being disappointed and hurt when it doesn't develop the way I want it to. (This has happened to me with different types, but it's most common in my relationships with FJs. I've also been in situations similar to the INFJ's, dealing with other xxFPs who pushed for a level of intimacy that I just couldn't grant them and then got angry at me as though I misled them.) I'm picky about who I befriend, and when I start to form a connection with someone who I like and can view as trustworthy, it feels like finding a needle in a haystack and I get really excited and start forming high expectations about the developing relationship. (But I rarely directly articulate this to the other person.) I think that compared to INFJs, INFPs are more optimistic and prone to forming expectations based on what they want to happen. In my case, this has led me to spend a great deal of time on certain relationships, expecting high levels of intimacy and mutual support, and then feeling "cheated" somehow when I can't get as close to the person as I thought I would. (In most cases, it's not intentional interpersonal deception; it's mutual misunderstanding with a dash of self-deception on my part.) Still, it's painful to discover that the strength of my attraction to someone (platonic or otherwise) isn't matched by the other person's, that someone who I value deeply and view as worth all the time in the world doesn't feel the same way. I've never been as insistent or pushed it as long as the INFP described in the OP (I'm more the type to wallow alone in my hurt feelings) but if I were more emotionally open I could see myself acting that way.

My guess: in the early stages of the friendship when the INFJ had a lull in activity and plenty of time to spend on the INFP, the INFP got the impression that was how it would continue to be and formed an attachment to not only the INFJ herself, but also to an idea of what their friendship would be like in the future. (She sounds like an isolated person, and I know from experience that makes it a lot easier to fixate on certain people and idealize connections with them.) When the INFJ's life started picking back up and she had less time for the INFP, it felt like a betrayal on some level to the INFP, but she initially continued to push harder for a closer friendship because she didn't want to fully give up on having the connection she envisioned.
Of course, I don't know this person - this is just speculation based on my knowledge of my own type.

I agree with the opinion that the friendship between the INFJ and INFP wasn't meant to be - they wanted completely different things from it. Of course the INFP is entitled to feel however she wants, but (from what I can tell) I think she acted far too clingy and persistent. She should have respected the INFJ's boundaries more, and either ended the friendship sooner if she was so dissatisfied or kept up the casual friendship and looked elsewhere for the level of intimacy she wanted.

 

[Ene]

[MENTION=7842]Z Buck McFate[/MENTION], [MENTION=7040]Forever_Jung[/MENTION], [MENTION=20761]underwaterthing[/MENTION]

Each one of you have offered some very valuable insight. [MENTION=20761]underwaterthing[/MENTION] I love your post and I appreciate the honesty in it so much. I think you have a good take on it.

I have taken away a humorous notion from all of the interaction on this thread. Please, everyone, take it with a grain of salt and a light heart, but Ni users really should come with warning labels that read, "Sudden detachment imminent." And Fi users should come with a warning label that reads, "Sudden attachment imminent." Okay, don't throw words at me or anything. It just crossed my mind and I thought it was a comical look at our primary functions

 

[skylights]

Ene, I hope you don't mind that I'm just all over your thread. For whatever reason this is a really fascinating one to me. Please rep me if you feel like I'm distracting from the OP; I don't always have the best sense of whether I am.

I might be totally wrong here, but I find Fi-users a bit "all-or-nothing" with their attachments. [...] They tend to be initially hesitant to let people in, but when they do, they put ALL OF THEMSELVES INTO IT.[...] I just have a hard time being friends "halfway".

I'm really, really bad about idealizing friendships from the beginning and then being disappointed and hurt when it doesn't develop the way I want it to.

Are you guys in my head? Because I resonate soooooo much with these two perspectives. I am so like this too.

My guess: in the early stages of the friendship when the INFJ had a lull in activity and plenty of time to spend on the INFP, the INFP got the impression that was how it would continue to be and formed an attachment to not only the INFJ herself, but also to an idea of what their friendship would be like in the future. [...] When the INFJ's life started picking back up and she had less time for the INFP, it felt like a betrayal on some level to the INFP, but she initially continued to push harder for a closer friendship because she didn't want to fully give up on having the connection she envisioned.

I can totally "feel" how this could happen to an NFP.

For the most part, I can relate to the INFP's side in the way that skylight described. I chalk it up to being least so instinct variant- and very occasionally (not often), with certain individuals, it does make me feel like a part of their people collection (I think Qlip is the one who has said this? because so variant folks tend to spread themselves thinner across more people) when I wish they craved more one-on-one time with certain individuals like I do myself.

Z Buck I think this is a really good point and I feel that too with certain people, even though I can people-spread myself sometimes. I had a friend in high school who I believe was also ENFP, probably also so/sx and almost certainly 7w6, who made me feel like this - for a long time I thought we were close friends, but she suddenly moved on and after that I always seemed like an afterthought to her, just one of many things and people competing for her attention. It was painful but I decided to let go of her as anything more than a distant contact. I still wish I could be close with her. She was so intelligent and fun. I was always left feeling like she didn't really care, though. I think the time I decided to mostly cut off contact was when I'd see her replying to her "new favorite" people on Facebook but she always seemed to miss my posts. I got the impression she still liked interacting with me but not as much as she liked interacting with others.

To be honest, though, relating to variants, I think as Social-Sexual, I like 1-on-1 time with people but can only do it for a short (couple of hours) period of time with most people before I start to get drained - though there are about 10 or so people who I am 110% comfortable with 1-on-1 longterm, even energized by that. It's easy for me to do lots of "lighter" interaction, however. So when I'm arranging my life, I always prioritize those "special" people. I feel bad saying this, but I feel like I've done to others what the INFJ here has done, but it's not meant to be harmful. It's just... I already have my special people (and causes/events), and I know I enjoy being with them. The people who make it into that "inner circle" either have always been there (my nuclear family), or they've been/done something really special to have made it there. I feel like people sort of have to "earn" that.

Like you've implied, maybe the INFP here had Sexual higher in her stacking (sounds like she could maybe be Sx/Sp or Sp/Sx?) and the INFJ had Social higher (sounds like she could be Soc-first?). It does seem like the patterns would fit. If that's true, it could also easily include a mismatch of "ideals", with the INFP thinking this was going to be something close and deep and the INFJ thinking this was going to be something special and flexible. I wonder if the INFP felt like she was securing a special role in the INFJ's life while the INFJ was feeling increasingly pressured, and those two feelings just didn't translate.

I have taken away a humorous notion from all of the interaction on this thread. Please, everyone, take it with a grain of salt and a light heart, but Ni users really should come with warning labels that read, "Sudden detachment imminent." And Fi users should come with a warning label that reads, "Sudden attachment imminent." Okay, don't throw words at me or anything. It just crossed my mind and I thought it was a comical look at our primary functions

Trueeee!!!

 

[Ene]

Ene, I hope you don't mind that I'm just all over your thread. For whatever reason this is a really fascinating one to me. Please rep me if you feel like I'm distracting from the OP; I don't always have the best sense of whether I am.

I don't mind at all. It's really not my thread. I just got the ball rolling I actually enjoy reading your input and appreciate the insight.

I especially took note of this one and can see how that could very well be true.

Sx/Sp or Sp/Sx?) and the INFJ had Social higher (sounds like she could be Soc-first?). It does seem like the patterns would fit. If that's true, it could also easily include a mismatch of "ideals", with the INFP thinking this was going to be something close and deep and the INFJ thinking this was going to be something special and flexible. I wonder if the INFP felt like she was securing a special role in the INFJ's life while the INFJ was feeling increasingly pressured, and those two feelings just didn't translate.

 

[Flâneuse]

@ underwaterthing, I love your post and I appreciate the honesty in it so much. I think you have a good take on it.

I have taken away a humorous notion from all of the interaction on this thread. Please, everyone, take it with a grain of salt and a light heart, but Ni users really should come with warning labels that read, "Sudden detachment imminent." And Fi users should come with a warning label that reads, "Sudden attachment imminent." Okay, don't throw words at me or anything. It just crossed my mind and I thought it was a comical look at our primary functions

Thanks. This thread has been enlightening for me about xNFJs (also Fe-users in general) and how they differ from Fi-doms when forming friendships and deciding whom to form intimate connections with. Despite being fellow NFs, those NFJs are damn hard to understand sometimes (which makes sense on a certain level, an NFP's first four functions are an NFJ's last four).

Are you guys in my head? Because I resonate soooooo much with these two perspectives. I am so like this too.

Yeah, it sucks being an NFP sometimes. <- I can't decide which of these smilies best expresses my feelings about this.

 

[skylights]

Thanks. This thread has been enlightening for me about xNFJs (also Fe-users in general) and how they differ from Fi-doms when forming friendships and deciding whom to form intimate connections with. Despite being fellow NFs, those NFJs are damn hard to understand sometimes (which makes sense on a certain level, an NFP's first four functions are an NFJ's last four).

Yeah, it sucks being an NFP sometimes. <- I can't decide which of these smilies best expresses my feelings about this.

Both.

I think being an NFP is like that super sad song that makes you feel incredible inside but it's still sad. It's like, great, we get to feel all this extra shit and not always be very adept at dealing with it, but hey, we get to feel all this extra beautiful shit.

 

[Ene]

Thanks. This thread has been enlightening for me about xNFJs (also Fe-users in general) and how they differ from Fi-doms when forming friendships and deciding whom to form intimate connections with. Despite being fellow NFs, those NFJs are damn hard to understand sometimes (which makes sense on a certain level, an NFP's first four functions are an NFJ's last four).



Yeah, it sucks being an NFP sometimes. <- I can't decide which of these smilies best expresses my feelings about this.

I agree. It does make sense on a certain level.

I really think that Fe is just a vehicle for bringing Ni into existence. And I can see where that might seem calloused to others when they actually encounter it, because Fe allows an INFJ to appear smooth on the surface, but the inner world is in constant motion, constantly seeking universal connections, pieces to some huge puzzle, like a database doing an extensive search, looking for something but not knowing what until it clicks; maybe the theme is like in Casa Blanca...there are a whole more important things in the universe than the lives of two little people or maybe it's like Mr. Spock in The Wrath of Khan, where he exposes himself to radiation to save the ship and he tells Kirk, "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one." He sees an overall picture that is more important than how he feels. I don't know. I'm just tossing out ideas.

We talk of functions often on here and I can't help but think that much of our needs, wants and perceptions are colored by the order of those functions. While INFJs are Fe users, they are primarily Ni users and that alone makes some connections very difficult for them. For me, I have a lot of trouble connecting with ISFPs and INFPs in real life, (I inwardly loose patience) although I do have one INFP long term friend. Mostly because she lives in my town and decided she liked me; I didnt put forth an effort to befriend her but she just kept popping up and although her Fi is through the roof and she wants to nuke everybody who ever hurt her feelings (or has hurt cats...she's a cat lady) she has this strange liking for me that baffles me. So, over the course of the last three years we have become friends and meet once a week for coffee. Recently, she took a function analysis test and scored a very strong INFP score.

I think it's different for ENFJs but I'm not sure how just yet. They are a lot more expressive initially. I have a sister who scores ENFJ and she's got wonderful con-artistry, although she rarely uses them now. Still, she wields Fe like a blade and with great precision. She knows how to get people to do what she wants them to do. My cousin, also ENFJ, can walk into a restaurant and have total,strangers in tears. Lunch with her is like being on Oprah!

I do know that in order to be a part of my long term inner circle, Ni has to be fed by the interaction. Does that make me a taker and a user? Maybe, but I also give, in hopes of a greater good. I am constantly digging for something deeper, but not an emotional connection, a spiritual one that goes beyond words or feelings. It can't be achieved by appealing to my emotions or even my logic. It can only be reached by touching the Ni, sparking some chord of universal truth that goes beyond explanation. Crazy? Most likely, but very true. It also means that I will constantly be surrounded by many people, but only be truly known by a few.


EDIT: I just want to make it clear that I DO value my INFP friend ( cats and all) and I DO make quality time for her. I don't want our friendship to go the way of the one I wrote about and I don't think it will because we interact on a regular basis and we are only six miles apart, not 6,000. ?" We know we're different, but we work on it.

 

[Ene]

Both.

I think being an NFP is like that super sad song that makes you feel incredible inside but it's still sad. It's like, great, we get to feel all this extra shit and not always be very adept at dealing with it, but hey, we get to feel all this extra beautiful shit.

My boss is a verified ENFP. She gives people the benefit of the doubt, is compassionate and funny. I have never met an ENFP I didn't like