• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[ENFP] The Verbal Fireworks of the ENFP

Forever_Jung

Active member
Joined
May 23, 2009
Messages
2,644
MBTI Type
ESFJ
To be honest, I just want to post this video. have you guys seen this BBC interview of Russell Brand? It's getting me all fired up. The last 3 minutes or so are intense!

This is a great example of an ENFP in advocate mode:


What do you guys think of that? I'm not sure if I agree with every last thing he says, but by God, he knows how to say it.
 

Lady_X

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 27, 2008
Messages
18,235
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
784
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
hell yes!!! preach it enfp brotha!!
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
Ahh the fire of righteous indignation...:ninja:

I've found it to be something most people cannot really take that kind of intense fireworks in a one on one exchange though. It seems to scare and intimidate people or piss them off due to the bath of emotional fire they are exposed to - even when you throw in some funny moments to break it up a little. :laugh:

And they use it against you to not take you seriously - look, s/he is just too emotionally involved and she is tossing in jokes at the same time. S/he can't even bother to put together a serious argument.

It can be quite powerful when you do it to a group of people though at the exact opportune time...:devil:
 

pinkgraffiti

New member
Joined
Mar 20, 2011
Messages
1,482
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
748
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
aah i sympathise. i used to be like that. now i just keep it to myself and choose my fights (i.e. he didn't win anything by talking with that journalist).
 

five sounds

MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247
Joined
Jul 17, 2013
Messages
5,393
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
729
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Lol, yep! Sometimes ya gotta get fired up.

:solidarity:
 

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
8,110
Meh.

He comes off as a know-nothing.

Lots of emotion, very little knowledge.

"I'M PISSED OFF ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE. I'M PISSED OFF ABOUT INEQUALITY. AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HELL TO DO ABOUT IT."

When people are that pissed off about something, but can't even offer a feasible alternative, they should not be listened to.

They don't know how the world works. They're just venting their ressentiment.
 

five sounds

MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247
Joined
Jul 17, 2013
Messages
5,393
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
729
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Meh.

He comes off as a know-nothing.

Lots of emotion, very little knowledge.

"I'M PISSED OFF ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE. I'M PISSED OFF ABOUT INEQUALITY. AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HELL TO DO ABOUT IT."

When people are that pissed off about something, but can't even offer a feasible alternative, they should not be listened to.

They don't know how the world works. They're just venting their ressentiment.

I totally agree in some ways. He wasn't presenting an a argument really, and I don't think that was his intent. This kind of thing by itself is pretty useless.

But I'd argue that it's not without merit. I'm not in love with every word he said or every rhetorical angle he took, but I think what he was doing can be motivating. It can be good to hear others express a passionate stance against something you are feeling too. That kind if thig sparks fires in others and that can spread. (Let's just hope it spreads to some people with better skills in the way of working to come up with a better plan). But it can be good to hear that other ways are possible and to be encouraged to think that way.

He wasn't pretending to have a plan. He was just speaking his mind and using his position in the public eye to share his fire inside with the world.
 

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
8,110
I totally agree in some ways. He wasn't presenting an a argument really, and I don't think that was his intent. This kind of thing by itself is pretty useless.

But I'd argue that it's not without merit. I'm not in love with every word he said or every rhetorical angle he took, but I think what he was doing can be motivating. It can be good to hear others express a passionate stance against something you are feeling too. That kind if thig sparks fires in others and that can spread. (Let's just hope it spreads to some people with better skills in the way of working to come up with a better plan). But it can be good to hear that other ways are possible and to be encouraged to think that way.

He wasn't pretending to have a plan. He was just speaking his mind and using his position in the public eye to share his fire inside with the world.

I agree, to an extent.

I agree in that ressentiment can have its purposes.

If that much inequality, that much injustice, is in existence, then the ressentiment should build up to such an extent, become such a pressure cooker, such a pot boiling over, that it forces those issues to be dealt with by those in power.

At the same time, though, sometimes the "solutions" offered (i.e., extremely high taxation, eliminating profit, etc) are such complete and total crap that, really, the effect of taking those actions in order to appease that ressentiment would actually end up being worse off for the system as a whole (including, likely, in the end, those with the ressentiment).

Not all inequality and not all injustice can feasibly be eliminated, and, at least with inequality, not all of it necessarily even should.

(That being said, I do find the trend of increased inequality since the early 70s in America to be problematic.)

(And universal healthcare is one prong amongst several [not all appeasing the same side of the equation - some go in the "opposite" direction, in order to increase competitiveness, and thus our economy/employment] that can be enacted to remedy our problems.)
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,567
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Meh.

He comes off as a know-nothing.

Lots of emotion, very little knowledge.

"I'M PISSED OFF ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE. I'M PISSED OFF ABOUT INEQUALITY. AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HELL TO DO ABOUT IT."

When people are that pissed off about something, but can't even offer a feasible alternative, they should not be listened to.

They don't know how the world works. They're just venting their ressentiment.

NFs are on this planet to champion causes and passionately spread the word to increase awareness so more handy and practical NTs, SJs and SPs can implement change and progress via innovation and reform. Not offering a feasible alternative doesn't necessarily mean we shouldn't listen to them, even if we don't always agree with them. We need passionate people to champion causes, even if they don't always offer facts and statistics so much as they do a passionate argument. ENFPs are humanity's cheerleaders, in a way. I mean that in a completely positive way and not in the stereotypically ditzy and shallow way we often associate with the word cheerleader.

It's true, many ENFPs are probably more informed and know more facts to back up his argument, but the fact that something gets him this emotionally fired up about something means he has every right to share that feeling with thw world, whether or not the world chooses to listen to him or shrug him off as another "childish" idealist ungrounded in reality.

I want to be an ENFP when I grow up, btw.
 

five sounds

MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247
Joined
Jul 17, 2013
Messages
5,393
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
729
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I agree with you both. And I can sympathize with him where he kind of stumbled in this argument too.

He was asked what his plan was, and that's when he started saying things that were kinda half-baked, vague, or otherwise bad ideas. But it's because he felt pressure to have those answers. It can be hard for ENFPs to come to terms with that I think, being candid about not being well equipped
in the way of having a solid plan, and being confident in the fact that that doesn't invalidate their opinion.

He should have never started talking about taxation policies. Like we've said, that isn't his strength and it can take away from the positive potential outcomes of his championing.
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,567
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Which is why I think ENFPs make better "vision leaders"

They can get people passionate about something, because ENFPs' passion can be very infectious. Their ability to get people motivated and amped about a cause or task at hand is one of their best strengths, in my opinion.

Just don't always expect them to know every little detail or have a solution immediately sketched out unless they've come prepared. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Obama might be ENFx. I'm not going to get political but I've noticed this in his leadership style. Sometimes in press conferences he stammers and takes time to process questions before he answers, leading and doesn't always have the most detailed or sketched out solution. I've noticed that he will then become very passionate and say something like, "look, I just want to make sure we can get insurance to as many people as possible..." or "I get letters every day from people like Ruth in Arkansas who lost her insurance when she got laid off and couldn't get new coverage because her diabetes was considered a preexisting condition yadda yadda etc"

You can tell healthcare and certain issues really burn a fire inside of him.

He typically leaves the details and planning to his cabinet, policy people, allies in congress, etc, so he can take the role of motivator and champion.

Just an observation
 

Triforce

New member
Joined
Aug 8, 2012
Messages
70
MBTI Type
INTJ
Being a flag bearer is a great honor.

One can have opinions without solutions. Usually when it happens to me, i get bound by my ethical ideals that i might have between my choices.

Im not really the type to go; "hey there are too many people on this planet, lets modernize Auswitch"

The interviewer was cool i thought. Nice voice.
 

PeaceBaby

reborn
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
5,950
MBTI Type
N/A
Enneagram
N/A
Like most of these types of interviews, the intent isn't to thoughtfully discuss a topic, it's a power play to see who can come out on top.

Russell Brand was in a position to BE trivialized, and frankly, I think he totally held his own - he succeeded in being himself, expressed himself with cogency, conviction and passion and wasn't bowed over by someone who could have potentially raked him over the coals for his lack of knowledge, experience and position.

And frankly, he is right in that the system is not working in an egalitarian way. The solutions are not readily apparent, but he deftly outlined why many people look at political process with such apathy.

It was great. Enjoyed that this morning. :)
 

PeaceBaby

reborn
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
5,950
MBTI Type
N/A
Enneagram
N/A
He wasn't pretending to have a plan. He was just speaking his mind and using his position in the public eye to share his fire inside with the world.

And you know, it's worth noting that people WANT that fire. Most people can't generate enough passion in their daily living to exceed the programming we're all supposed to live our lives by. His passion is catchy. People will love this, and if it's not already, this clip will be sure to circulate in social media circles for a spell.
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,567
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Russell Brand was in a position to BE trivialized, and frankly, I think he totally held his own - he succeeded in being himself, expressed himself with cogency, conviction and passion and wasn't bowed over by someone who could have potentially raked him over the coals for his lack of knowledge, experience and position.

And frankly, he is right in that the system is not working in an egalitarian way. The solutions are not readily apparent, but he deftly outlined why many people look at political process with such apathy.

exactly. Just because he can't come up with an immediate solution doesn't mean he shouldn't draw attention to it.
 

Zarathustra

Let Go Of Your Team
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
8,110
[MENTION=19700]Lyedecker[/MENTION] [MENTION=18819]nicolita[/MENTION]

I don't really disagree with what either of you have said.

The problem, though, is that ENFPs can just as well get people fired up about something that is ultimately damaging to the system as a whole (see: Che Guevara and modern-day Cuba) because they don't really know what they're talking about, or why the current system is the way it is, and how their proposed changes (if they actually have any) would actually make the system worse (usually they seem very *unaware* of the adverse side effects of the policies they would endorse).

That being said, as I said before, they can have their place, even when misguided.

Sometimes the expression of populist frustration is necessary for the system to right itself.
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,567
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
You couldn't be more right, [MENTION=8413]Zarathustra[/MENTION]
 

five sounds

MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247
Joined
Jul 17, 2013
Messages
5,393
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
729
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
[MENTION=8413]Zarathustra[/MENTION], totally right. That's why they need those other types to balance them out. An unchecked ENFP on the loose can be a scary thing :laugh:
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,567
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Yeah. I think Hitler was an NF gone evil. Look at how he motivated and influenced people and got them fired up about doing generally naughty and shitty things. Bad eggs exist in every type.
 
Top