[NF] NFs - does your insight into people hinder your relationships?

[Riva]

I would imagine that insight into people would help develop, maintain and strengthen relationships. Infact if there is something I would wish for in any relationship it is insight into the other person. Something that should be noted is is that no one would like to have their vulnerabilities exposed/discovered. So it is best to not express your feelings on the vulnerabilities of others but use your insights to read, secretly empathize and not to step on toes.

Of course I could imagine that extremely deep insight into others would make you feel as if you are dealing with immaturities. Now this could hinder your need to interact, lose faith and leave you with feelings of frustration.

I totally disagree with what [MENTION=8936]highlander[/MENTION] had to say.

 

[skylights]

[MENTION=10496]skylights[/MENTION]

I can see how it could get perceived that way and I guess every type has some general downsides to it. For me, I rarely interact much with people (beyond surface) unless I know what to expect from them in response. Therefore, figuring out what's going on with them helps me know how to engage with them (or if I shouldn't) in an appropriate way.

On the other hand, I can also say that making Ni connections and figuring out the puzzle pieces to get a more complete picture is kind of satisfying. I think it is one of the factors that keeps teaching interesting for me. I'm interested in human systems and why people act/react as they do. I also like sleuthing out who is connected to each other, what interrelations there are between different families, connections to the community and so on.

I suppose for some people that may seem like it is making a game out of what certain people are dealing with, but for me, I feel like empathy on a deep personal level isn't possible or even desired sometimes in those kinds of situations. I have loads of sympathy though and am not afraid of getting my hands dirty helping in whatever way I can if I just have enough information to know what the child/family's needs are.

@ bold - yes, absolutely true. Sometimes empathy can complicate that kind of situation.

It sounds like you have found an arena to perfectly channel your combination of Ni understanding-seeking and Fe helping... so you can put your best talents to constructive humanistic use. That is really admirable.

 

[Grublet]

I have a friend (I italicized friend because he gets on my nerves so much that sometimes I question it) who I've diagnosed as an INTJ. He doesn't believe in personality classifications and likens them to astrological signs, cold readings, organized religion, et cetera. I've had so many arguments with him over the fact that he believes he expresses the functions of all temperaments equally when in reality I feel like I know him better than he knows himself. It creates a constant argument where I'm trying to question him about his personality or have him take a short test to get to know him better and he refuses because thinks it's all hogwash. All of this is what makes me think he's an INTJ, by the way; and just like the ENFP I am I can't stop talking to him even though nothing good comes of all this.

 

[Coriolis]

I think that sometimes you sharing your insight might actually have potential to deepen a relationship past the more superficial stages, esp if you are compassionate in sharing and correct when you voice your thoughts. That would be the crux I think. You would have to be right and deliver that at the perfect time and in the perfect way, or else risk the relationship shutting down. So the key would be to have the appropriate filter in place that prevented you from exposing what you think you know until you truly know it (and arguably, who really knows anything, eh?) Plus, possessing the wisdom to know who can handle that truth and who cannot.

Yes to all this, but the caveats about accuracy, timing, and compassion cannot be overstated. Done right, it is like manna in the desert, especially for someone who has a hard time figuring all this out, even about him/herself. Done wrong, which is far too easy to do, it will lead to an instant shutdown, followed by distrust of the other person.

 

[greenfairy]

It also seems that some INFJs do the sort of "I'm right about you...even if you disagree with me, I'm never wrong" sort of thing and honestly I think most human beings would find that terribly annoying.

I find this annoying.

But if someone is right about me and isn't a know it all about it, I really appreciate it.

In cases where I am tremendously close to the person and they are doing something destructive to the relationship and they won't give any insight into why they are doing what they are, I also have a tendancy to review all the possibilities and go with the most likely I can see (I'd prefer real info, but can't stand dealing with all the nebulous possibilities if I don't have it. I need some concrete way to pick an appropriate course of action and way of understanding the situation). I'm very open to being corrected, but of course have found that I'm often wrong about the motivations I think others have because I'm looking at it from what that behaviour would mean if I did it. If there's one thing I've learned from here, it's that the same behaviours may mean wildly different things depending on personality type. Of course no one likes to be analyzed and analyzed incorrectly! At the same time, I would only do that with people I have a lot invested in and in the absence of needful information which they cannot or will not give so I can either move on or know how to work the situation out productively.

TOTALLY relate to this paragraph. But this kind of lack of communication is one of the quickest ways to get on my bad side, unfortunately.

 

[mmhmm]

it used to, because i'd get so involved.
now not so much. i still get involved,
but treading slowly.

 

[greenfairy]

I can't agree more strongly, especially with the highlighted. It is why I am so distrustful of the impressions I get from how people behave. I know I cannot interpret their actions through the lens of my own motivations. It is reassuring to know that even Fs experience this concern sometimes.

Oh, I think they do just as often as Ts! It probably is various different functions popping out, depending on the personality type, that get everyone into trouble. For example, my Ni creates a million different possibilities for what could be motivating the person and then a million more different options for how to respond to their behaviour. I NEED to have some way to narrow down the options and so can't just let it be if I don't understand it (which I'm sure is very annoying to the person, particularly if they want to be left alone). Add Fe in there and it's only understanding the deeper reason to give context to their actions that helps me have any understanding or sympathy for what looks like poor behaviour or uncaring to me initially.

If someone does something I don't understand, I ask them about it. If they won't tell me I assume they don't care enough about me or our relationship to communicate with me. I'm hypersensitive about this, but total honesty is just what I require. So if someone doesn't feel comfortable talking about their motivations or feelings, they're not the person for me. Just telling me they will talk to me about it in the future but they need time to sort everything out is fine (as long as they follow through).

For me it feels like Si associating the current behavior with negative experiences from the past, Ni going crazy and thinking up every dreadful possibility, Fi taking things personally, and Fe being super concerned with reciprocity and reflection (and thus projecting).

One of my problems is that I unconsciously make negative assumptions sometimes and don't take the step of asking someone about something.

 

[greenfairy]

I actually think I am very good at this. I've never experienced a negative reaction from my insight into people (unless I've pushed people away and been oblivious to it). The people I'm close to say I'm a good listener and always seem to feel comfortable telling me personal things about themselves. I don't pry or ask them to tell me, either. In fact, often people tell me things I would rather not know. I just use my insight to better understand people, and by reading their emotional energy I can know how they feel about things and whether or not I should address them. I just behave according to my impressions. Like if I sense someone is insecure about something I'll subtly try to make them feel good about it, or I'll find a way to relate. Often in a completely nonverbal way. I do think I have some psychic impressions and knowledge about people, but I keep it to myself unless I know they want me to say it; I can see it in layers in their psyche- something deep with negative emotional energy around it I probably shouldn't directly address. Sometimes I tease people about things I notice, though. I can get along with pretty much anyone, and use my insight to have better relationships. I don't always feel the drive to get more intimate (aside from being sx/so); often I just like getting into people's heads; but that helps me speak a person's language and meet them on their level.

I love analyzing people, and looking into their psyches. I love psychology and any systematic way of studying people and how they work. I would pick people apart in the minutest way possible if I could. The ironic thing is that my mind goes all sorts of places it probably shouldn't, and if people knew that and how interested in studying people I am, I could never get away with it.

(I'm like an alien studying the human race, haha.)

 

[greenfairy]

Example: I'm getting close with someone who says he doesn't know what year he was born. I really want to know so I can do his astrological chart. (My intuition says the chart for one year fits him better than the other, but of course I can't know for sure.) I pointed out the discrepancy between him saying his birth certificate says 1983 and him saying he's 27, and why he would believe both at the same time. Then I realized that his childhood and circumstances surrounding the uncertainty of his birth certificate might be something he didn't want to talk about, so I said he didn't have to tell me because I respect his privacy. He did tell me some things anyway, and said the discrepancy was something he didn't really think about. Knowing this, I still won't pry into the nature of his childhood, but I feel I can ask general questions such as how did he go about age dependent things such as registering to vote and getting a driver's license, and why he thinks he is a year younger than what his birth certificate says. I might ask him a general question like did he have a fairy happy childhood because I think we're at a level where he could tell me. I'm really curious, because what he's told me is pretty bizarre.

 

[Coriolis]

I might ask him a general question like did he have a fairy happy childhood because I think we're at a level where he could tell me. I'm really curious, because what he's told me is pretty bizarre.

Freudian slip???

 

[greenfairy]

Freudian slip???

Lol, yes! I meant to say fairly.

 

[Lexicon]

I tend to keep a lot of the perceptions I have, regarding my understanding of a person, to myself, so *most* friends seem to take solace in the fact that I'm just mentally 'present' & even care to try to 'get' them, on some level. I realize being extremely straighfwd with one's observations is offputting, if not obnoxious. It sets off people's defenses because you're stomping on grounds they did not consciously give you permission to tread on. Depending on the person, they may find this a wonderful quality - to be understood easily - it makes them feel safe with you - but for others, or even just regarding certain information in a given scenario - it will cause people to clam up, naturally. We all do it, to some extent, or another. Patience, and covert ninja skills are key, when it comes to helping certain people feel safe, methinks. I try to remain observant, & mentally walk in tandem with the person, so they eventually, in some way or another, disclose this information, on their own.

 

[Ginkgo]

I think some people try not be known because they want to be seen as special (which, paradoxically, stems from a desire to be known in its own right).

In a few cases I've noticed this and it's been a detriment to establishing a relationship of trust once I tell an individual that I'm interested in psychological makeup. At this point, even candidly discussing my own problems seems to be further incriminating as some individuals see my own problems as the cause of my interest in psychological makeup (they have a good point, but are misguided in thinking that I objectify/manipulate them). There are times when I heavily consider abandoning cognitive psychology when I slip up by looking outward with it instead of inward; looking outward toward other people who you're personally tied to tends to cause all sorts of issues in expecting them to be something they're fundamentally not. Behavioral psychology seems to be much more fitting for looking outward, yet I would be just as well off abandoning it as well.

 

[highlander]

I would imagine that insight into people would help develop, maintain and strengthen relationships. Infact if there is something I would wish for in any relationship it is insight into the other person. Something that should be noted is is that no one would like to have their vulnerabilities exposed/discovered. So it is best to not express your feelings on the vulnerabilities of others but use your insights to read, secretly empathize and not to step on toes.

Of course I could imagine that extremely deep insight into others would make you feel as if you are dealing with immaturities. Now this could hinder your need to interact, lose faith and leave you with feelings of frustration.

I totally disagree with what [MENTION=8936]highlander[/MENTION] had to say.

I merely explained how it impacts me personally. This is what I said:

I'm not an NF obviously but if people can figure parts of me out and communicate those things one on one, I admire this.

Edit: Or at the very least, am intrigued.

You can't disagree with my statement as to how it affects me personally nor do I even understand how your statement above even fully supports that you disagree with me. Maybe you misread my post.

 

[ReflecTcelfeR]

Insight is not blindly stabbing and accidentally hitting a sore spot; part of insight is knowing that it is insight.

 

[Ginkgo]

Insight is not blindly stabbing and accidentally hitting a sore spot; part of insight is knowing that it is insight.

Yes.

 

[metalmommy]

Insight is not blindly stabbing and accidentally hitting a sore spot; part of insight is knowing that it is insight.

There's a big difference between blindly stabbing and seeing something without all the context. There are times when I can see someone has stuffed feelings about something, but I don't yet know why. Understanding is a process that is not always so easily negotiated. I don't need to blindly stab, nor would I. That seems to imply that I'm either seeking to hurt someone, or I don't know people at all. Neither is true.

 

[Thursday]

It frightens people. "Why is it that you get the scoop on everyone else, yet no one can have the same on you?" is what I've heard. I think what makes it most upsetting is that we can intuit and feel out things that were meant to be private, even things that they didn't know, with scant information, if any at all. After being around a highly attuned NF, you'll feel how the Wizard felt when his ruse was unveiled.

 

[Amargith]

It frightens people. "Why is it that you get the scoop on everyone else, yet no one can have the same on you?" is what I've heard. I think what makes it most upsetting is that we can intuit and feel out things that were meant to be private, even things that they didn't know, with scant information, if any at all. After being around a highly attuned NF, you'll feel how the Wizard felt when his ruse was unveiled.

This.

It took me a while to realize that others didnt *like* this, as I was hurt in turn that others *didnt* do this with me as to me, it was the most natural way to show understanding and love for the other person.

I imagine that it is kind of like how SFJs are capable of keeping track of everyone and keep everything organized and anticipate your needs, even when you don't necessarily *want* them to do so, and feel hurt when it is rejected as well as unloved when you do not at least occasionally attempt to repay the favour

It takes time to realize that the other doesn't love in the same way. And it takes even more time to come to terms with that emotionally.

 

[Betty Blue]

It does if we get to grass roots and the core is tainted, the facade peeled away reveals something less than attractive, ugly even. Most often my instincts are to fix but sometimes it is beyond my own capabilities.

There can be periods of confusion though, especially with unhealthy manipulative individuals, where you really want to believe them but your intuition rings out the death knell.

Maybe this can be a difficult time for sx doms especially as mourning has it's own process and sequence.

I'm a sucker for a sob story but will only help if i feel there is true regret and desire for change and i'm quite good as seeing through mirages, lawd knows, i've had plenty experience.


Sometimes though, and these are the moments i live for, the paint stripper reveals an original work of art...happy days.