• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[NF] The Dark Side of NF's

SilkRoad

Lay the coin on my tongue
Joined
May 26, 2009
Messages
3,932
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
6w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
I do this too. The problem is I think INFJ tends to not feeling too guilty of this because once then shun someone off, they can be easily blocked from our memory. I think it has to do with the high expectation and projecting it to people who are dear to us. One possible reason is that we tend to invest our entire trust to someone once s/he has passed our inner-judgment test, especially INFJ tend to have very small circle of friends. Being a conflict avoider doesn't help either. We kept collecting and holding grudges and perhaps the flaws that we've been accumulated from others could be seen as a point of no return.

I once remember that my friend commented on me that I tend to put people into three distinctive categories. Either I really like or hate someone, or the rest are all the same in the mid-zone. So she said it's quite easy for her (an ENFJ) to figure out how I felt toward someone based on my comment about people.

I hear that ENFJs do the thing as well (perhaps even more so than INFJs?) where they cut someone off and go from a lot of liking/love to a lot of dislike/hate. I don't think I have known many ENFJs IRL but I think I have seen some of that in action. I think ENFJs and I have many similar feelings inside, but I like the fact that they express theirs more openly and passionately. ;)

I think it is a kind of self-protection, though probably an unhealthy form. If I still feel as though I like or love the person, I would still want them actively in my life and sometimes for one reason or another that's impossible. It's a way of detaching and moving on. Unfortunately I don't handle well the idea of keeping the good memories although the friendship or relationship didn't work out. It's too painful. So, the dislike/hate becomes a waystation on the way to eventual indifference, which is also kind of sad, but ultimately it feels like blessed relief.
 
0

011235813

Guest
I think it's possible for very upset or imbalanced NFs to have an almost complete ethical breakdown but still retain empathic abilities, so they know exactly what to say to break people but don't feel even a shred of remorse doing it.
 

HighwayChild

New member
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Messages
122
Enneagram
4w5
My unhealthy side in a nutshell. Exactly.

I too could relate if I weren't self aware enough to lift my head up and improve.
If one continues to spiral down an unhealthy path, one could turn into a walking contradiction. Completely self-loathing yet maintain a self absorbed God Complex all at once. Loneliness is then your best friend and your worst enemy. It's a vicious circle.
 

Istbkleta

New member
Joined
Jun 11, 2011
Messages
452
MBTI Type
ISFP
Enneagram
2
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
From my POV:

Fi: judge people (a terrible sin in my book), unreliable (can stick a knife in my back any time), selfish, feels like talking to a wall when they decide they "know" something about me, lie through their teeth.

Fe: controlling, manipulative, think they are better than me as a human (roll eyes), emotionally draining and damaging when using emotional blackmail, like to be martyrs (IxFJ) or lead the way (ExFJ).


Both lie a lot but in a different way and for different reasons. I understand FJs better than NFs (I am tertiary Fe).


Edit: Forgot to mention the inability to take constructive criticism for Fi :)
I hope you don't hate me for it.
 

OrangeAppled

Sugar Hiccup
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Messages
7,626
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Meh, I'm not manipulative. I admit I tend to associate that with Fe & Se types.

Whatever dark side I have involves a withdrawing from people to the point where I don't care about affecting them, good or bad. Manipulation means you want to affect people & achieve something. The closest I may get is spite, where I say something I know will hit a soft spot with someone. I guess sussing out achilles heels for people is a dark side, but instead of sneaky manipulation, I'll toss it in their face outright. The only motive is to make them feel bad, not to achieve anything for myself (well, except that sick satisfaction, which is never very satisfying in reality). I suppose this is inferior Te stuff because it's being hyper critical & blunt & disregarding other people (being uncharacteristically impersonal in regards to my thinking). So tearing people down verbally & knowing where to hit them is the dark side I probably have.

I can see NFs going bad with a misdirected moral high horse too. That's where you get revolutionary types with crazy ideas & methods.
 

Cloud of Thunder

New member
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Messages
571
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
I too could relate if I weren't self aware enough to lift my head up and improve.
If one continues to spiral down an unhealthy path, one could turn into a walking contradiction. Completely self-loathing yet maintain a self absorbed God Complex all at once. Loneliness is then your best friend and your worst enemy. It's a vicious circle.
Yes.
 

Southern Kross

Away with the fairies
Joined
Dec 22, 2008
Messages
2,910
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
so/sp
Meh, I'm not manipulative. I admit I tend to associate that with Fe & Se types.

Whatever dark side I have involves a withdrawing from people to the point where I don't care about affecting them, good or bad. Manipulation means you want to affect people & achieve something. The closest I may get is spite, where I say something I know will hit a soft spot with someone. I guess sussing out achilles heels for people is a dark side, but instead of sneaky manipulation, I'll toss it in their face outright. The only motive is to make them feel bad, not to achieve anything for myself (well, except that sick satisfaction, which is never very satisfying in reality). I suppose this is inferior Te stuff because it's being hyper critical & blunt & disregarding other people (being uncharacteristically impersonal in regards to my thinking). So tearing people down verbally & knowing where to hit them is the dark side I probably have.

I can see NFs going bad with a misdirected moral high horse too. That's where you get revolutionary types with crazy ideas & methods.
:yes: I very much agree with this (especially the bolded). I don't do underhand manipulation, I will go for the brazen, outright guilt trip. :D

I suppose my other unpleasant behviour I occasionally indulge in, includes:
- a selfish, self-righteous, arrogant, "I'm so frickin' superior to these idiots" attitude. Generally being a know-it-all
- give the silent treatment or go into a cold civility mode when around someone in order to punish them.
- being super nit-picky and generally obsessed with everything being correct
- being highly critical, judgmental and unsympathetic under certain circumstances (although I'm very tolerant and caring in general)
- being stubbornly non-committal about what I want, think or feel at times (which can seriously drive people crazy)
 

Tiltyred

New member
Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
4,322
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
468
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I think it's possible for very upset or imbalanced NFs to have an almost complete ethical breakdown but still retain empathic abilities, so they know exactly what to say to break people but don't feel even a shred of remorse doing it.

How do you know they don't feel sorry later? Just curious.
 

Luv Deluxe

Step into my office.
Joined
Jun 25, 2011
Messages
441
MBTI Type
NiSe
Enneagram
7w6
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Those INFs and their martyr complexes, hehe. I think ISFJs can often have it too - just in a less... N way, if that makes sense. In a less grandiose, I'm gonna die for my beliefs, manner. Maybe. But I do think it would be more of a defining characteristic for NFs than most other types.

My significant other is an ISFJ, and I'd say he does have a bit of a "martyr complex." But it's in a more practical way, such as...he'd do anything to protect his loved ones and his security. NFs care deeply for their loved ones, too, but they'd also be more inclined than most to die for an idea, I think.

Also, I'm not trying to glorify an identification with Rorschach by any means (in case it came off that way). I've just noticed the similarities when I'm at my worst. I really do try to be a strong person and improve upon moments like that.
 

CrystalViolet

lab rat extraordinaire
Joined
Oct 24, 2008
Messages
2,152
MBTI Type
XNFP
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I just take surprisingly effective pot shots, or freeze people out completely......occasionally take the moral high road, it passes though...some times. Oh and stubborn.
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
:yes: I very much agree with this (especially the bolded). I don't do underhand manipulation, I will go for the brazen, outright guilt trip. :D

Funny - I thought guilt-tripping was more of a FJ tactic, like the stereotypical ESFJ Jewish mother... :thinking:
 

Southern Kross

Away with the fairies
Joined
Dec 22, 2008
Messages
2,910
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
so/sp
Funny - I thought guilt-tripping was more of a FJ tactic, like the stereotypical ESFJ Jewish mother... :thinking:
Not sure. :shrug: :)

Like OA said, It's rarely for my own benefit. It's more like, "what's wrong with you? Think of the starving children in Africa!", which is the sort of thing I pull, say to make my Mum buy Fair trade tea and coffee. Another example is when people say they are opposed to gay marriage I say, "Oh, so you don't believe in equality then?". I do that because I know they do believe in equality but I'm trying to put things in perspective, albeit in a rather obnoxious way.

I admit, I can be a moral bully on occasion. :whistling:
 

Cloud of Thunder

New member
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Messages
571
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
I wonder if INFJs, more than any other NF, have a sense of being right all the time, not just morally but even logically?
 

AphroditeGoneAwry

failure to thrive
Joined
Feb 20, 2009
Messages
5,585
MBTI Type
INfj
Enneagram
451
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I wonder if INFJs, more than any other NF, have a sense of being right all the time, not just morally but even logically?


Guilty as charged. But I am pretty open to another being right if they present a more logical or reasonable explanation. Ni doms usually are fairly receptive to changing their minds (infj more than intj), versus Te doms, for example. Formulating opinions and judgments does take a while, however, as Te and Fe continue to bring fodder home for Ni to process to find The Answer. :laugh: Our 'stubbornness' comes in (as some of the most stubborn types) because I think once Ni has locked into an idea, it gets comfortable with it, and to change it takes a lot of evidence to the contrary. This might even be more true with Si. :thinking:

Why do you ask?
 

CuriousFeeling

From the Undertow
Joined
Dec 18, 2009
Messages
2,937
MBTI Type
INfJ
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
I wonder if INFJs, more than any other NF, have a sense of being right all the time, not just morally but even logically?

I must admit, one of my professors pointed this out to me in a lecture. :unsure: :laugh: Logically speaking... yes, I get like this regarding concepts that I know quite well and get quite stubborn that the concept I have of the concept is correct. It's like "No wait, this is how it goes!" In class I would end up asking my teachers and professors if my train of thought was right to confirm that my train of thought indeed was correct. :laugh: I just wanted to have the correct answer every time I was called on.
 

Lily flower

New member
Joined
Jun 28, 2010
Messages
930
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
2
My boyfriends in college frequently complained that I "made" them do things, when I didn't think I was trying to make them do anything at all. That's still a mystery to me, because apparently I was being manipulative without trying.

I have also been accused of pulling people's secrets out of them when all I thought I was doing was being a good listener.
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
I wonder if INFJs, more than any other NF, have a sense of being right all the time, not just morally but even logically?

Considering they have Ti as their tertiary function, it wouldn't surprise me. They are also commonly Enneatype Ones and sometimes Fives, who can be quite intellectually contentious.
 
Top