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[ENFP] ENFPs and personality

OrangeAppled

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I dunno. I agree that they don't flux in the emotional sense like we do, but I've seen ENTP's be extremely contradictory in their roles. I knew one ENTP that went from going to school as a philosophy major, really liberal and soft-science focused, to joining the army, to getting kicked out of the army for selling ecstacy where he was stationed, to developing a drug addiction, to getting drug treatment and joining up with a strong organized religion, all in about 18 months. Ofcourse this can be attributed to being young, or directionless, or addicted to drugs.. but it's definately not the first ENTP I've seen flip sides dramatically. *shrugs*

Agreed.

Fickleness is associated with Ne. Jung notes it, as do most MBTI authors. Pursuing new ideas, discarding old perspectives, etc, is very N in general, and with Ne types this is often visible in their behavior (with Ni types, it tends to be more internal).

I have no idea what empathy is supposed to do with this either....
 

Lady_X

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i feel like i get what he means with the empathy angle...but it's both i think...we relate deeply or empathize with who they are and it inspires us in new and different ways...haha just kidding...i have no idea what i'm talking about.
 

OrangeAppled

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i feel like i get what he means with the empathy angle...but it's both i think...we relate deeply or empathize with who they are and it inspires us in new and different ways...haha just kidding...i have no idea what i'm talking about.

Yes I see what you mean....but I still see the inspiration here as more of a Ne thing, which makes it equally applicable to ENTPs. I have seen ENTPs latch onto someone else's idea & run with it, basically being inspired by someone else. There may be more of a personal, Fi aspect to the way ENFPs do it that seems like empathy I guess.
 

Elfboy

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Yes I see what you mean....but I still see the inspiration here as more of a Ne thing, which makes it equally applicable to ENTPs. I have seen ENTPs latch onto someone else's idea & run with it, basically being inspired by someone else. There may be more of a personal, Fi aspect to the way ENFPs do it that seems like empathy I guess.

no, inspiration in this instance is more of an Fi thing
 

Lady_X

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Yes I see what you mean....but I still see the inspiration here as more of a Ne thing, which makes it equally applicable to ENTPs. I have seen ENTPs latch onto someone else's idea & run with it, basically being inspired by someone else. There may be more of a personal, Fi aspect to the way ENFPs do it that seems like empathy I guess.

sure yeah...i can see how we just sort of flow with it. both types are probably good at getting on someones level very quickly...probably why entps are considered to be so charming and i notice it in myself too at work as a photographer...people feel at ease with me quickly...doesn't matter who they are...maybe that is easier for me as a ne dom.
 

Elfboy

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sure yeah...i can see how we just sort of flow with it. both types are probably good at getting on someones level very quickly...probably why entps are considered to be so charming and i notice it in myself too at work as a photographer...people feel at ease with me quickly...doesn't matter who they are...maybe that is easier for me as a ne dom.

no, that's easier for you as a 7w6 :yes:
 

Santosha

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i feel like i get what he means with the empathy angle...but it's both i think...we relate deeply or empathize with who they are and it inspires us in new and different ways...haha just kidding...i have no idea what i'm talking about.

No, I believe your on to something. I wanted INTP to elaborate to be sure. There are certainly times when I take in emotions around me and it definately affects my behavior. If I am with a group of really excited, adventurous, positive thinking people (like I wish I could be always haha) I too become MORE excited, adventurous, and positive thinking. If I am with a group of intellectual bad-ass skeptics sitting at a coffee house talking about Chomsky or something, I too can play down the emotional excitability and become detached, more logical, critical, and deep thinking. If I sit down to do a a collage while watching eternal sunshine of the spotless mind, or worse- the salton sea.. I can get into a deep, introspective, dark funk.

so i see where your going with it.. Fi probably weighs in a bit.. but not entirely, and certainly not ONLY on an empathetic level. It seems to be more mind-centered with elements of feeling.

again, this is just my take as well. I could be really off-base.
 
A

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My understanding of the Fi/Fe attitudes is slightly different than what was described. Introverted feeling leans towards a sympathetic attitude (ENFP) and extraverted feeling leans towards an empathetic attitude (ENTP).

Example: I understand how terrible you feel about your crummy boss [empathy], but I have no sympathy for you. Logically, you have the power to change your crap situation. That means you're probably not going to hear many coddling words from an ENTP (not seriously); like,
"awwww, you poor thing, let it all out.. that jerk" [sympathy]. That's an Fi attitude.

Here's a brief explanation on the difference between empathy and sympathy that I posted awhile back:

They differ in emotional meaning:

  • Empathy when one has "been there" and sympathy when one hasn't.
  • Empathy is actually sharing another's suffering [Fe], while sympathy is a feeling of recognition of another's suffering [Fi].
  • Empathy is putting yourself in someone else's shoes to feel what they're feeling [Fe] and sympathy is the ability to support the emotions of another person with compassion [Fi].
One can empathize, but not sympathize:
One might empathize with someone that hates their job, but not be sympathetic towards that person because they logically conclude that person has the power to change their situation.

One can empathize and sympathize:
One feels sympathy towards someone that loses a loved one and also feel empathy, if they too have lost a loved one.

To answer your question, I think empathy is more highly regarded because it's more personal. It's truly connecting with someone and gaining an unspoken understanding. Then and only then can you really inspire or appropriately help someone. And yes, even sympathize. In my opinion.
 

Starry

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My understanding of the Fi/Fe attitudes is slightly different than what was described. Introverted feeling leans towards a sympathetic attitude (ENFP) and extraverted feeling leans towards an empathetic attitude (ENTP).

Example: I understand how terrible you feel about your crummy boss [empathy], but I have no sympathy for you. Logically, you have the power to change your crap situation. That means you're probably not going to hear coddling words from an ENTP; like,
"awwww, you poor thing, let it all out.. that jerk" [sympathy]. That's the Fi attitude.

Here's a brief explanation on the difference between empathy and sympathy that I posted awhile back:

Something about this definition makes Fi seem rather superficial. But maybe that's just me.
 

Lady_X

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i can't really separate the two...i wouldn't be sympathetic if i didn't care....and i care by empathizing...i think i feel how your feeling...or i project how i would feel in the same situation or i just take what i know of you and how you feel about things and imagine how i would feel if such things made me feel that way..i then might be loving and nurturing or protective or whatever...maybe thats sympathy...i don't know..
 

Starry

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i can't really separate the two...i wouldn't be sympathetic if i didn't care....and i care by empathizing...i think i feel how your feeling...or i project how i would feel in the same situation or i just take what i know of you and how you feel about things and imagine how i would feel if such things made me feel that way..i then might be loving and nurturing or protective or whatever...maybe thats sympathy...i don't know..

I know how unhealthy this is...but I often OVER-empathize with other individuals or groups of individuals to the point I get sick with heartbreak and sorrow. I'm working on it.
 

Starry

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I know how unhealthy this is...but I often OVER-empathize with other individuals or groups of individuals to the point I get sick with heartbreak and sorrow. I'm working on it.

Oh whoops...I should say that I am not sympathizing from 'a far'...but I put myself right there...in their shoes. I participated in a really good thread on this same subject started by SilkRoad.
 

OrangeAppled

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My understanding of the Fi/Fe attitudes is slightly different than what was described. Introverted feeling leans towards a sympathetic attitude (ENFP) and extraverted feeling leans towards an empathetic attitude (ENTP).

Example: I understand how terrible you feel about your crummy boss [empathy], but I have no sympathy for you. Logically, you have the power to change your crap situation. That means you're probably not going to hear many coddling words from an ENTP (not seriously); like,
"awwww, you poor thing, let it all out.. that jerk" [sympathy]. That's an Fi attitude.

Here's a brief explanation on the difference between empathy and sympathy that I posted awhile back:

There have been long Fi/Fe thread battles over this one... I really don't think Fi nor Fe has a monopoly on either empathy or sympathy. Usually the reverse is implied by people though...

Personally, I am more inclined to empathize than sympathize. I easily imagine another's pain, even if I have never experienced it myself, but I'm less inclined to offer sympathetic words because I feel awkward. Often this simply becomes info I file away to refine my understanding of human nature & by extension my ideals.

I'm not sure if Fi in the aux position is quite the same...it seems they are more open to having their feelings affected by others, due to being Ne-dom.
And I'd think your experience of Fe in the tertiary is likely not to sound familiar to an FJ, who probably would more readily identify as empathetic and sympathetic.

This definition of empathy is more pertinent to what I mean:
the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.
It doesn't require the person to have first-hand experience. I've heard other Fi-dom say (and I can relate) that it feels as if you simulate a person in your head, and experience something close to as they would, so that you know their feeling vividly, but this also does NOT affect your own feelings (both rational & emotional).

Jung also actually says that Fi is shut off from appropriate forms of sympathy, due to its intense & self-protective nature & requiring accurate/authentic modes of expression, and as such it often comes out in extravagant, unrelated forms unexpectedly or in secretive, private forms, like poetry, art or religious activity.


From Jung's Psychological Types, under The Introverted Feeling Type:
Jung said:
...their feelings are intensive rather than extensive. They develop in depth. While an extensive feeling of sympathy [Fe] can express itself in appropriate words and deeds, and thus quickly gets back to normal again, an intensive sympathy [Fi], being shut off from every means of expression, gains a passionate depth.....It may, perhaps, break out in some extravagant form, leading to some astounding act of an almost heroic character.... To the outside world, or to the blind eyes of the extravert, this intensive sympathy looks like coldness, because it usually does nothing visible, and an extraverted consciousness is unable to believe in invisible forces.
 

Starry

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There have been long Fi/Fe thread battles over this one... I really don't think Fi nor Fe has a monopoly on either empathy or sympathy. Usually the reverse is implied by people though...

Personally, I am more inclined to empathize than sympathize. I easily imagine another's pain, even if I have never experienced it myself, but I'm less inclined to offer sympathetic words because I feel awkward. Often this simply becomes info I file away to refine my understanding of human nature & by extension my ideals.

I'm not sure if Fi in the aux position is quite the same...it seems they are more open to having their feelings affected by others, due to being Ne-dom.
And I'd think your experience of Fe in the tertiary is likely not to sound familiar to an FJ, who probably would more readily identify as empathetic and sympathetic.

This definition of empathy is more pertinent to what I mean:
the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.
It doesn't require the person to have first-hand experience. I've heard other Fi-dom say (and I can relate) that it feels as if you simulate a person in your head, and experience something close to as they would, so that you know their feeling vividly, but this also does NOT affect your own feelings (both rational & emotional).

Jung also actually says that Fi is shut off from appropriate forms of sympathy, due to its intense & self-protective nature & requiring accurate/authentic modes of expression, and as such it often comes out in extravagant, unrelated forms unexpectedly or in secretive, private forms, like poetry, art or religious activity.


From Jung's Psychological Types, under The Introverted Feeling Type:

AWESOME post.
 

INTP

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I disagree. I find that ENTP's can also also be extremely dynamic. I think this is more Ne - P in general. Anyone can have strong empathy (thought you see it with feelers) . It seems that either Ne dom with poorly developed aux function seems to shift and change dramatically. This is because they are anchoring them to only the external moment or stimuli without weighing it up with fi or ti. Explain why your attributing this to emapthy, cause I'm not following....


ENFPs has alot
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_neuron
 

animenagai

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I'm not sure that there's more sides to an ENFP, it's just more obvious that we're acting differently because of our extreme expressiveness.
 

Lady_X

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oooh good point...were just bouncier than most when were happy and i don't know about you guys but people cannot deal with seeing me sad at all either...apparently...the contrast is too much..or something....and then when we're pissed that's kinda...um..very expressive too. so yeah...just very expressive..good point.
 
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