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[MBTI General] Why I hate INFs

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
7,756
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
it's never really been proven than when it comes to things like voting and recycling that my part makes a difference.

ENTP

make use of that Ti, bucko.

1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+[...]= a big difference

methinks you are making excuses because you do not have enough interest to do these things, which is not the INFs' fault. and/or are conflicted, i am definitely too conflicted to vote sometimes. blame Ne for zooming out too far.

really basically i share your sentiment.
 

OrangeAppled

Sugar Hiccup
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Messages
7,626
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
I've decided other people's guilt is their problem.

For example, I don't cuss much. It's not a moral issue so much as I just don't; I am not in the habit, nor do I care to be. In person, such as at a work place, people around me will note that I do not cuss much, & then they will alter their own speech, cussing less. I never made that request nor did I indicate their cussing bothered me in anyway. I'm simply being who I am, and they've decided to assign moral significance to it, take it upon themselves to feel "bad", and then adjust their behavior to follow my "example" so they can feel "good"; but then they resent me for this supposed "guilt" & "higher standard" that they had to make changes to meet. To me, my behavior is triggering standards from their own conscience, not pushing my standards on them. That's what my heavy uses of quotes here is indicating: this is their view of the situation.

I am not going to lower my standards or alter my behavior that is "good" to make someone else feel better about themselves. And I don't say this in relation to the cussing example (as I don't see it as some big moral issue), but just in general. Their guilt is their problem.


EDIT: A flipside of this is that people sometimes make me feel like I am too serious or uptight for caring & thinking about certain things & making an effort in regards to them. They are too cool to care, too focused on fun to think deeply, and my caring & thinking just makes me a nerd. I too feel a sense of shame, more along the lines of sheepishness than guilt though. But that's my feeling & my problem. I'm overvaluing their viewpoint, as if "cool" matters more, or I'm assuming they are placing judgment when they are not.
 

Inverness

New member
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
99
MBTI Type
INFJ
I've decided other people's guilt is their problem.

For example, I don't cuss much. It's not a moral issue so much as I just don't; I am not in the habit, nor do I care to be. In person, such as at a work place, people around me will note that I do not cuss much, & then they will alter their own speech, cussing less. I never made that request nor did I indicate their cussing bothered me in anyway. I'm simply being who I am, and they've decided to assign moral significance to it, take it upon themselves to feel "bad", and then adjust their behavior to follow my "example" so they can feel "good"; but then they resent me for this supposed "guilt" & "higher standard" that they had to make changes to meet. To me, my behavior is triggering standards from their own conscience, not pushing my standards on them. .

X^2

I have had this come up in conversation a handful of times, and you've put words to it most effectively. In my 'decision' to not curse, I am not attempting to be 'holier than thou' or create such a façade, it's kind of just how I am ... and my internal response seems to mirror your's: sorry, it's not my problem.
 

Rail Tracer

Freaking Ratchet
Joined
Jun 29, 2010
Messages
3,031
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I've decided other people's guilt is their problem.

For example, I don't cuss much. It's not a moral issue so much as I just don't; I am not in the habit, nor do I care to be. In person, such as at a work place, people around me will note that I do not cuss much, & then they will alter their own speech, cussing less. I never made that request nor did I indicate their cussing bothered me in anyway. I'm simply being who I am, and they've decided to assign moral significance to it, take it upon themselves to feel "bad", and then adjust their behavior to follow my "example" so they can feel "good"; but then they resent me for this supposed "guilt" & "higher standard" that they had to make changes to meet. To me, my behavior is triggering standards from their own conscience, not pushing my standards on them. That's what my heavy uses of quotes here is indicating: this is their view of the situation.

I am not going to lower my standards or alter my behavior that is "good" to make someone else feel better about themselves. And I don't say this in relation to the cussing example (as I don't see it as some big moral issue), but just in general. Their guilt is their problem.

For every little gesture that I do, someone else is bound to notice. Both the "good," the "bad," and everything in-between. Every little gesture that I do can be contagious - it can be felt not just by me, but by those around me, even if it is something "simple."

I don't curse as much as other people do, not because I think I am better than people that do curse, I just don't feel a need to curse. I don't open doors for people behind me just because I think I need to, I do it because...well these people are just a few walks behind me. I don't care if you are a women, a man, or a person that is disable. I don't do things because I feel sorry for people, I do things just because it could very well brighten someone's day even if it was just a little. If it made someone feel bad, it was really unintended for. What I do can sometimes mean other people will begin mirroring it (the "good," the "bad," and everything in-between,) not for my sake, but their own.

There is more to it than meets the eye in why I act this way (where things begin getting a little personal,) but it is the gist of it.

I strive for the unofficial name that was given to me as a kid, never approaching it, but getting closer ever-so slightly to it.
 

OrangeAppled

Sugar Hiccup
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
Messages
7,626
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
:solidarity:

Everybody's talking all this stuff about me
Why don't they just let me live?
I don't need permission
Make my own decisions
That's my prerogative

They say I'm moral
I really don't care
That's my prerogative
They say I'm uptight
but I don't give a damn
Being good is how I live


Some ask me questions:
why am I so real?
But they don't understand me
I really don't know the deal
about these others
Trying hard to make it right
When not long ago
they did not see the point


sing!


It's my prerogative

It's the way that I wanna live
(It's my prerogative)
I can do just what I feel
(It's my prerogative)
No one can tell me what to do
(It's my prerogative)
'Cause what I'm doing...
I'm doing for you!

Don't get me wrong
I'm really not angelic
Ego trips is not my thing
All these strange accusations
Really get me down
I see nothing wrong in
recycling the cans I've found


It's my prerogative
I can do what I wanna do
(It's my prerogative)
I can live my life
(It's my prerogative)
And I'm doing it just for you

Tell me, tell me
Why can't I live my life?
Without all of the things
That people say

Everybody's talking all this stuff about me
Why don't they just let me live?
I don't need permission
Make my own decisions
That's my prerogative

[YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cDLZqe735k"]My Prerogative[/YOUTUBE]
 

Nijntje

Warflower
Joined
Jun 7, 2009
Messages
3,130
MBTI Type
CRZY
Enneagram
4w5
^^^^^^^^^

Dear god i love you so hard for this.

:D :D :D :D :D
 

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
7,756
MBTI Type
INFP
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6w7
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so/sx
I think both INFJ and INTJ male do this to people they care. But it seems ENFPs usually appreciate more from INTJs rather than INFJs. I wonder if that has to do with the "way" they deliver their messages?

I've always been curious about this.

yeah. i think like marm said, it's mostly got to do with the aux Fe clashing with aux Fi. when an INTJ tells me off it usually makes sense... even if it's like, well that's really stupid, do this instead, it doesn't feel pejorative, because he's correcting the impersonal logic, which i feel is quite separate from me. whereas NFJs tend to correct my personal behavior - like how i interact with others - which i feel is very much a part of me, so that feels like my toes being stepped on.

So some women don't like having to stare at themselves while some do?

i dated an INFP once, it was like having an elementary school boyfriend. not in the sense that he was immature, but our relationship was. it wasn't tension and fire, it was just like two little kids playing and giggling. which is nice, but... not enough.

i also dated an ENFP briefly, which was, in retrospect, a terrible idea. (not that i knew a thing about type back then, though.) that our enneatypes were different was the saving grace, but really many of our flaws were so similar that i couldn't handle twice my own issues.

on the other hand, i tend to loooove ENFJs. :wubbie:

I wonder what ENFP women think about ENFP and ENTP men :).

ENFP men: :girlfight:
ENTP men: :dalek:

yeah basically. i do like ENTPs. they're usually quite attractive. i don't know how the interactions would work out though, i'd be curious to see. i have an ENTP cousin, that's basically how i feel about the type in general. they're "cousins". same family but a little different. i don't know if we'd end up being too "close" for comfort, type-match wise.
 

Xenon

(blankpages)
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
832
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5
I highly resent this because it's never really been proven than when it comes to things like voting and recycling that my part makes a difference. And yet I think this is the type who would always go the extra mile to separate out your aluminum from your glass.

You can't complain about INFs because it makes you look like an insensitive a--hole and people gang up on you, yet INFs get free reign to guilt-trip you about menial things which don't really matter.

INFs themselves don't usually always stick to healthy lifestyles and do not take care of themselves, so a responsible person who takes care of what matters in life (like their health) is guilt-tripped. What's up with this?

I'm thinking if you truly believed the things these people care about are "menial", then you wouldn't be at all susceptible to feeling guilty about them. If you really think voting and recycling are worthless, then you wouldn't be bothered by people who do consider these activities important. If you really felt that sticking to a healthy lifestyle is "what matters", and that this is far more important than silly old social responsibility or whatever it is that the INF people you know care about, you would take pride in your own choices and values and brush off their objections. The fact that it bothers you enough to start a thread complaining about how they make you feel bad suggests to me that you have your own niggling doubts about your choices.

And I'm not saying you have to make the same choices they do. I don't always vote, etc. But you can either decide they're right and make more of an effort, or decide it isn't important enough to worry about and...not worry about it.

Kind of what OrangeAppled was talking about. The guilt is yours. It comes from you. Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent, yada yada yada.
 

Sizzling Berry

New member
Joined
Apr 5, 2009
Messages
185
MBTI Type
INFP
INFs always make me feel bad about who I am because they are always concerned for people's wellbeing and contributing to the cause of humanity.

If somebody rubs you the wrong way, why not avoid them? :devil:
 
Joined
Mar 27, 2011
Messages
150
MBTI Type
INFP
As I just posted in a thread I created, you are you, and being an ENTP does not mean you can't have humanitarian tendencies or a positive impact on society. Whether or not you are a good person doesn't stem from personality test or the categories they place you in, but rather your own decisions and framework of mind. As an INFP, I can say that, while I do see myself as an understanding and empathic person, I am by no means perfect or one of those "lovable humanitarians" everyone just loves. If anything, my Fi makes me spend too much time reflecting upon my own values and what is impotant for me and how to better improve myself than spend time interconnecting others in the outer world. What you described above, if anything, would better fit an ExFJ stereotype if anything.

In the end, however, you are your own person, and so you shouldn't envy INFPs or INFJs for all those positive qualities Myers-briggs lists for them. I am pretty sure you have much to offer society yourself, but just have to set your mind to it.

No one can make you feel inferior or worthless without your consent.
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
I'm thinking if you truly believed the things these people care about are "menial", then you wouldn't be at all susceptible to feeling guilty about them. If you really think voting and recycling are worthless, then you wouldn't be bothered by people who do consider these activities important. If you really felt that sticking to a healthy lifestyle is "what matters", and that this is far more important than silly old social responsibility or whatever it is that the INF people you know care about, you would take pride in your own choices and values and brush off their objections. The fact that it bothers you enough to start a thread complaining about how they make you feel bad suggests to me that you have your own niggling doubts about your choices.

And I'm not saying you have to make the same choices they do. I don't always vote, etc. But you can either decide they're right and make more of an effort, or decide it isn't important enough to worry about and...not worry about it.

Kind of what OrangeAppled was talking about. The guilt is yours. It comes from you. Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent, yada yada yada.

I do wonder - can an INFx feel guilty about stuff other INFxs do? Is that common? :thinking:
 

Xenon

(blankpages)
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
832
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5
I do wonder - can an INFx feel guilty about stuff other INFxs do? Is that common? :thinking:

I don't see why not. It's a pretty natural reaction if someone's taking a strong stand on something you're doing or not doing, and it seems they might have a point.

I'd think if an INF does encounter this, s/he'd be less likely to sweep it under the rug, or rationalize it away, or get annoyed at the person for being self-righteous. They'd want to consider it and decide how important it is and where it fits into their lives and their value system. And perhaps mature INFs have gone through this process so much already that they've already done this with most issues, so when something like this comes up they've already given it the consideration it needs and made a decision on it, and so don't get uncomfortable over it. All speculation, btw.
 
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011235813

Guest
I do wonder - can an INFx feel guilty about stuff other INFxs do? Is that common? :thinking:

I'm not sure what you mean here, Viridian. Do you mean feeling guilt or shame on someone else's behalf when they do something wrong, or feeling guilty about the same things other people feel guilty about?
 

Viridian

New member
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Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
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IsFJ
I'm not sure what you mean here, Viridian. Do you mean feeling guilt or shame on someone else's behalf when they do something wrong, or feeling guilty about the same things other people feel guilty about?

I meant more along the lines of the original post - feeling ashamed or guilty because of people who are more ethical, genuine, passionate, etc., than you... blankpages suggested that INFxs generally value those characteristics, so I imagined that they might feel more envious of others who possessed them in abundance... Does that make more sense now?
 
0

011235813

Guest
I meant more along the lines of the original post - feeling ashamed or guilty because of people who are more ethical, genuine, passionate, etc., than you... blankpages suggested that INFxs generally value those characteristics, so I imagined that they might feel more envious of others who possessed them in abundance... Does that make more sense now?

My guilt typically arises out of an inability to meet my expectations of myself. Is this exacerbated on looking at people who have succeeded where I have failed? Yes, but the core issue is still the failure to live up to my own standards.

I try not to compare myself to others too frequently. Yes, other people have a lot of qualities that I wish I possessed, but I've learned that I'm far happier taking pleasure in my talents than dwelling on my shortcomings, so I try to do that to the best of my capacity.
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
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IsFJ
My guilt typically arises out of an inability to meet my expectations of myself. Is this exacerbated on looking at people who have succeeded where I have failed? Yes, but the core issue is still the failure to live up to my own standards.

I try not to compare myself to others too frequently. Yes, other people have a lot of qualities that I wish I possessed, but I've learned that I'm far happier taking pleasure in my talents than dwelling on my shortcomings, so I try to do that to the best of my capacity.

I understand, senza, I didn't imply it was healthy. :laugh:

It's kinda like an NF macho contest:

"I drive an electric car."
"Oh yeah? I use environmentally friendly shopping bags!"

"I dislike Star Trek on feminist grounds."
"Well, I dislike BTVS on queer theory grounds!"

"I practice economic minimalism, due to my anti-consumerist values."
"Yeah, bub? I grow my own food due to my anti-corporativist values!"

And so on. :biggrin:
 
0

011235813

Guest
I understand, senza, I didn't imply it was healthy. :laugh:

It's kinda like an NF macho contest:

"I drive an electric car."
"Oh yeah? I use environmentally friendly shopping bags!"

"I dislike Star Trek on feminist grounds."
"Well, I dislike BTVS on queer theory grounds!"

"I practice economic minimalism, due to my anti-consumerist values."
"Yeah, bub? I grow my own food due to my anti-corporativist values!"

And so on. :biggrin:

:cry:

I hate dick measuring contests. Why can't we all just hold hands and sing Kumbaya? [/INF guilt trip]
 
0

011235813

Guest
*rolls around in the grass crying and being pacifist*

WE SHALL OVERCOME.
 

Coriolis

Si vis pacem, para bellum
Staff member
Joined
Apr 18, 2010
Messages
27,230
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INTJ
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5w6
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sp/sx
If I had a hammer . . .
 
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