[Fi] INTJ Tertiary Fi

[fragrance]

A few NFs in here (also one SP) said that they love the INTJ's tertiary Fi. How does this "tertiary Fi" look like in real life? Can you give examples of how this function expresses (or might express) itself in reality? And what's so endearing about it?

 

[Thalassa]

It's like when they have kitty cat avatars and suddenly have strong values about particular things after coming across as so uber-rational usually.

What's not to love?

 

[KDude]

I don't intend to be insulting in saying this, but I don't think they are that uber rational exactly. Te is more informative to me. There's almost a perceptive quality to it it seems, where it's just estimating the worth and self-evident nature of things, without it being overly couched in some internal rationale or system (as in Fi or Ti). Where I see the first signs of good Fi is in just how informative some are and/or how much I can talk to them. The more exclusive and less open they are to people/the world at large, the less they see (and the less helpful to me at least). If they seem a bit overreactive and just shoot down a lot of angles to things, it's a sign that they keep their affiliations and interests very tight and specialized. It shows that they haven't explored it (if they did, they'd have something constructive to offer). I've seen INTJs with very exclusive likes and wants, who can be plenty jerkish to even other INTJs. I like the second, who can discuss more things, and have more connection to..umm..humanity or something. They even want to be friends. That would be Fi.

 

[Thalassa]

Yeah I mean they aren't always uber-rational in reality because they have that Ni dom so they can either be paranoid or extremely imaginative and quirky, which is fun and I like, but they tend to try to operate for the most part in Te mode, and they think they're being uber-rational. And sometimes they really are. They have a grounding quality, and yes, I consider that to be rationality.

 

[Nicodemus]

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/nf-idyllic/45052-what-does-fi-look-like-intj-s.html

 

[Elfboy]

this:

 

[InvisibleJim]

this:

An everyday occurance.

 

[Amargith]

Seeing such a strong person, who's often slightly intimidating due to their intelligence and competence, have such a sweet core of vulnerability to them..it's paradoxal and humanizes them again as well. Especially as that core is often pure and raw, as they tend to keep it hidden and are often unaware of it. Catching glimpses of it never fails to make me smile. I may look vulnerable and child-like sometimes, but because I wear my Fi out in the world, it's been...affected. Adjusted, to withstand that kind of abuse. I'm aware that people can take care of my vulnerability which kind of lowers the innocence and raw nature of Fi. It becomes more polished and aware, in order to survive.


Theirs is often pure still. Raw at its core. Full of potential and rarely poluted.

A diamond in the rough.

 

[INTP]

its the ultimate stubborness in things that doesent make any sense

 

[IZthe411]

I don't think Fi has to mean being cute and cuddly and crying all the time (But it does manifest itself like that ) Tert Fi in an ITJ are those times when it's apparent they're not relying on the 'rational' approach to something.

Like my INTJ friend, who doesn't feel the need to apologize to other people (friends & fam) if he's in the wrong. Nothing big- let's just say he said something that was out of line. His thought is that the other person is not acting "rational" in the situation- since the person should know that his intentions weren't to offend. So he doesn't, and would rather not deal with the person instead of just saying that he's sorry for what he said. He's allowing his Ni/Te to override his Fi (he really does care about the person he offended, just doesn't think he has to apologize)
This guy will be 30 next month.

If he had developed Fi, he'd allow his feelings about that person influence his actions. He doesn't have to cry or act out of character- just give a sincere apology over the matter, and be done with it.

 

[Elfboy]

I don't think Fi has to mean being cute and cuddly and crying all the time (But it does manifest itself like that ) Tert Fi in an ITJ are those times when it's apparent they're not relying on the 'rational' approach to something.

Like my INTJ friend, who doesn't feel the need to apologize to other people (friends & fam) if he's in the wrong. Nothing big- let's just say he said something that was out of line. His thought is that the other person is not acting "rational" in the situation- since the person should know that his intentions weren't to offend. So he doesn't, and would rather not deal with the person instead of just saying that he's sorry for what he said. He's allowing his Ni/Te to override his Fi (he really does care about the person he offended, just doesn't think he has to apologize)
This guy will be 30 next month.

If he had developed Fi, he'd allow his feelings about that person influence his actions. He doesn't have to cry or act out of character- just give a sincere apology over the matter, and be done with it.

true. Fi is a yin/yang type of function and can surprise you with it's powerful, intense outbursts and dramatic presence

 

[KDude]

I don't think Fi has to mean being cute and cuddly and crying all the time (But it does manifest itself like that ) Tert Fi in an ITJ are those times when it's apparent they're not relying on the 'rational' approach to something..

[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yooAN6kLVBc]/[/youtube]

 

[KDude]

May as well quote some of the writeups on greenlight wiki:

As a Tertiary Function, Fi typically leads ITJs to retreat into solitary actions that have no constructive worldly effect but are aimed at providing a justification for calling themselves good people. Another example is obsession with the purity of one's soul. For example, being a vegetarian while working at Taco Bell--not out of any great love for animals (the person might hardly know anything about what cows are like), but to be able to say, "Well, at least I never ate any animals." Or engaging in pointless acts of honor, like maintaining super-self-control or "doing one's duty" or going down with the ship. Nothing is gained by going down with the ship; it's a hyper-introverted act aimed at providing a rationalization for one's goodness without regard to real-world consequences. Nearly all of these tertiary-Fi acts involve refraining from action viewed as unethical rather than taking positive action that would accomplish something. They're a retreat from the world--or rather, a rationalization for disregarding worldly matters.


As an Inferior Function, Fi typically leads ETJs to acts of self-destructive hedonism, creation of opera-like drama in their lives and the lives of those around them, obsession with "integrity" (like going down with the ship), instant and irresponsible abandonment of anything they don't like (the opposite of going down with the ship), and bizarre solitary acts of atonement for the harms they've done to others. Sometimes inferior-Fi leads ETJs to preach and even practice a sort of hyper-selfishness, e.g. Ayn Rand and the Landmark Forum. "I'm doing fine, so why should I give a damn about you?" (Very different from highly developed Fi, which leads you to see all people as connected and the highest joy of life as the experience of that connection.)

------------

Tertiary and inferior Fi also sometimes lead TJs to view large numbers of people as "troglodytes": soulless or stupid creatures whose rotten situations in life derive only from their own intrinsic rottenness-of-soul. To take a comic example, Lex Luthor's lamentation in Superman, "Why is the world's greatest criminal genius surrounded by nincompoops?"

Perhaps the most typical manifestation of tertiary and inferior Fi is an attitude of psychologizing other people: a sort of pseudo-empathy in which one explains other people's behavior in terms of pitiful needs and psychological flaws that anyone would be ashamed to have. "Notice the defensiveness. He clings desperately to his ideas. Such weakness." (Nearly all psychological theories offer plenty of ammo for psychologizing, including Lenore Thomson's ideas.) Where developed Fi leads you to find something in your own soul in terms of which to truly understand someone else and see things their way, tertiary and inferior Fi typically lead you to find something in your own soul that you despise, in terms of which you can "explain" them and justify putting them down.


Naturally, you can see plenty of dominant-style Fi in ETJs, secondary-style Fi in IFPs, and so on--even inferior-style Fi in IFPs.

 

[Thalassa]

this:

Sir Elfboy, that was badass.

 

[Sunny Ghost]

It's like when they have kitty cat avatars and suddenly have strong values about particular things after coming across as so uber-rational usually.

What's not to love?

yes!

my INTJ bf just adopted a kitten, and it's so cute to watch him care for her.

I don't intend to be insulting in saying this, but I don't think they are that uber rational exactly. Te is more informative to me. There's almost a perceptive quality to it it seems, where it's just estimating the worth and self-evident nature of things, without it being overly couched in some internal rationale or system (as in Fi or Ti). Where I see the first signs of good Fi is in just how informative some are and/or how much I can talk to them. The more exclusive and less open they are to people/the world at large, the less they see (and the less helpful to me at least). If they seem a bit overreactive and just shoot down a lot of angles to things, it's a sign that they keep their affiliations and interests very tight and specialized. It shows that they haven't explored it (if they did, they'd have something constructive to offer). I've seen INTJs with very exclusive likes and wants, who can be plenty jerkish to even other INTJs. I like the second, who can discuss more things, and have more connection to..umm..humanity or something. They even want to be friends. That would be Fi.

intj's not rational? idk. incredibly perceptive. able to move through information. and make rational decisions based upon what they find through Ni and Te.

this:

love Equilibrium! would this be what a completely T world would look like, if feelers didn't exist?


with the INTJ i'm dating, Fi shows through his need to cuddle, touch and hug a lot. it was really quite surprising, too. i would not have expected him to be so touchy feely. but also in his desire to not only be rational but compassionate towards human nature as a whole. he holds a good bit of angst towards the world for not holding up an ideal. he's a bit angsty towards the government systems, and capitalism, etc. how there are people in the world much less fortunate, etc. these things all really get to him. and to me, that shows his underlying Fi fueling Ni and Te.
his interests are in politics and philosophy. and he's greatly into buddhism as well, and just as the defintion kdude posted pointed out, he's interested in "perfecting" himself. becoming a better human.

but where his use of Fi and my use of Fi differ... are in the fact that i'm individually compassionate. for example, i invited a friend to my house after hanging out with them at the bar one night. he had planned on walking home, but it was raining, and i lived closer. after inviting him, another girl i knew was passed out on a table and apparently her ride had ditched her. so, i told her to come along with us to my place, and that we'd figure it out in the morning. my INTJ said that is something he wouldn't have done, and that they are adults and can figure it out on their own. i wasn't too happy with his response. but i'm working on helping him to step into other peoples shoes.

 

[fragrance]

his desire to not only be rational but compassionate towards human nature as a whole. ... his interests are in politics and philosophy.

I assume that is a characteristic of INTJs with high Fi: they're interested in politics. I have very high Fi and want to work in that field, help create a good and just society, reduce poverty etc. But on the personal level I'm not very compassionate.

Typically, I also have underdeveloped Fi which can burst into calculating and masterplanning "revenge mode". I suppose that's our dark side.

 

[highlander]

its the ultimate stubborness in things that doesent make any sense

WRONG :steam:

 

[Coriolis]

with the INTJ i'm dating, Fi shows through his need to cuddle, touch and hug a lot. it was really quite surprising, too. i would not have expected him to be so touchy feely. but also in his desire to not only be rational but compassionate towards human nature as a whole. he holds a good bit of angst towards the world for not holding up an ideal. he's a bit angsty towards the government systems, and capitalism, etc. how there are people in the world much less fortunate, etc. these things all really get to him. and to me, that shows his underlying Fi fueling Ni and Te.
his interests are in politics and philosophy. and he's greatly into buddhism as well, and just as the defintion kdude posted pointed out, he's interested in "perfecting" himself. becoming a better human.

but where his use of Fi and my use of Fi differ... are in the fact that i'm individually compassionate. for example, i invited a friend to my house after hanging out with them at the bar one night. he had planned on walking home, but it was raining, and i lived closer. after inviting him, another girl i knew was passed out on a table and apparently her ride had ditched her. so, i told her to come along with us to my place, and that we'd figure it out in the morning. my INTJ said that is something he wouldn't have done, and that they are adults and can figure it out on their own. i wasn't too happy with his response. but i'm working on helping him to step into other peoples shoes.

I am much like this, especially the highlighted, and also take an interest in politics and personal spirituality. It is much easier for me to feel compassion for people generally than individually. Helping individual people is good, but if we can fix the system, we can help many. This may fuel the interest in politics.

 

[Elfboy]

this: