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[INFJ] INFJ guy help

Frankie

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Feb 5, 2011
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Hello,

I've been searching around for awhile for some help on a problem I have with an INFJ guy when I noticed some similar threads on here that had some really great replies. I have a friend that I'm really interested in, but I can't tell how he feels because he's SO INFJ. I'm not sure how coherently I can explain all this, but please bear with me :)

We've been friends for several months now and we hang out with the same group a lot. I'm really comfortable with the other guys in the group and we joke and talk a lot more than the INFJ guy and I do. He usually hangs out more with a couple of the other girls. From the beginning of our group though, he and I have always acted differently around each other, almost avoiding each other entirely at times and then having great conversations other times (usually when it's just me and him). He'll regularly avoids me for half the day and then the rest of the day act like I'm the only person in the world.
**So question 1: is that normal for guy INFJs? He's usually super nice and I'm the only person he's like this to (the ignoring part). It gets to the point of being almost insulting how he'll ignore me at times. But then he does a 180 and talks to me the rest of the day!

Our whole group works at the same place as (very low paid) volunteers at a non-profit, so hours are long (50-60+) and money is tight, and we all help each other out when we can. I have a little more money for groceries than he does, and I've given him a standing offer of me getting his groceries sometime. He took me up on the offer once, offered to pick me up (on the other side of town), took me out to coffee first at a farmer's market, then afterwards we window shopped at a really nice mall (half an hour away, which considering gas prices, was a big deal) and had lunch. It was all his initiative. I'm not certain, but I want to say that I'm the only girl he ever really hangs out with alone. We've gone grocery shopping since then too, and one time I'm pretty sure he just wanted to go out with me, regardless of if I could help him with groceries or not.
**Question 2: is this just him being nice or trying to show interest? I've driven him around a lot before and he's tried to get my gas in return, but I wouldn't let him (I'm really stubborn when it comes to people paying me back for things, but I'm getting better, because he seemed rather upset that I wouldn't let him).

We had a break over Christmas and when we got back things seemed different. We talked a couple times at work, but when I'd text him over the weekend to hang out with our group he would never respond. (To clarify, the group usually ends up at his apt, and I always text him to find out the details of what's going on. This time he's just not responded to me at all, even though I knew they were doing stuff). Even when I asked him in person what he was doing that night and if he wanted to go out, he said he was crashing early, when really he ended up going out. Last week we talked and hung out a lot at work and he paid a lot of attention to me. A lot more than he pays to the other girls in our group. And he gave me a hug (albeit an awkward side hug) when I left his apt Sat night (but none of the other girls leaving then too), which is kinda a big deal because he's definitely not a touchy person and rarely initiates hugs with people. We didn't have to be at work until late this Friday because of the weather, so I asked if he wanted to hang out Thursday night. His response was "who is this" :/ I'm temporarily on a different phone and not everyone has my number, but I've texted him before so he should've had it. I told him who it was but then he never texted anything back. When I saw him at work Friday though he looked beyond exhausted, so I'm wondering if he just ignored me because he was so tired? I know he really shuts down and needs alone time when he's tired, but he didn't even respond with 'no' after I said it was me. He's known to be horrible about texting/calling people back, but it came across as really rude and like he just didn't want to talk to me.
**Question 3: why is he now talking to me at work, completely ignoring me socially, and then hangs out with me all weekend and acts like he likes me, and then goes back to ignoring me??

I'm also an INFJ, so it's really hard for me to show him how I feel and him not just think I'm being nice. It really just goes back and forth with lots of eye-gazing that neither of us acknowledge the other is doing because we're such awkward people, and then we just start ignoring each other again.

I'm sorry if this was long, or confusing, but I'm really at a loss as to what to do, and I'd love some feedback on if this guy might like me, and if so what should I do about it? Or is he just a nice guy who wants to be my friend? Or if he's being a jerk by going back and forth so much with me and I should just drop it? Despite being an INFJ as well, this guy confuses me so much, but I really REALLY like him.

~Frankie~
 

SilkRoad

Lay the coin on my tongue
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Sorry to hear you're facing a bit of a dilemma with this guy.

I should say upfront that I'm probably the wrong girl to answer this question, given that I have very little experience of INFJ guys (maybe one or two?) and then only as platonic friends...and in general I'm hardly a relationship guru. But to me, he just sounds confused and really uncertain about what he wants...talk about mixed messages! Ok, I'm a girl INFJ, not a guy INFJ, but the only reason I would ignore someone's text would be if I really didn't want to get back to them, not because I was tired. I do get tired and feeling like I need to get away from people and recharge, but it would be strange to not have enough energy to respond to a text. I think INFJs tend to be courteous or at least to preserve the appearance of it...

I'd be wary with people like that because it just sounds like, if you did get together, he's indecisive enough that it could end up being traumatically on-off...

Questions that come to mind: how old are you guys? What makes you sure he's INFJ?
 

mystory

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I'm an INFJ girl too, so not really the guys perspective but....
There are two reasons I would ignore someone. 1) I wasn't interested in them but think they might be interested in me and want to avoid giving them the wrong idea or encouragement. 2) I really liked them and thought they were not interested in me so I separate myself to try to cut my losses a little and not continue developing feelings.
I know these are opposite reasons, but just about the same reaction from me. I can't even tell you how to tell the difference between the two.
 

Frankie

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Silkroad, We're both 23, and he said once that he's INFJ.

mystory, that's the reasons I can think of too. If anything, he's given off far more signs of being interested in me than I am in him and I act a lot more friendly with the other guys in our group. But he's also not letting me be as nice to him as I was before, which I'm not sure what he means by it... I (and others) always let him eat our leftovers because he's *always* hungry. When we were all out to dinner Sat. night I asked if he wanted some of my food because I knew I wouldn't be able to eat even half of it. He said he couldn't until I was actually done eating because of his conscience...really not sure what he meant by that, but I didn't ask further. And once I was done he gladly ate the rest of my food.

I do know he's been extremely tired lately. We have a very emotionally draining and physically and mentally demanding job, plus he hardly gets time alone. I know I'm not the only one he doesn't always respond to when he's exhausted.

~Frankie~
 

Lily flower

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INFJ's have the bad habit of acting too interested in someone, then backing off to protect themselves. It sounds a little exhausting to me, but it does sound like INFJ behavior to me.
 

ilovelurking

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I've been like this before (and I still do it, sometimes.)

It feels like when I have alot of things in mind and the need to shift focus on 'task at hand' eg: It can be work-related, life stuff, people, significant other, etc. I don't ignore people on purpose because I feel bad if I were to do that. I'm heavily introverted, by the way, and he could be same, too. Always remember, a male INFJ's life is 'harsher' than a female's.

I don't know what conversations you have with him one-on-one. It is best if you could ask him how's life like for him lately. Share with him why you asked and show him that you care. I prefer sharing more about myself in one-on-one conversations.

How long have you known him?
 

ilovelurking

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Oh, and the food thing....

He meant that he needs to be sure you're unable to finish your food before he can have it. It's a politeness thing on our part. :)
 

Frankie

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ilovelurking,
we've known each other for about 6 months now. Usually we talk about work and he spends most of it venting about things, which I don't think he does with many people here. I vent some too, but mostly I listen and try to give him advice on how to deal with situations. We also talk a lot about where we're going in life, jobs after this one, where we want to live someday, where we see ourselves in a few years sort of stuff. For the most part he approaches me when he wants to talk about problems, but sometimes I'm able to initiate and get him to go for a coffee run and have a short conversation by ourselves. We have random conversations about nothing too, which I wish we had more of so we could get to know each other better, but our one on one time is rather sparse. Sometimes its just ten minutes to get some coffee or have lunch (we only see each other on Fridays during the week), or walking to and from places on the weekends (if we can get away from the other 10 people in our group!).

I'm thinking of making him a card this week to try and cheer him up. If I don't over analyze card making and what to put on it and what I should write and how he'll take the meaning of the card too much :/ which I'm already doing.

Always remember, a male INFJ's life is 'harsher' than a female's.
I come from a background where I had to be the tough one, and sometimes I still feel weird when I show my more 'feeling' side, but I forget a lot that as hard as it is for me to realize I don't have to have to act tough, it's probably a lot harder for INFJ guys. Thanks for the reminder :)

INFJ's have the bad habit of acting too interested in someone, then backing off to protect themselves. It sounds a little exhausting to me, but it does sound like INFJ behavior to me.
Do INFJ guys do this a lot? I kinda do this, but I'm also the type that if I know what I want or need, I'll do it. I can be very straightforward and blunt, as can he, which is why his back and forth behavior confuses me so much.

~Frankie~
 

ilovelurking

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Cards are good! It's good you noticed that you might've overanalyzed things. I think he might be doing the same as well.
 

Frankie

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Are there any other things that I could do to get him to know I like him? I'm afraid I've been way too subtle and reserved with my actions towards him and that he has no clue I like him. He did like the card though :) I'm way too shy to just tell him I like him or to do anything overtly flirty, but what are some things I could do that he'd pick up on and make him realize I like him?

I feel like I should know all this since I'm an INFJ too, but I'm as dense as brick when it comes to anything romantic :unsure:

~Frankie~
 

ilovelurking

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*lol* I'm dense, too. I love my ENFP for that!

You can start by saying you miss him at the end of meeting him/phonecalls/text messages.
 

the state i am in

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i've had these exact same situations before. i'm working SO HARD right now trying to figure out how to break this cycle. i've had it happen three times in the last month.

basically, if i vent, if i communicate, if i'm fully myself, i kind of unconsciously talk. i'm an sx/sp. it just gushes forth. i trust, to some degree, or i believe it's worth it, or i'm interested in sharing myself. it's still sometimes more me-centered than the other person centered, but if i think i can share me, it's usually because i trust, respect, and am genuinely interested in the other person. but after this unconscious gushing, i recognize that my monitor completely turned off. i have no idea what this person thinks, and worse yet, i'm COMPLETELY OBLIVIOUS to the social record. i don't know if i violated any norms, any expectations, what kind of signals have been sent, etc. i get so self-conscious, i feel guilty, i blame myself, i'm embarrassed bc i can't take anything back, all the alarm bells are going off, and i get super SKITTISH. i'm not present at all, i'm overwhelmed by projections rather than drinking in experience and being in the moment. i don't know how to respond because i'm not in a responsive kind of flow, i've lost it, and ESPECIALLY in social situations when i feel like i've just lost control of my image, i have no idea what i've been projecting to others, and i don't know what the context of the current moment is bc i haven't been building a story of where you are, where i am, etc. i've just let down my guard and started blurting shit out.

if i gravitate to someone, it means i'm interested in them. i want to talk. i want to explore. i want to share, most of all, sharing is the most important thing to me. the chance to be the real me is the best possibility of all possibilities. but especially when that intersects with social expectations, i lose my sense of confidence and feel like i'm just missing the story, just full of gaps, and trying to be prepared doesn't help, but the more anxious the more i get out of the moment, the more difficult it is to just flow, and the more overwhelming it feels trying to accept your emotions, stabilize the anxiety, and ALLOW YOURSELF TO MAKE MISTAKES. i hate the idea of making a mistake so much. just one. how could i forgive myself. i'm working on it.

anyway, this rant is one potential way of populating the interior of your infj male in question. what's his enneagram? from my perspective, i think i would have some interest in a female infj. so much to learn from each other. but i feel so terrible at exploring situations, and instead do too much immediate predictive --> protective cutting off or avoidance.

also, i lose confidence in my READING OF THE STORY between us all the time. i'm terrible at creating and keeping those threads going, and checking in with the interiors. as a result, gestures and exteriors can get overblown, and become so inflected with my own mood state. being firm in your place in the story, sharing just a bit of your story that is important or clears away anxiety, well, it tends to advance things quite successfully in my experience. the hesitation loop is so frustrating for infjs, and i want to figure out how to break it, but sometimes in our moments of unhealth it seems like we just feel dependent on that initiation coming from outside of us!
 

Frankie

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So....you're saying he's talking so much b/c he's so comfortable that he doesn't give himself the chance to figure out what I think and thus gets awkward b/c he might've just said/done something socially awkward that could alienate me? But in reality the only reason he's alienating me is because he just got awkward?


i've just let down my guard and started blurting shit out.
He does this a lot. He just starts rambling about personal things stressing him out as soon as we're alone.

i hate the idea of making a mistake so much. just one. how could i forgive myself. i'm working on it.
He forgot what state I'm from (and put me from a completely different state) a couple weeks ago. I've never heard someone apologize so much or try to make so many excuses about why he forgot where I'm from. It was honestly a little cute :blush: so think of that next time you make a 'mistake' -- maybe she'll just pass it off as cute!

also, i lose confidence in my READING OF THE STORY between us all the time. i'm terrible at creating and keeping those threads going, and checking in with the interiors. as a result, gestures and exteriors can get overblown, and become so inflected with my own mood state.
I do this all the time. I'm trying not to, but it's hard.

i want to figure out how to break it, but sometimes in our moments of unhealth it seems like we just feel dependent on that
I'm going to attempt to break it. I've realized that I've (b/c of my many insecurities and bad luck in the past with guys) been giving him a ton of mixed/negative signals as a way to protect myself. But I like him far too much for this to not happen just because I'm too shy to let him know I like him. There's some old spanish missions on the edge of town and there's hiking trails between some of them. Since we both love walking, and the weather is supposed to be great this weekend, I'm going to ask him this week if he wants to go there with me. Hopefully none of our other friends invite themselves like they have a habit of doing! And hopefully I actually get the courage to ask him and don't freeze up and just mumble something incoherently in his general direction :unsure:

And I don't know his enneagram unfortunately.
 

Curator

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well, I find the only time I act similarly to the way you describe this guy, is when I really like some one, but am really unsure of my feelings for them, and im partially afraid of getting to attached to fast (or them getting to attached to fast) while im still unsure what I want... Im not exactly a typical INFJ male however... so take what I say with a grain of salt...

The ignoring of texts seem a bit strange though, but if he is notorious about this, does that to everyone, then I wouldn't take offense at it, he could just hate phones/texting, like I do, I still dont ignore texts (when I had a working phone) but my replies would normally be very short...Your best bet, is to just cut through all the games and let him know you are interested, but in a non-threatening mellow sort of way like "I am interested in the possibility of a romantic relationship with you, but im happy as just friends if thats what you want." kinda thing... it may be incredibly hard, but sometimes being straight forward like that, is a hell of a lot easier than beating around the bush for years (been there, done that:/)
 

the state i am in

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i can't tell you what he's thinking bc i don't know, but this is how i'd read it through the lens of my own experiences as an infj male. there's also a very strong component of not feeling like you know what the other person's expectations are (while knowing that the expectations seem somewhat different than they are for others, as you start to construct a story together that has to be monitored against a relationship script as well), and then just feeling awkward and extremely anxious that you won't be prepared to handle the other person's expectations and handle yourself at the same time. which then makes you perform even worse than you would if you just allowed yourself to make mistakes.

your idea for a walk sounds like you are on the right track. there's no winning ticket move, and sometimes it's just not gonna be right, but that seems like you're doing a damn good job at this. while he may still be uncertain or awkward, it does say that you want to spend time alone together (preferably) and that you are thinking about something that would be nice for the both of you. he may be awkward and resistant to the situation for many reasons, including that the chance of something going wrong or embarrassing him is heightened. steadiness from the other person is one of the things i tend to value most. i know that when i'm a little steadier, when i am in flow more, i'm a great person. when i get a little skittish, i'm more erratic, more selfish, and more closed off to the experiences of others.
 

Frankie

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Well, I was going to ask him yesterday when I saw him, but never got a good chance to (might've chickened out a bit too...). I finally worked up the courage to send him a text last night, but I haven't gotten a response. Maybe he really isn't interested in me and him not hardly responding to my texts is his way of nicely letting me know to go away. Or he's just too nervous to respond. Either way, at this rate it looks like I'm not going to get anywhere with him any time soon :-/ Thanks for all the advice guys. I feel like this one might end up being a lost cause that I should probably let go before I get myself in too deep.
 

Starry

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Well, I was going to ask him yesterday when I saw him, but never got a good chance to (might've chickened out a bit too...). I finally worked up the courage to send him a text last night, but I haven't gotten a response. Maybe he really isn't interested in me and him not hardly responding to my texts is his way of nicely letting me know to go away. Or he's just too nervous to respond. Either way, at this rate it looks like I'm not going to get anywhere with him any time soon :-/ Thanks for all the advice guys. I feel like this one might end up being a lost cause that I should probably let go before I get myself in too deep.

Frankie...I admit...I have only skimmed this thread. And I have some sort of sinus headache thing going on so I really have no business responding...BUT to the bolded part...I will say that isn't really all that unusual...especially with INFJ e5. What I did was just keep pressing forward. I would say some stupid stuff that would seem to rattle him free (I should probably be writing this in the state i am in's disarming INFJ 4s & 5s'. Like I don't know what you said in your text...but if I was in the same situation I would just text again saying something like...'I am assuming all of your fingers are broken as you didn't get back to me and all...but I would still like to go on a walk. Using a pencil gripped between your teeth...please press Y for yes or N for no.' Okay...that was a terrible example...but providing my INFJ with those little nudges to say 'hey yah...that text was real...and I do exist outside of your head' was what was needed in my situation. Breaking through can be done but it does take a little time. I am not sure if you should give up just yet.

All and all...you will know what is best to do for yourself.
 

ilovelurking

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Frankie...I admit...I have only skimmed this thread. And I have some sort of sinus headache thing going on so I really have no business responding...BUT to the bolded part...I will say that isn't really all that unusual...especially with INFJ e5. What I did was just keep pressing forward. I would say some stupid stuff that would seem to rattle him free (I should probably be writing this in the state i am in's disarming INFJ 4s & 5s'. Like I don't know what you said in your text...but if I was in the same situation I would just text again saying something like...'I am assuming all of your fingers are broken as you didn't get back to me and all...but I would still like to go on a walk. Using a pencil gripped between your teeth...please press Y for yes or N for no.' Okay...that was a terrible example...but providing my INFJ with those little nudges to say 'hey yah...that text was real...and I do exist outside of your head' was what was needed in my situation. Breaking through can be done but it does take a little time. I am not sure if you should give up just yet.
All and all...you will know what is best to do for yourself.


^ This! :)
 
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