[INFP] how to make infp to not eat unhealthy food?

[INTP]

so heres the deal. i got this infp friend who is obese, tries to lose weight, and acts like a heroin addict when it comes to ben & jerry's, soda, junk food etc. he manages to stay away from them occasionally(usually due to bets or other agreements made with other people(he even made a "formal" contract that he had to sign once with our friend)), but relapses eventually(usually instantly after these bets or agreements end). he has done this for about 3 years. usually it starts from something like one ice cream or something and he always thinks that he can stop after this, but 90% of times he cant. during these relapses he goes crazy, about everything he eats for food is junk food and he eats other crap daily.

he is on heavy anti-psychotic medication and they make this craving for crap food even worse, but its not all because of them, they just make it bit worse.

he is also addicted to nicotine and have stopped smoking few times but relapsed, he says its easier to stay away from junk food/candy when he smokes. he stopped smoking few days ago, because he had some mild complications(that basically just scared him) caused by nicotine and his medication. now after stopped smoking he started to eat crap again.

he clearly has some addiction problems(luckily he never got addicted to alcohol, but he also has slight addiction when it comes to slot machines) that he tries to fill with either nicotine or eating crap. he says that he needs something like that to keep him happy. i have tried explaining that he shouldnt treat this problem just forcing himself to stay out of junk food, but that he should treat this addiction problem as a whole, he knows it but doesent do anything about it, even tho he doesent like it(or he likes to eat crap, but overally doesent like to have addictions).

he knows that he shouldnt eat crap that much and should stay away from it completely, because he cant just have a ben & jerry's once in a while, because he simply cant do it once in a while.

everyone in our circle of friends have tried to help him, support him, scare him, guilt trip him etc etc and nothing seems to work. and everyone are getting bored/stopped to even try much anymore because nothing works on him. i think im the only one who still believes that he might be able to do it some day..

anyone got some suggestions on how to help him with this or what not to do? help would be very much appreciated.

 

[Adasta]

Once again, I only speak from personal experience, lest the MBTI police attack me for not knowing enough about function theory.

It is sometimes hard to take advice as an INFP because it feels like criticism. Your friend is almost certainly ignoring the facts of the matter because it's easier just to daydream. In terms of my own health, I had two personal revolutions. When I was about 18 I realised that I was far, far too skinny ever to play sport, which is what I wanted to start doing again. I researched everything about nutrition and started going to the gym. I became really dedicated in that because it fit into my own world view. Rather than being "criticised" by other people, I took my own initiative - this is the key point. You need to construct your advice in a positive way that forces him to change things, but in a way which makes it appear as if he is the one in control.

I really enjoy exercise (as an INFP) - I enjoy its physicality as I "respect" its difference from the ideological and non-corporeal world I tend to inhabit. Plus, it's personal, so I don't have to deal with anyone else - this is significant.

 

[Stanton Moore]

Can he ride a bike?

Some anti-psychotics make you gain wait. Why is he taking them?

 

[sleepy]

Arrange a crime that he gets caught for. In prison I presume there is scheduled and healthy meals.

 

[INTP]

Once again, I only speak from personal experience, lest the MBTI police attack me for not knowing enough about function theory.

It is sometimes hard to take advice as an INFP because it feels like criticism. Your friend is almost certainly ignoring the facts of the matter because it's easier just to daydream. In terms of my own health, I had two personal revolutions. When I was about 18 I realised that I was far, far too skinny ever to play sport, which is what I wanted to start doing again. I researched everything about nutrition and started going to the gym. I became really dedicated in that because it fit into my own world view. Rather than being "criticised" by other people, I took my own initiative - this is the key point. You need to construct your advice in a positive way that forces him to change things, but in a way which makes it appear as if he is the one in control.

I really enjoy exercise (as an INFP) - I enjoy its physicality as I "respect" its difference from the ideological and non-corporeal world I tend to inhabit. Plus, it's personal, so I don't have to deal with anyone else - this is significant.

he knows about nutrition and how much calories he should eat etc. he did jogging few times a week in the summer(and liked it) and was (imo even bit too much) dedicated to it. but now its winter and its bit hard to jog, not to mention its not fun at all, he is thinking of starting it again in the spring, and im pretty sure that he will. but even when he jogged, it didnt help much on losing weight, because of these relapses. he even turned into vegetarian at some point, but just made fatty vege food and it made him feel weak and that he doesent have enough energy. he used to go to gym, but he couldnt do it for long.

he does feel usually like being criticized, when we/i offer advices or tell him why the way he does it doesent work much and how he should do. i have tried things like getting him to kick foot bag(hacky sack) with me in the summer more often, since he enjoys it and its even better exercise than jogging and doesent feel like something he has to do, but something that he wants to do, but he is too lazy for that..

got any exact advices that i should tell him? i cant really figure out positive advices that would make him think that he is in control and forces him to change things.

Can he ride a bike?

Some anti-psychotics make you gain wait. Why is he taking them?

yes, but i dont think he can do it in snow.

he has schizophrenic ocd

 

[Oeufa]

You can't really do anything. He has all the information he needs. He knows what to do, how to do it and what it will do for him. He has to do it for himself and no amount of persuading, coercing, berating, encouraging or anything else is going to do it for him. You know this. Neither positive nor negative external forces will sway him.

It's nice that you care, but it isn't really your business. You've done what you can, he knows how you feel and how you will help him if he wants it. Now leave him be.

 

[Sizzling Berry]

Hello INTP,

Could I ask you if your friend talked about it to his psychiatrist/therapist? Would he be willing to try it?

Maybe he would benefit from professional assistance. It can be tricky to try to help him. A professional with training, experience and helpful attitude could be really supportive in the situation. Especially with OCD in the picture.

And this is how addiction works. It's less about a certain behaviour. The core is that a person uses the behaviour to regulate their mood - like eating to stay happy. So it actually comes more from emotional than information level.

Best of luck, fingers crossed

 

[skylights]

^ my thoughts also

medication like ritalin or concerta or adderall could potentially be helpful, if they would not interfere with his other meds or his condition. they both decrease appetite and increase motivation.

 

[INTP]

im pretty sure that he has talked about this with his therapist, but it doesent seem to help. his sessions with his therapist is more like checking that he isnt losing his mind. and more like "how you feeling?" "im fine" etc. than some intense talk about his problem not related to his mental illness. i think he sees his therapist like once a month and its not often enough to work with this imo.

i dont think his ocd has much anything to do with this, since its more like he thinks that something bad will happen to someone unless he does some ritual. like when he was at his worst, after hugging for bye he had to touch me multiple times until he could touch so that this though wouldnt arise. but he doesent really have this kind of thoughts much anymore because of really heavy medication(he takes 7 pills twice a day, two of 3 different kinds of antipsychotics and one of one kind if i remember right).

The core is that a person uses the behaviour to regulate their mood - like eating to stay happy. So it actually comes more from emotional than information level.

interesting point on this regulating his mood, that makes sense. but one tricky thing about this is that once the addiction has evolved further, the person comes dependent to filling the void, not just the substance that he is using for that. kinda hard to explain. like a normal person who havent developed this problem of addictions can do mostly anything that makes him happy to regulate his mood, but person with addiction needs an addiction to regulate it, thats why people with addictions, just move into another after giving up one addiction. like they create tolerance for this regular basis one type of fulfillment for the void, so they cant go jogging one moment they feel down, eat candy on one occasion etc, but instead they develop a habit for one type of filling the void. and imo this is what he needs to get out of, i have explained it to him and he knows it, but he says that he needs some addiction(he didnt use the word addiction, but basically meant it). i have explained to him that once he gets out of this habit of addictive type of fulfillment, he can feel good about things even without it and he knows it, but still is unable to do anything to get out of it, apparently its just too hard for him. like when he was jogging in the summer, he could stop eating, but it was because of the rush that he got from jogging replacing the fulfillment that he got from eating, so basically he didnt get off from addictive type of fulfillment mentality, just replased the addiction with another. and now that he cant go jogging and cant smoke, he just returns to eating.

i kinda need ideas on how to make him go through this addiction based fulfillment mentality that he has until he can get enjoyment from a broader range of things and how to get him from returning to these addictions, because its really like some heroin addiction, if he does it once, its most likely back to old routines.. i mean it only takes one pizza for him to return to these habits. also he is super ignorant to this fact most the time, especially when he starts to get this graving.

For Ti types its usually enough that he understands these facts, but apparently its not so with Fi types. what kind of stuff would make him to understand this?

@skylights
i dont think its a good idea to add more medication to him.

 

[Udog]

I highly recommend the book "Hungry: The Lessons Learned on the Journey from Fat to Thin." http://www.amazon.com/Hungry-Lesson...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1292088829&sr=8-1. It talks about a lot of food addiction issues, and the book is a fairly light and interesting read, with a few practical tips, so it may get to him. An example is listing "red / yellow / green" foods.

Red foods are foods that he CANNOT eat, no matter what, because they will trigger a binge. Those foods are like alcohol to an alcoholic, and must be avoided. Yellow foods are foods that are on the cusp. They don't trigger a binge necessarily, but they are dangerous. Yellow foods either become red or green. Green foods are the foods that he can eat at any time, with no concerns. Things like salad and lean chicken rarely cause food binges in people.

 

[INTP]

could think about buying that book for him as a christmas present.

anyways, today he said that he stops eating crap tomorrow(his own decision, but it almost always is, so no big change here). also he noticed that it might be possible to jog if the weather is good.

i managed to make him understand few things about this addiction thing in general. he ranted how he doesent want to buy crap and that when he eats ben & jerry's(or something like that) it just gives him a normal feeling and when he wants one he just feels crap because he shouldnt eat it and wants to. and i managed to make him understand that its exactly the same as feeling withdraws from nicotine for example.

one positive thing about all this is that he knows that he feels better about everything when he isnt in this eating rampage, but he has known it for ages, so it doesent really make any difference to this time. but he thinks that he can eat a piece of cake etc in special occasions, but im pretty certain that at some point, he will overdo it and its back to the same old shit again..

 

[entropie]

infp's are very stubborn but can easily be tricked. You basically would have to wean him from his old food habits into new ones. Did work with my girlfriend, tho I think you prolly do not have the chance to cook for him too often. If you tho should have try to do that, just be careful you dont have him on your arse after that wanting you to continue cooking for him

 

[ABCDEmpire]

infp's are very stubborn but can easily be tricked. You basically would have to wean him from his old food habits into new ones. Did work with my girlfriend, tho I think you prolly do not have the chance to cook for him too often. If you tho should have try to do that, just be careful you dont have him on your arse after that wanting you to continue cooking for him

Haha. Easily be tricked. I don't know about that exactly, but you have a point there. I have to trick myself sometimes into feeling a certain way about something before I can make myself do it. Key point, though... "trick myself". I don't think our type is necessarily gullible enough to be tricked by others, considering we easily read other people's motives. Though, it may have worked for you because of that particular individual. Every person is different.

I agree with earlier posts. He's got to want to do it himself. But perhaps agree to do it along with him for at least a time? Get together and eat healthy things, learn new recipes, or even workout. Try to get him excited about it. It really sounds like he has a food addiction and therapy is fairly necessary for any kind of addiction if he hasn't got the will power on his own. Also, I know that for me- It's very hard for me to talk about my feelings with others. Encourage him to talk to you when he feels down. (Even if you don't exactly want to hear it. ) Perhaps he'll replace food with getting out his feelings in a healthy manner.

 

[entropie]

Haha. Easily be tricked. I don't know about that exactly, but you have a point there. I have to trick myself sometimes into feeling a certain way about something before I can make myself do it. Key point, though... "trick myself". I don't think our type is necessarily gullible enough to be tricked by others, considering we easily read other people's motives. Though, it may have worked for you because of that particular individual. Every person is different.

Well I dont want to advance a discussion on how to be a good con man but when you think you cant be tricked, you're in danger the most

 

[ABCDEmpire]

Well I dont want to advance a discussion on how to be a good con man but when you think you cant be tricked, you're in danger the most

Actually, I personally enjoy thinking that everything and everyone is out to get me.

In fact, I'm pretty sure you're part of the KGB. But yes. No more de-railing.

 

[entropie]

Yes .

I am curious, regarding this whole topic: could you say infp's have a knack for getting themselves in dangers ? For as long I am together with my girlfriend, I have the impression of myself that I am overly protectivce, I've never seen that before, most probably due to a lack of people who are not in my environment. My girlfriend is diagnosed ADS so she already has a hardtime with remembering things, but I am not refering to that. I mean she's prone to come in contact with really criminal circles in the environment and that quite easily. I am way to conservative to have ever been that cool, I am just wondering on the one hand she strikes me as an intellectual being, then again she has that silly switch when she can become a person I never knew and who appears quite unwise and let's say it asocial to me. Gladly with age she's not putting to much effort into her alter ego no more, but it was still interesting to see like Faust, alas there are two souls housed within my breast. Can you identify with this or is this my-gf-special ?

 

[Udog]

anyways, today he said that he stops eating crap tomorrow(his own decision, but it almost always is, so no big change here). also he noticed that it might be possible to jog if the weather is good.

I'm not buying it until he says "I'm not eating crap right now", and then chooses healthy food. Once he does that for a month, I'll believe it.

Nothing personal, I've just been there and done that.

 

[Ponyboy]

I agree with alot of this. Personally, I have some bad habits that I know I should give up. But then again its so much easier not to and deal with it later! Typical INFP I guess, but like it has been said....he has to want it and be committed to any changes.

 

[A window to the soul]

^ How to motivate?

 

[Ponyboy]

Oh wait did I say I had bad habits? nope, uh-uh

But I'm not sure a person can actually motivate someone else without the original person knowing when its time for a change and being committed to it