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[INFP] INFP: human resources? Educational administration?

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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I hear educational administration is an ISFJ type of job though human resources has been listed for INFPs.

I am an INFP or rather, I'm an IXXX. That I know for sure. The rest changes but I get INFP most often so I suppose that's what I am. I have a degree in psychology but I have been stuck in this place for years now. I tried grad school but dropped out. Too intense for me. Too much research and also I don't know if I can listen to stories of people wanting to commit suicide or people who have rage issues. I am a shy sensitive guy, you know.

Anyhow, I think I need to make over 50K a year to have a decent life and not worry about money on a daily basis. That means I can't write poetry or the odd article, which I enjoy doing. I won't make a penny. They have to remain hobbies. I think the two types of careers that I listed allow me to make that kind of money...at least eventually.

Why am I telling you all this? I was hoping that some people here have experience with those careers and can give me some advice. I've even considered Industrial/Organizational Psychology and I don't know if that would suit me because that sounds too business oriented and fast paced. I like to be able to connect with people and help them fulfill their potential. I don't mind some unpleasantness but at the end of the day I am a people person so I want to connect with people not see them as numbers.
 

Trentham

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Jan 14, 2010
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304
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INTP
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5w4
Human resources could be tough for you - lots of rules to follow, procedure, bureaucracy. While technically it's a "people-helping" role, you'd have to get comfortable with your own values being subordinate to those of the company you're representing. Maybe better suited for an SJ.
 

conscius

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Wow, thanks so much Trentham, that's what I was thinking. Damn, it's so hard to find a career where you get to help people and yet not get overwhelmed. I mean I don't want to put too much stock in this whole typology stuff and whether I am a true INFP or not, I do know that I hate following the rules. I have authority issues. The one job that I really enjoyed was when I was working in a medical clinic where my supervisor gave me tremendous amount of freedom so I was essentially my own boss. Yet I hated nothing more than following procedure, doing filing, or similar mind-numbing things. I loved administering this short psychology test which allowed me to include my own judgments and intuition in interpreting results. Alas, that was a very small part of my job and what's worse, my supervisor changed and I ended up with someone who wanted to micromanage me...and that didn't last long.

I suppose industrial/organizational psychology would give me more freedom and flexibility than human resources. Educational admin is probably not much different from human resources. I don't think I'll spend most of my time working with students and watching fulfill their potential. And psychology, well, I already covered that. Too painful.

Well, I'll keep looking. I appreciate your guidance.
 

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
7,756
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6w7
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
i understand your search. i'm going through a similar thing. :yes:

i want a job that pulls in the money but doesn't require me to be a fake SJ all the time. or a T.

the job market is slated against NF :tongue10:
 

Rebe

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4sop
^ seriously

i could be a teacher but ... i don't really want to be a teacher.
 

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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8
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i understand your search. i'm going through a similar thing. :yes:

i want a job that pulls in the money but doesn't require me to be a fake SJ all the time. or a T.

the job market is slated against NF :tongue10:

I know it, it blows. The wheel of life is intent on weeding out the compassionate, the idealistic, the sensitive, and the romantic.

But I'm more resilient. I'll find my niche without having to sacrifice who I am and my core values. Things would have been much easier if I were greatly talented in math or computers. I could be an engineer, make decent money by working only a few days a week, then use the rest of my time for creative endeavors and maybe start my own foundation and help people out in my own way. I am so tempted to get my bachelor's in computer science...I'll make 50k for sure. But can I sit in a cubicle 8 hours a day writing codes like a robot?

Well, if I were to compare math and computer science, I actually have SOME talent in math whereas nearly none in comp sci. So I guess I could get my masters in psychology (you need math/stats for research) but I'll end up doing research for 30k a year or else see patients for just about the same, and I won't have any time off either. At least that'll be more meaningful than writing codes.

I even considered graphic design but I chatted with someone online who told me you have to constantly "sell yourself" and how hard that is and that now he works in McDonalds. I don't know who to believe. I had looked up stats online and people start out making 35k with a median salary of 50k mid-career, so I don't know....

Lots of people have told me I would make a good teacher/professor but that's out too. First off, I am shy so I don't know how I feel standing in front of a class everyday. Not just that, but dealing with a bunch of kids who want to be defiant and act like an ass! Heck, I haven't forgotten high school. I was glad when it was over.

Okay, what else (I'm reading some suggested careers....), ministry! That's a laugh. I'm more spiritual and I don't know how I feel about being a religious authority figure.

Ah, screw this, I'll do what my uncle did...marry a chick from a rich family. ;)
 

skylights

i love
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Ah, screw this, I'll do what my uncle did...marry a chick from a rich family. ;)

:D

actually, if you really like computers, i know a bit of coding and it's really not brainless at all. it can be tedious sometimes but it can also be creative and challenging, and depending on what you do with it, it can be very meaningful. my first professional website was for a group working to raise diversity awareness. i feel like web design is better left as a freelance hobby, though. currently the economy just isn't very promising for a beginning designer. still - some people have managed to pull stuff like that off. look at webcomic artists like jeph jacques, i'm pretty sure his fulltime job is his comic. :yes:
 

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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:D

actually, if you really like computers, i know a bit of coding and it's really not brainless at all. it can be tedious sometimes but it can also be creative and challenging, and depending on what you do with it, it can be very meaningful. my first professional website was for a group working to raise diversity awareness. i feel like web design is better left as a freelance hobby, though. currently the economy just isn't very promising for a beginning designer. still - some people have managed to pull stuff like that off. look at webcomic artists like jeph jacques, i'm pretty sure his fulltime job is his comic. :yes:

Interesting. I haven't done programming but I figured it's something like the movie "Office Space", depressed folks in cubicles doing mind-numbing work. :D Yeah, I know, I'm clueless. But that sounds good though. I did some pretty basic web design one time (after teaching myself a bit of CSS) and I really enjoyed it. I had quite a bit of freedom so I was able to be creative. As far as computer science, my school offers a two year program for people with a previous degree so I can certainly get a bachelor's degree in computer science and the admission is not that selective either. Of course, I have to look at the market here in Canada, where I live, to see if there are any jobs in computer sci out here.
 

Alchemiss

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Jul 12, 2009
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106
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INFP
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5w6
What job aspects are most important to you? Presently I have no boss, no bureaucratic paperwork, no annoying meetings nor exasperating co-workers, and I get to help people one on one and/or help myself every day without overwhelm. I had just the opposite scenario when I used my university degrees in engineering.

My advice is to make a list of what you enjoy and see if you can craft a working life from those things. Is career counseling an option? Life Coaching? Bodywork of some sort? In many bodywork modalities you talk initially but the rest of the session is non-verbal which is a great INFP option. :)
 

Thessaly

I drink your milkshake.
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Jun 5, 2009
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1,363
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xNFP
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3w4
Human Resources is dominated by SJs. It's just an SJ type of business function so be prepared to get structured and sensible! It's probably the only business related area where you can somewhat connect with people so it may not be bad for you. I personally didn't care for it, although Ne is excellent for intuitively understanding people and dealing with them.
 

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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Alchemiss: thanks for the guidance. By the way, what line of work you in? I don't know if I would have left my job as an engineer to pursue something else. You get good pay and good job security and a good social standing too. I tried to go that route but was overwhelmed by all the math. I do okay with a few courses but no way in hell I could take six courses per semester. Ultimately however, it's about temperament and personality, what satisfies you and makes you feel good about yourself, helps you live by your principles, etc. So I'm not criticizing your choice by any means but simply saying that you had some good options on the table whereas in my case, a bachelor degree in psych is crap.
And as far as bodywork, I really don't know if I want to do that. As a shy guy, I don't think I'd be comfortable working so intimately with strangers. :)

Thessaly: Yeah I'm starting to really doubt going down the human resources route now. What do you do now instead?
 

Thessaly

I drink your milkshake.
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Alchemiss: thanks for the guidance. By the way, what line of work you in? I don't know if I would have left my job as an engineer to pursue something else. You get good pay and good job security and a good social standing too. I tried to go that route but was overwhelmed by all the math. I do okay with a few courses but no way in hell I could take six courses per semester. Ultimately however, it's about temperament and personality, what satisfies you and makes you feel good about yourself, helps you live by your principles, etc. So I'm not criticizing your choice by any means but simply saying that you had some good options on the table whereas in my case, a bachelor degree in psych is crap.
And as far as bodywork, I really don't know if I want to do that. As a shy guy, I don't think I'd be comfortable working so intimately with strangers. :)

Thessaly: Yeah I'm starting to really doubt going down the human resources route now. What do you do now instead?


I've come realize that no single route is going to satisfy my multifaceted and idealistic persona so I've decided on pursuing two routes at once. One creative and the other advising and personal.
 

Alchemiss

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Jul 12, 2009
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5w6
Alchemiss: thanks for the guidance. By the way, what line of work you in? I don't know if I would have left my job as an engineer to pursue something else. You get good pay and good job security and a good social standing too. I tried to go that route but was overwhelmed by all the math. I do okay with a few courses but no way in hell I could take six courses per semester. Ultimately however, it's about temperament and personality, what satisfies you and makes you feel good about yourself, helps you live by your principles, etc. So I'm not criticizing your choice by any means but simply saying that you had some good options on the table whereas in my case, a bachelor degree in psych is crap.
And as far as bodywork, I really don't know if I want to do that. As a shy guy, I don't think I'd be comfortable working so intimately with strangers. :)

I'm a Jin Shin Jyutsu (Japanese form of acupressure) practitioner. I have a Ph.D. in Chemical Engineering and left a six figure income at a large corporation to pursue what I'm doing now. That may sound crazy but there are some extenuating circumstances. First, I've worked for this company since I got my doctorate in 1990 so I've had years to save money (our mortgage is paid off, for example), and secondly, my husband, who also has his engineering doctorate, still works there so I can use his medical benefits and we still have his salary.

I believe anyone can become skilled in math. I once dated a guy who was flunking calculus and after I tutored him he got an A. Math thinking requires training your brain in a particular way and, if need be, dropping false belief systems about how you can't do it. Engineering thinking, on the other hand, I don't think is accessible to all since there are some intuitive insights needed I don't think you can "teach."

I have received bodywork for a decade and a half; part of my pursuit of my true self. It has made me comfortable with my own body and that of others. I'd rather silently touch people (and while it's basically intimate, it's also clinical for me) than hear of their suffering verbally for an hour. Now that I write that, though, I realize I don't take on people's stuff like I used to. It isn't my job to "fix it," I'm just there to facilitate whatever healing I can.

I think it's challenging for an INFP to find a solid fit within the default path of university to corporate job but when I was at that point in my life, I didn't have self-awareness and I didn't know I had options. So I'm writing this as someone who has lived a life that just doesn't fit any more and maybe never did. Good luck to you and do yourself a favor and forget social status. Social status is a false substitute for feeling good about yourself on the inside.
 

Alchemiss

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Don't discount your degree, either. You were passionate enough to complete it, you learned things about how you work/how people work/how the world works, and you can use it as the foundation for what's next. There are many options for graduate degrees should you decide one is right for you. :)
 

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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Alchemiss: Man, you're my hero! I am quite impressed by your courage to change directions after having obtained a PhD in chemical engineering. And, well, reading your guidance--and appreciating your encouragement by the way--I really think you should have become a psychologist. :)

Yeah, I know, listening to people's sufferings can be brutal. And doing bodywork is better, in the sense that you are able to see the result of your work immediately--and in the flesh. :)

I think having received bodywork yourself is the major difference as I have NEVER received massage--yeah believe it. I know that the stereotype is usually women being uncomfortable/insecure about their bodies but as a guy who has had weight issues for years (mostly correlating with periods of depression/severe stress) and having been raised in a culture and family environment that used "shaming" excessively to control/shape behavior, I have avoided massage and such. When I went to my doctor, he made a strong recommendation for it. He noted that I did not have a serious mental health issue but being quite a sensitive person and anxious too, and having been subject to quite a few traumatic incidents, my breathing pattern is terribly out of whack, which explains why I go into a total fight-or-flight mode (panting, sweating, etc) at the slightest comment that can be seen as a "threat" or perceived as "shaming". He recommended yoga, massage, etc, but I have not listened to his recommendations.

Okay, enough over-share. As far as math I do believe that you are right. Well, it is harder than you make it seem but I agree with the gist of what you say. In fact, I hated math and felt I had no talent for it until grade six when I came across a fantastic teacher in Mr. E. For starters, he saw some potential in me. He asked me and a few others to tutor the rest of the students. I agreed to help him. He made me feel useful and valuable. He would sometimes pose questions that could not be solved by the methods available. He would at times bring grade 8 or 9 problems to the class after having spent time figuring out a way that we could, with the knowledge we had and some creativity, solve them. Long story short, though I was never a "bad" student in math, I moved from a B average to an A average, and what's more important, I fell in love with math. I would take advanced math problems to parties, to solve in my free time. A couple of my classmates from my math class became my best friends. Though I was unable to do well in my grade 9 geometry class, and I had serious difficulty with my chemistry and physics classes in later years (getting a few C's), I continued to do very well in math, getting all As, and get 97% in my grade 12 math, which was the highest in school. Unfortunately, when I went to university I was overwhelmed by so many things that I struggled in math and did not take more than two courses before changed direction and went into psychology. I got an A- in both math courses but it was a struggle.
 

Alchemiss

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Psychotherapy is something I considered (and the list of things I considered is very, very long), actually. I decided against it because while it did change my life dramatically, other body and spirit approaches have changed it more.

Jin Shin Jyutsu doesn't always give instant gratification since it's working on levels beyond the physical as well. Sometimes I just have to trust that what's supposed to be happening is happening.

I only received massage because I was in intense pain following a car accident. I came from a family where touching was forbidden; no hugging, no spanking, no pats on the back. It took me a long time to understand how important touch is for me. Perhaps if you aren't ready to try massage or yoga, you could try meditation and begin to address the breathing issues.

I'm not saying math is easy. I'm saying there are ways around blocks, especially if you find an instructor who teaches in a way you can learn. It's excellent when you yourself have to teach because then you become even more solid in your understanding.

I found university courses so much harder than high school even though I went to a very competitive high school. If you love math, and think engineering is a potential passion, maybe take a smaller course load and see what happens. There's no law saying you have to complete in four years. I also was a co-operative education student which allowed me to see what it was like to work in industry (alternating semesters between school and work). I highly recommend that also.
 

Alchemiss

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5w6
I had another thought. I remembered what I figured out about high school versus university study; in high school I could learn all the content whereas in university courses I had to discern what the instructor considered important because I couldn't learn it all. I had trouble with this at first and had a few so-so semesters while I tried various strategies. So much of learning is figuring out how to manage the system and the volume of information!

I also learn intuitively. I look like a dolt sometimes because my understanding comes in intuitive bursts - I learn things in chunks, not linearly.
 

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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It's funny you mention that because I am the same. It's such a wonderful feeling when so much info suddenly makes sense. As for your other point: I remember one day, too late really, I came to the conclusion that doing well in a course had to do with more than just learning the material. It was a third year psych course and I had one day to review a dozen chapters, ones I had never reviewed before. While sitting in the library it suddenly occurred to me that the questions in the last midterm came mostly from the class notes and not the book. Yes the prof had said it would come mostly from the book. I decided to risk it and read the notes only. I had gotten a B- the last midterm but this time got an A+, no kidding!
 

Alchemiss

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INFP
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5w6
^ Ah, so you have developed "maze brightness" - that will help you anywhere! :)

I've had jobs in process development, product development, tool development, materials development, process integration, computer programming, and materials characterization, among others. When I had my programming job, the part I like best was writing scripts that helped other people do their work more efficiently. What I didn't like was being endlessly tethered to my computer most of the time. The job I liked best, the one I just quit, involved both interfacing with internal "customers" to find out what data they needed and then collecting data/solving problems. Over time, more and more of our data were reported electronically and we got less and less feedback so it was hard to tell whether we were making a difference.

Also, being part of a large corporation whose values deviated farther and farther from mine over time was highly problematic as was my local management who had more than their share of human foibles (to put it nicely).

So what are your current thoughts on "what's next?"
 

conscius

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Oct 4, 2010
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Hard to say. The one thing that I know for sure is that I like to learn. I love that whole university environment. It's wonderful. Work seems to be the necessary evil, at this point. I love to find the kind of work where you look forward to it day in and day out. I am considering several very different options in industrial/organizational psychology, creative writing/poetry, and some sort of psych research career.
 
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