[ENFP] Upset ENFPs: Handle With Care

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

Me and you probably won't be getting along, realistically.

Are you saying that talk therapy isn't beneficial? Really? Are you saying that when people are overwhelmed by stress that it doesn't make them feel better to scream or cry (even if it's alone in their car or locked in the bathroom or with their face in a pillow)?

Not with that grammar we won't.

We're talking about venting, not therapy. See Catharsis (hope that links to the scientific study; I don't have time to look right now, meditation calls)

 

[Thalassa]

lulz I majored in English you freak and was a straight A student, I also minored in French and was president of Alpha Mu Gamma one year

I know it's supposed to be you and I, but then again, I also have enough knowledge of dialect to appreciate that speaking "properly" is largley a load of bunk. Southern dialect, ebonics, and interwebz speak are all valid forms of dialect.

I used me and you intentionally. ME FIRST.

 

[stringstheory]

well then i guess it's a good thing that we weren't actually talking about what the study you provided was talking about.

 

[Thalassa]

well then i guess it's a good thing that we weren't actually talking about what the study you provided was talking about.

It only makes sense that physical tension is released through things like crying and exercise.

I don't give a shit what his article says. I mean, he linked us to a web site called "you are not so smart."

He also has a Buddhist agenda. Just know.

 

[stringstheory]

It only makes sense that physical tension is released through things like crying and exercise.

I don't give a shit what his article says. I mean, he linked us to a web site called "you are not so smart."

He also has a Buddhist agenda. Just know.

Well yeah, exactly. The article itself even admits that "venting feels great", it only claims that it "doesn't do much else".

Which is like, duh, that's the purpose of venting

I'm just not sure what the point is. "you'd all be wrong if we were talking about something else *off-topic study*"?

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

It only makes sense that physical tension is released through things like crying and exercise.

Crying isn't venting, first off. Second, it's possible that emotions can be discharged by waiting them out. If you think of emotions as linked to hormones, depleting the supply of that hormone by not triggering its production (through acts of aggression, ala venting) would cause an corresponding emotional change.

I don't give a shit what his article says. I mean, he linked us to a web site called "you are not so smart."

He also has a Buddhist agenda. Just know.

Double ad hom!

Bushman, Baumeister, and Stack don't have a Buddhist agenda, and if they did, it would still be irrelevant if the research was sound. Besides, Buddhists aren't morons. Here's the same research written up in Psychology Today. Remember, this article was originally published in J. of Pers. & Soc. Psych, which is preeminent journal for social psychology scholarship.

 

[Thalassa]

Well, I don't see the results of the study as being conclusive, either. Just because people were less inclined to catharsis when they didn't read the article just means they were following their previous training to be emotionally repressed. The U.S. and England (all English speaking cultures, I think) are very emotionally repressed to begin with...so, not fucking surprising.

It's a philosophical difference between repression vs. expression. I don't think one study disproves centuries of wisdom.

 

[Thalassa]

Well yeah, exactly. The article itself even admits that "venting feels great", it only claims that it "doesn't do much else".

Which is like, duh, that's the purpose of venting

I'm just not sure what the point is. "you'd all be wrong if we were talking about something else *off-topic study*"?

Yeah, I don't see how NFPs are going to take too kindly to a theory that states that intense emotional experiences (music, romance novels, horror movies, whatever) aren't healthy or productive.

It's a hilarious example of Ti coming in and telling us we're wrong for being who we are again. It's fantastic.

 

[stringstheory]

It's a hilarious example of Ti coming in and telling us we're wrong for being who we are again. It's fantastic.

"well if we were talking about X topic then you would all be wrong!"
*topic is switched by virtue*
"HA you're all wrong!"

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

Well yeah, exactly. The article itself even admits that "venting feels great", it only claims that it "doesn't do much else".

Which is like, duh, that's the purpose of venting

I'm just not sure what the point is. "you'd all be wrong if we were talking about something else *off-topic study*"?

The idea is this, and this goes back to the OP. Just because you want to be heard or because you want to vent, doesn't mean you should. Deciding the best course of action requires that you appreciate the consequences of your course of action. With venting, for example, research shows that venting is not cathartic. It might make you feel better in the moment, but in the long run, it leaves you feeling more frustrated. If you want to feel better, then don't vent. Likewise, as I've argued, muting the community's objections so a poster can feel "heard" is a bad idea; even though it might feel good to one person in the short run, in the long run the community as well as the person suffer. Wonkavision took this for granted and made the same mistake you did, equating feels good immediately ("I want") with wise and intelligent.

 

[Thalassa]

Marching around and telling people they're wrong and showing glaring Fe (probably ENTP tert Fe, from the strength of it) isn't really showing wisdom or intelligence either.

It's just showing your opinion.

 

[stringstheory]

The idea is this, and this goes back to the OP. Just because you want to be heard or because you want to vent, doesn't mean you should. Deciding the best course of action requires that you appreciate the consequences of your course of action. With venting, for example, research shows that venting is not cathartic. It might make you feel better in the moment, but in the long run, it leaves you feeling more frustrated. If you want to feel better, then don't vent. Likewise, as I've argued, muting the community's objections so a poster can feel "heard" is a bad idea; even though it might feel good to one person in the short run, in the long run the community as well as the person suffer. Wonkavision took this for granted and made the same mistake you did, equating feels good immediately ("I want") with wise and intelligent.

I think it's pretty clear that what I've outlined is not "venting" in the sense that is described in the article you posted...and what I outlined was an elaboration on the OP. You even said we're not talking about "venting", and yet you're making a whole lot of assumptions about what's going on on our end of an exchange like this (and on the other end) as if we were. I don't see how this has to do with what the OP was outlining unless you're attempting to make connections with whatever Wonka's other threads were about, a point he's already addressed. If you have a point you can use what we've been going on so far, not the data that will make us wrong.

 

[Jaguar]

lulz I majored in English you freak and was a straight A student, I also minored in French and was president of Alpha Mu Gamma one year
I used me and you intentionally. ME FIRST.

What the heeeell do we dooomb English majors know no know?

 

[Thalassa]

What the heeeell do we dooomb English majors know no know?

I ain't sure.

 

[Thalassa]

Yeah, there's a big difference between expressing yourself in writing and going around breaking people's things.

 

[animenagai]

Wow this thread has taken an unnecessary and nasty turn. I don't really see how venting = what the OP is saying and the problem is I think both parties see that. Why are we even down this track?

 

[Tallulah]

Yeah, there's a big difference between expressing yourself in writing and going around breaking people's things.

Yeah, I was just coming back to make a similar point after having read that article. I agree that punching things and yelling and screaming would tend to become its own high after a while--and it would also tend to indicate anger management issues.

The type of venting I had in mind, though, is the type of venting where someone is trying to make sense of their emotions so they DON'T have to take it out on someone else. They're talking out the situation to a third party (even if they appear angry) because of the frustration of the situation, and the third party listens and helps them direct their anger or frustration into a manageable or constructive avenue. I think that is perfectly healthy, and I think too often we don't talk about something we're frustrated about, and then loop on our own (often errant or incomplete) understanding of the situation, and THAT is what causes more anger and negative emotion. Talking it through with a friend is the healthiest thing you can do in these situations, in my opinion.

 

[Spartacuss]

Wow this thread has taken an unnecessary and nasty turn.

And it did so right here:

Well, your 2 cents, like most coinage, is covered in filth and excrement that can not always be seen with the naked eye, but is there, nonetheless.

But I appreciate your 2 cents anyway.

 

[stringstheory]

The type of venting I had in mind, though, is the type of venting where someone is trying to make sense of their emotions so they DON'T have to take it out on someone else. They're talking out the situation to a third party (even if they appear angry) because of the frustration of the situation, and the third party listens and helps them direct their anger or frustration into a manageable or constructive avenue. I think that is perfectly healthy, and I think too often we don't talk about something we're frustrated about, and then loop on our own (often errant or incomplete) understanding of the situation, and THAT is what causes more anger and negative emotion. Talking it through with a friend is the healthiest thing you can do in these situations, in my opinion.

Yes exactly; most of the frustration, at least that I experience, comes from the fact that conflict has nowhere to go and yet cannot quite be sorted out internally just yet. So it has to go outwards for pre-sorting first. The kind of "venting" that appears to be defined as taking out frustrations on a target isn't how I understood the OP at all.

 

[Wonkavision]

Hilarious.

People have twisted this issue into so many things its not, that it's impossible to even untangle it anymore.

It's just too absurd now!

Someone even quoted my statement about Edahn's 2 cents as an example of my nastiness and evil intentions. :rolli:

It was so obviously a joke and even included one of these:

There is NO objectivity, or respect, or sense of humor, or anything else resembling normal communication or understanding.

What a farce!