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[INFJ] INFJs and self-confidence

mochajava

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What do people think about INFJs and self-confidence? Are there any trends? I read Vicky Jo's website and "handbook for life" for INFJs, which can all be found here. There's some great stuff once you get past the quirky formatting. Anyway - she talks about INFJs and self-esteem, saying that it's often low. And other sites have said things like INFJs are most likely to seek out therapists in dealing with their lives (I can find it if anyone wants).

What do you all think? Is there a trend towards low self-confidence or self-esteem among INFJs?
 
G

Glycerine

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What do people think about INFJs and self-confidence? Are there any trends? I read Vicky Jo's website and "handbook for life" for INFJs, which can all be found here. There's some great stuff once you get past the quirky formatting. Anyway - she talks about INFJs and self-esteem, saying that it's often low. And other sites have said things like INFJs are most likely to seek out therapists in dealing with their lives (I can find it if anyone wants).

What do you all think? Is there a trend towards low self-confidence or self-esteem among INFJs?
I have a feeling that INFJ's tend to overanalyze things and problems and may have a harder time letting things go. This may lead to lower self-confidence.
 

Gloriana

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It seems so, especially for really young people who type INFJ. I think it probably related to how complex this type tends to be, and how misunderstood they are by the majority of folks around them. For me personally, it took me a very long time to realize the way I thought, felt, and did things wasn't necessarily 'wrong' or 'bad', it just wasn't common or everyday.

I readily admit I absolutely struggle with self-esteem issues and confidence. I think sometimes I prefer being alone because when I'm alone I'm understood and don't have to explain, justify, or defend my my approach to life. I get things done just like everyone else, I take care of my responsibilities just like everyone else, I spend time with those I love and care about just like everyone else. It's just I tend to do these things in very different ways.

I sometimes feel like it's me against an army when it comes time to go out into the world, and it can be very exhausting and painful in some cases to do so. With so many people reacting to my methods and preferences like I need to be 'cured', I really start wondering if I'm some weirdo. It's hard being one person up against the opinion of dozens of people. Feeling bad because other people react with rejection or criticism can easily bleed over into feeling bad about myself on my own - even if logically I know I just do things differently.

I often ponder "Well, what IS self esteem and confidence anyway?". There are stretches of time I can feel very confident about who I am and how I do things even with loads of people around me not understanding or criticizing. Still, I mean who wouldn't have trouble hanging on to that if left and right people just kept rejecting those things? I might logically know it's just their opinion and nothing is actually wrong with me, but the desire for acceptance and understanding from others is still there.

Also, I think INFJ might have the tendency for confidence issues - depression - anxiety because of how ever-present the thought processing IS and how intricately this type of person considers, thinks, evaluates, etc.
 

SilkRoad

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It has taken me quite a long time to develop self-confidence. I think it's a long slow process and part of maturing for an INFJ. I have found a surprising number of friends over the years who understand me quite well or at least make definite efforts to do so, and that has helped a lot in making me realise that there's nothing wrong with me and in fact there's a lot right with me.

I even say this to people sometimes - I was much more shy and withdrawn when I was younger. I think I am still shy, withdrawn and afraid of being hurt. I have just developed a lot of coping mechanisms and ways of dealing with being shy, and better social skills - and as a result, apparently I even look like quite an outgoing person. ;) And the coping mechanisms, etc aren't purely a facade. It doesn't mean you have to stop being an introvert or force yourself to be something you aren't - it just opens up more possibilities to you.
 

ItsAGuy

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I have a feeling that INFJ's tend to overanalyze things and problems and may have a harder time letting things go. This may lead to lower self-confidence.

I also think our internet intensity (which could be a force for good) often scares people away or is TOO much of a mystery for most to want to bother with, and that only worsens the issue; leading to further thoughts and struggles and so on and so forth. I often end up wondering what it is that's so wrong about me that I can get so little attention or interest from others... and I need both, and for both to be genuinely given (as my seeking it out makes me feel as if anything I get isn't real.)
 

mochajava

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From Gloriana:
For me personally, it took me a very long time to realize the way I thought, felt, and did things wasn't necessarily 'wrong' or 'bad', it just wasn't common or everyday.
This is true for me as well. Part of it might be cultural context, but I remember being told things like "why can't you be more easygoing like your sister?" and being called "sensitive" as though it were a bad thing (by my parents who tested HSP!) That was quite hurtful, for sure.

From Gloriana:
Also, I think INFJ might have the tendency for confidence issues - depression - anxiety because of how ever-present the thought processing IS and how intricately this type of person considers, thinks, evaluates, etc.
So true. My friends will say things like, "I'm applying to medical school!" and their GPA, activities, MCAT study techniques (or lack thereof) and essay that I've just edited will come to mind. I get scared they don't have a chance. They, however, are blithely confident. Is it possible that they are just not thinking about these issues? I thought it had to do with race/upbringing -- if he/she was constantly affirmed as a kid, he/she tends to assume that I have an interest in everything he/she says... This type of behavior can be a big trigger for me, reminding me of my own lack of self-confidence because I would NEVER go on talking about something without some positive input from the person w/ whom I was speaking.

Sometimes all of these things make me question if part of my introversion is driven by the fact that being alone is that it's the safest way to be... not as much criticism, judgment, or Fe when you're on your own.

ItsAGuy:
I also think our internet intensity (which could be a force for good) often scares people away or is TOO much of a mystery for most to want to bother with, and that only worsens the issue; leading to further thoughts and struggles and so on and so forth.

Nice avatar, ItsAGUy, and welcome to the forum! Thanks for responding to my query -- can you explain what you mean by internet intensity? (Like my TWO blogs, mayhap?).

Thanks, SilkRoad. Hm - not sure how personal to get, but - I think that my social skills are pretty good? No one thinks of me as shy for many years... people do think of me as social or outgoing (it always freaks me out when I hear this though). My energy gets tapped out quick, but it's good while it's there.

I guess there's an INFJ lack of self-confidence, which can come from just feeling and being so darned different growing up (which we are). And INFJs, I think, do analyze and then get told "you think too much". No, I just think how much I think... please meet me in the middle!

Do you think INFJs respond worse to abusive situations than other types? Or worse to depression triggers? I recall someone saying on the forum that "Many INFJs seem to have a history of abuse" and I was like, "wait - that would mean one causes this other, otherwise probably would say abuse is no more common for INFJs than others".
 

SilkRoad

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Thanks, SilkRoad. Hm - not sure how personal to get, but - I think that my social skills are pretty good? No one thinks of me as shy for many years... people do think of me as social or outgoing (it always freaks me out when I hear this though). My energy gets tapped out quick, but it's good while it's there.

Yup, pretty much exactly the same for me :)

Sometimes all of these things make me question if part of my introversion is driven by the fact that being alone is that it's the safest way to be... not as much criticism, judgment, or Fe when you're on your own.

EDIT: I relate to this as well. I am really torn between a fear of getting hurt (and it is a fear, because it is so damn painful and debilitating) by others, and needing to reach out to others and remind myself that most people in my life don't hurt me, or not much.
 

ItsAGuy

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Nice avatar, ItsAGUy, and welcome to the forum! Thanks for responding to my query -- can you explain what you mean by internet intensity? (Like my TWO blogs, mayhap?).

ACTUALLY, I meant internal, not internet... didn't even notice the slip.

"Many INFJs seem to have a history of abuse" and I was like, "wait - that would mean one causes this other, otherwise probably would say abuse is no more common for INFJs than others".

I certainly had a stable and kind family, but perhaps all the isolation and taunting and cruelty from other kids in school could be considered abuse. But I suspect that comes from being the smart kid INFJ than being the smart kid INFJ comes from it.
 

Rachel

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From Gloriana: This is true for me as well. Part of it might be cultural context, but I remember being told things like "why can't you be more easygoing like your sister?" and being called "sensitive" as though it were a bad thing (by my parents who tested HSP!) That was quite hurtful, for sure.

From Gloriana: So true. My friends will say things like, "I'm applying to medical school!" and their GPA, activities, MCAT study techniques (or lack thereof) and essay that I've just edited will come to mind. I get scared they don't have a chance. They, however, are blithely confident. Is it possible that they are just not thinking about these issues? I thought it had to do with race/upbringing -- if he/she was constantly affirmed as a kid, he/she tends to assume that I have an interest in everything he/she says... This type of behavior can be a big trigger for me, reminding me of my own lack of self-confidence because I would NEVER go on talking about something without some positive input from the person w/ whom I was speaking.


Yeah, i have a friend who is very similar. I think she is INFP but not sure. And i'm often curious/annoyed at how positively confident she is, even when she's completely wrong. Funny thing is, my friend tried for a program, and was very unrealistic about her chances of getting in, and she didn't get in unfortunately. I knew her chances were slim, because she underestimated what it took to get in. I knew this because i was already in a similar kind of program and on occasion gave her advice/tips about what's important when applying. But she was naive. She wanted to be accepted with whatever she applied with, which wasn't enough.

I know this very arrogant/self-righteous in the way i'm relating her story, but it reminds me of the contrast between us. I just can't see myself expecting things to automatically work out just because i want them to. I can't pretend or walk around in a daze of positive or blind self confidence. I think this is because i'm always wondering "what if . . . if it doesn't pan out the way i think." I'm going to be very disappointed if i've built up my expectations only to have them knocked down.

Probably not the best approach to success and i know my criticisms of my friend are unfair, but i mentioned it to illustrate the point that as a friend, i'd want someone's input just to make sure i'm seeing the bigger picture. It feels a bit misguided to walk around in blind faith.
 

Sailboat

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It seems so, especially for really young people who type INFJ. I think it probably related to how complex this type tends to be, and how misunderstood they are by the majority of folks around them. For me personally, it took me a very long time to realize the way I thought, felt, and did things wasn't necessarily 'wrong' or 'bad', it just wasn't common or everyday.

I readily admit I absolutely struggle with self-esteem issues and confidence. I think sometimes I prefer being alone because when I'm alone I'm understood and don't have to explain, justify, or defend my my approach to life. I get things done just like everyone else, I take care of my responsibilities just like everyone else, I spend time with those I love and care about just like everyone else. It's just I tend to do these things in very different ways.

I sometimes feel like it's me against an army when it comes time to go out into the world, and it can be very exhausting and painful in some cases to do so. With so many people reacting to my methods and preferences like I need to be 'cured', I really start wondering if I'm some weirdo. It's hard being one person up against the opinion of dozens of people. Feeling bad because other people react with rejection or criticism can easily bleed over into feeling bad about myself on my own - even if logically I know I just do things differently.

I often ponder "Well, what IS self esteem and confidence anyway?". There are stretches of time I can feel very confident about who I am and how I do things even with loads of people around me not understanding or criticizing. Still, I mean who wouldn't have trouble hanging on to that if left and right people just kept rejecting those things? I might logically know it's just their opinion and nothing is actually wrong with me, but the desire for acceptance and understanding from others is still there.

Also, I think INFJ might have the tendency for confidence issues - depression - anxiety because of how ever-present the thought processing IS and how intricately this type of person considers, thinks, evaluates, etc.

Can you explain some of the different ways? I'd like to compare them to my own.
 

Fenekk

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My self-confidence and self-esteem are complicated and hard to explain. My self-esteem was low early on in life; it was something that had to develop when I understood that there was no reason for me to have low self-esteem.

My self-confidence on the other hand is weird because I typically feel good about what I do with positive feedback. I can either be very confident about it from the start and feel worse when I get negative feedback, or sometimes be negative about the result but then I find people telling me I sell myself short. This is especially true with my artwork. Since graphic design's whole principle is based upon how others feel about it, you have to get feedback and make sure that everything appears to make sense to the average person. Sometimes we as artists view things in a different order or manner than the rest of the world so something may not make sense to us, but will make sense to the average person and it is the best solution, even though we don't understand it - That alone really gets to my self-confidence.
 

cascadeco

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It seems so, especially for really young people who type INFJ. I think it probably related to how complex this type tends to be, and how misunderstood they are by the majority of folks around them. For me personally, it took me a very long time to realize the way I thought, felt, and did things wasn't necessarily 'wrong' or 'bad', it just wasn't common or everyday.

For myself, I relate to it taking me a long time to realize that how I am is perfectly ok - took me a long while to stop labeling various aspects of my essence 'wrong'. However, I don't really relate to feeling misunderstood by others; although I did feel that others were constantly making fun of me, even though I now believe most of that was paranoia. I grew up observing that I in fact WAS different from others in many key ways, and as a result I couldn't figure out how to 'be me' in the context of interacting with other people, when I in fact didn't understand how/why other people operated the way they did. Hmm.. as I'm typing this out, I find that interesting... that I didn't feel misunderstood by others as a child/teenager, I in fact was the one who didn't 'get' how others could behave the way they did or care about/prioritize what they did. I just couldn't relate to the majority of my peers; I think that's the essence of it. And because I couldn't relate, I withdrew and pushed everyone away. My withdrawal meant I never gave people the opportunity to misunderstand.

I also internalized a lot and created a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy in terms of my thinking others didn't like me. I completely withdrew and had no confidence in my ability to interact with, or be liked by or desirable to others. So, I had very low confidence in my ability to interact socially with others and be 'part of' a social group; however, I had quite a lot of confidence in terms of my *abilities*. Basically, was confident in what I was capable of, as an individual, but zero confidence with my place/role in society at large, and ability to have actual relationships with people.

I worked through the bulk of that in my 20's.

I don't really think a lot of this has anything to do with being INFJ-specific; if anything, maybe INxx, or for myself tying in the enneagram 5 stuff. But, I think all INxx's experience issues similar to all of this, in their own ways.

Fenekk said:
My self-confidence on the other hand is weird because I typically feel good about what I do with positive feedback. I can either be very confident about it from the start and feel worse when I get negative feedback, or sometimes be negative about the result but then I find people telling me I sell myself short.

I relate a lot to this, and it bothers me that my self confidence has a direct correlation to what others think of me and the feedback that I get. But actually, I think I'm more bothered by lack of ANY feedback than negative. Lack of any can deplete my confidence much, much faster as I start overanalyzing things. Negative is something I can actually work with and use.
 

Fenekk

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I relate a lot to this, and it bothers me that my self confidence has a direct correlation to what others think of me and the feedback that I get. But actually, I think I'm more bothered by lack of ANY feedback than negative. Lack of any can deplete my confidence much, much faster as I start overanalyzing things. Negative is something I can actually work with and use.

Yep, no feedback is bad feedback. ;)
 

chelsea

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High-Self Esteem

I've always tested as an INFJ and have always had high self esteem. I have my bouts with depression and doubts about fitting in and/or my physical appearance but I've never had issues with my actual self esteem.

Before I realized that I am just fine the way I am I was frustrated and felt that if people were able to see the real me I would fit in better. It wasn't until my late teens that I realized I didn't need to fit in and that being complex and different is okay and that not everyone needs to understand me.

Even when I felt like I didn't fit in and that I needed to fit in (typical of being a teenager) I still felt good about myself. I didn't feel like I needed to change myself, rather, I felt as though if people got to know me they would like me (which is true I feel.)

Growing up I felt pressured to be more extroverted but I don't ever recall feeling like there was anything wrong with me, just again a need to be understood/fit in.

This was an incredibly round-about way of saying no, in fact I have high self esteem :). Nonetheless, in a society such as America that seems to value extroversion it's not surprising that an introvert, especially a sensitive one, would develop low self esteem.
 

ItsAGuy

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This was an incredibly round-about way of saying no, in fact I have high self esteem :). Nonetheless, in a society such as America that seems to value extroversion it's not surprising that an introvert, especially a sensitive one, would develop low self esteem.

I can kinda-sorta relate to all this in that I do think I'm a good thing inside; I think my qualities outweigh my difficulties; but still, this doesn't translate beyond the skin apparently, and it does hurt to be so easily sidelined by everyone else. I shouldn't have to pretend to be different just to be accepted or wanted.
 

The Outsider

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In my experience, INFJs are prone to vanity.
 

SecondBest

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As bizzarre as it might sound, it's actually refreshing for me to hear that INFJs can have confidence issues because there have been a few close INFJs I've had in my life who could not be more arrogant. Though I'd agree somewhat with Outsider's comment about vanity, it's really pride in my real-life INFJs that have struck a chord with me. The ones I've known, will at no cost, give up their own sense of pride for any reason whatsoever, which makes it extremely difficult for me to get as close to them as I'd like. In the end, I gave up.

But coming to this forum, I'm glad to have met INFJs who are more willing to be vulnerable.

P.S. I also remember reading this one MBTI profile site that labeled INFJs as the "genius" type. I find this problematic for a lot of reasons, though INFJs definitely can be geniuses, but really? On a personality profile page you describe one personality type as the "genius" type? Gee? I wonder what personality type the person writing the INFJ profile is?
 
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chelsea

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I can kinda-sorta relate to all this in that I do think I'm a good thing inside; I think my qualities outweigh my difficulties; but still, this doesn't translate beyond the skin apparently, and it does hurt to be so easily sidelined by everyone else. I shouldn't have to pretend to be different just to be accepted or wanted.

I agree, we shouldn't have to change in order to be accepted or wanted. Unfortunately or in my opinion fortunately :) being introverted, complex and rare doesn't always lend itself to popularity. Sometimes, well, many times, people misjudge us (and many other types I'm sure) or pass us by assuming that we don't want to talk to them or mistake not being talkative with not being friendly. Either way it's not personal and it just is what it is.

I think if you're at all outside the norm/average, you have to decide whether or not you're going to see it as a weakness or a strength. I firmly believe that who I am is a strength and because of that (and my personal faith) I am confident.

Now INFJ's being prone to vanity...I don't know about that. I'd imagine any type could be vain, but whether or not a type is prone to it I'm not sure. I'd say the same for arrogance as well. In regards to arrogance: I can't say of course about the people you mentioned, but I can say that for myself I've struggled with a fear of being wrong. Growing up I had a terrible fear of being wrong, as if being wrong or being found to be wrong meant that I was being attacked and I took it terribly personally. A fear of criticism really, which I have read (I think) can be common among Infj's. Now of course the people in question may just be arrogant, but it may also be what I described. I've worked very hard in this and am now able to admit when I'm wrong and not take it so personally, although I still do take it personally, just not as much. I still detest conflict.

I do know though that for me personally I do carry myself with a level of confidence that may be seen as arrogance, though I haven't been told that since high school when someone thought I was "snotty" because I was quiet. Go figure! :) Some people even think I'm more extraverted than I am (I'm very much an introvert) because I do have good social skills and I joke around quite a bit, especially when I'm nervous. I think it's sometimes assumed that if you're introverted you don't have social skills which is far from the truth.

Anywhoodle, not to sound too after-school special-y, having self-confidence really does have to come from within because, as you can see, humans make a great deal of assumptions and a great deal of incorrect ones. Basing our self worth on what other people think is futile. Now go and hug yourself :D
 

ItsAGuy

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Regarding vanity or arrogance, couldn't both of those be misconceptions by others outside the brain of any given INFJ? When I do state an opinion, in my mind, it's only natural that anyone else simply understand that. This is a perspective, it is being offered, and should not be considered as trumping your own. But I could potentially see that, in combination with our generic silence and the keeping-our-feelings-from-burdening-others methodologies, such could be perceive as either vanity or arrogance, albeit in error.

Just a thought.

Quoth Chelsea:

Unfortunately or in my opinion fortunately being introverted, complex and rare doesn't always lend itself to popularity.

I don't care about popularity... it would probably freak me out, actually. Still, I've always had a great difficulty forming bonds, and when they get ripped up (say, by being moved as a child or by being moved as an adult by work requirements), it's like having the world destroyed over and over. I was moved about 4 months ago (again) and I've yet to discover one new sustaining bond... the only really good one I have left is with someone I only get to see once a year at the most.
 

chelsea

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Regarding vanity or arrogance, couldn't both of those be misconceptions by others outside the brain of any given INFJ? When I do state an opinion, in my mind, it's only natural that anyone else simply understand that. This is a perspective, it is being offered, and should not be considered as trumping your own. But I could potentially see that, in combination with our generic silence and the keeping-our-feelings-from-burdening-others methodologies, such could be perceive as either vanity or arrogance, albeit in error.

That's an excellent point and I think you may be right.

Just a thought.



I don't care about popularity... it would probably freak me out, actually. Still, I've always had a great difficulty forming bonds, and when they get ripped up (say, by being moved as a child or by being moved as an adult by work requirements), it's like having the world destroyed over and over. I was moved about 4 months ago (again) and I've yet to discover one new sustaining bond... the only really good one I have left is with someone I only get to see once a year at the most.

Ah okay, I get what you're saying. I don't seek to be popular either, but deep, sustaining relationships are important to me, rather than the superficial, fleeting ones. It seems though, at least in my experience, that many people are content with these types of relationships (which there's nothing wrong with) and can be put off if one tries to get too deep.

I assume that it takes a great deal of energy for you to open up to others, and a great deal of trust, so that when you do it really means something. It is difficult to find these people though.

So are you saying essentially that your self esteem is lower because of your lack of deep bonds with others?
 
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