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[MBTI General] Logic ----> Confidence ?

cheerchick23

New member
Joined
Mar 6, 2009
Messages
59
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
Ne
So, I was always a kind of shy child, always knew my place and usually cowered in front of authority (making me a bit of a teacher's pet ;) ). This led to an attitude of people-pleasing, not wanting to upset anyone or throw off social balance, etc. so I always had some semi-insecure feelings and habits. I am now a very outgoing, bubbly, silly ENFP around people I know... but I still harbor some of those tendencies.

A few weeks ago, I went on a trip and was constantly thrown into rooms full of strangers who I'd never met and would never see again, and every time I assumed my position of awkward inferiority. One day, however, (I don't know what led me to it) I realized... why the hell should I be doing this? I could rip off my clothes and do the chicken dance in front of these people and it wouldn't really matter! I'm never seeing them again... so, rationally, why not be this confident vixen who I'd like to be instead of some unassuming awkward bystander? I thought all this out quite analytically, and in doing so, figured out that there is no logical reason why anyone should feel inferior (especially with strangers who will never be seen again) and I felt so much more confident. When I got home it stayed and it has basically changed my world view...

Anyone ever felt something like this or had a similar experience? I found it quite fascinating :)
 

/DG/

silentigata ano (profile)
Joined
Mar 19, 2009
Messages
4,602
Nice epiphany there. :D Yeah... I figured out that you don't have to care what people think of you when you're out with strangers also. It's really a great feeling... now if only I can apply that with people I already know, things would be great...
 

You

New member
Joined
Jun 8, 2010
Messages
2,124
MBTI Type
entp
Enneagram
7w8
Not so easy with folks you know.
 

Chloe

New member
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
2,196
Anyone ever felt something like this or had a similar experience? I found it quite fascinating :)

Feeling of inferiority.. low confidence.. etc.. usually come from how you feel about yourself, mostly unconsciously. Little of it can be changed with logic and reasoning. Proof are so many people who go for years to therapies where they over and over again talk and conclude on cognitive level that they are not wrong, unworthy etc. but they keep going back to the old patterns and old views of themselves, because those beliefs about yourself are mostly subconscious, on conscious level you know you feel less-than but feelings are there, you can change your mind but you cant change your feelings, not with logic.

Logic works only when you have slightly feeling of being inferior..
 

cheerchick23

New member
Joined
Mar 6, 2009
Messages
59
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
Ne
"Logic works only when you have slightly feeling of being inferior.. "

This was mainly how I was. I'm quite a confident person, just harbored some old tendencies of feeling awkward sometimes! It wasn't like I walked into every situation with my tail between my legs and knees shaking hahaha

:)
 

mochajava

New member
Joined
Jul 28, 2010
Messages
475
MBTI Type
INFJ
This was really well-said. Logic works, but only so far since it can't reach your unconscious mind...

Feeling of inferiority.. low confidence.. etc.. usually come from how you feel about yourself, mostly unconsciously. Little of it can be changed with logic and reasoning. Proof are so many people who go for years to therapies where they over and over again talk and conclude on cognitive level that they are not wrong, unworthy etc. but they keep going back to the old patterns and old views of themselves, because those beliefs about yourself are mostly subconscious, on conscious level you know you feel less-than but feelings are there, you can change your mind but you cant change your feelings, not with logic.

Logic works only when you have slightly feeling of being inferior..
 

skylights

i love
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
7,756
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
awesome epiphany.

i agree, LOVE strangers. love having the opportunity to create a totally new me and to be fairly uninhibited. i also love being in a room with no one i know because no one is there to criticize me for acting in a way they think "isn't me", or isn't appropriate.

agree with Chloe too though, there's only so far logic can go. i have those same shy people-pleasing tendencies and they do have their root in insecurity about myself. the question is, if you do find yourself being disliked or reject by these new people, how does it feel? are you okay with it? if you are, then huge props. that's still one i'm working on.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
19,769
Congratulations , and welcome to the dark side.

As for experiance I am like this since I was a baby. Sometimes I did not care even if I really should have. If I can see the benefit of bing nice I will nice. Bur going around and want to please strangers I will probably never see again seems .......... (you know)

But i am pretty far from being a ENFP. So I am presuming all of this does not coun't actually.


Anyway, this newly found logic of yours trully didn't make any sense at all before now ?
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
Feeling of inferiority.. low confidence.. etc.. usually come from how you feel about yourself, mostly unconsciously. Little of it can be changed with logic and reasoning. Proof are so many people who go for years to therapies where they over and over again talk and conclude on cognitive level that they are not wrong, unworthy etc. but they keep going back to the old patterns and old views of themselves, because those beliefs about yourself are mostly subconscious, on conscious level you know you feel less-than but feelings are there, you can change your mind but you cant change your feelings, not with logic.

Logic works only when you have slightly feeling of being inferior..

yeah I totally agree. I seem to have really low self-confidence and always cower to people that are arguing with me and tend to agree in the end. However, once I truly think about it, I end up thinking "woah, they really were idiotic in their logic and I was right". I notice that I do that on here sometimes.
 

MrRandom

New member
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Messages
151
MBTI Type
INFJ
A couple of times when I've been with strangers somewhere, I've lied about my name and occupation, etc. It felt kind of awkward and nice at the same time. I could reinvent myself without consequences. I didn't change much of my personality, though. It was still difficult to let go of it. But anyway, strangers provide a good opportunity to look at yourself more objectively.
 

Vamp

New member
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
579
MBTI Type
ENFP
So, I was always a kind of shy child, always knew my place and usually cowered in front of authority (making me a bit of a teacher's pet ;) ). This led to an attitude of people-pleasing, not wanting to upset anyone or throw off social balance, etc. so I always had some semi-insecure feelings and habits. I am now a very outgoing, bubbly, silly ENFP around people I know... but I still harbor some of those tendencies.

A few weeks ago, I went on a trip and was constantly thrown into rooms full of strangers who I'd never met and would never see again, and every time I assumed my position of awkward inferiority. One day, however, (I don't know what led me to it) I realized... why the hell should I be doing this? I could rip off my clothes and do the chicken dance in front of these people and it wouldn't really matter! I'm never seeing them again... so, rationally, why not be this confident vixen who I'd like to be instead of some unassuming awkward bystander? I thought all this out quite analytically, and in doing so, figured out that there is no logical reason why anyone should feel inferior (especially with strangers who will never be seen again) and I felt so much more confident. When I got home it stayed and it has basically changed my world view...

Anyone ever felt something like this or had a similar experience? I found it quite fascinating :)

I had the same kind of epiphany less than a year ago. I would always assume the position of awkward inferiority (or just plain invisible since I had no time/use for people once I got past my inferiority complex) until I started to think about self actualization and why I was crippling my own potential. I decided to be the person I want to be instead of dreaming of it. What's the point if I'm going to exist half way instead of going all the way?

Logic, pragmatism is my main vehicle of self improvement and it works better for me than anything else. KISS really does work. Sometimes there's no need to over analyze and all the need to actualize.

I love pragmatism in the internal world.
 
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Chloe

New member
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
2,196
I had the same kind of epiphany less than a year ago. I would always assume the position of awkward inferiority (or just plain invisible since I had no time/use for people once I got past my inferiority complex) until I started to think about self actualization and why I was crippling my own potential. I decided to be the person I want to be instead of dreaming of it. What's the point if I'm going to exist half way instead of going all the way?

Exactly. Not long ago I also came to this decision: there is no point in living a life if you live only half life. I am bored of it and tired of it. And looking around myself, it's so sad how many people remain like that their whole lifes, living half life. Always being stressed, striving for something that you cant have, fighting lost battles... :yes:

Pitseleh said:
yeah I totally agree. I seem to have really low self-confidence and always cower to people that are arguing with me and tend to agree in the end. However, once I truly think about it, I end up thinking "woah, they really were idiotic in their logic and I was right". I notice that I do that on here sometimes.

Well.. I am not sure exactly about what you are talking about?
But if it's what I mean it it is, I know, same here.. but I dont think it's necessary always a bad thing, it has also something with being NF, we have different goals than NTs (if you are talking about arguing with NTs).. also sometimes the issue is not important and the other person is too convinced about being right, I can not claim that I am convinced about many things, I can always change my mind, I think it has much to do with nature not only confidence.. like when I have reviewed all options, when I considered everything... it's hard to make up my mind on something.

About unconscious... there are good methods to reach it, and process emotions, but its hard.
 

mochajava

New member
Joined
Jul 28, 2010
Messages
475
MBTI Type
INFJ
yeah I totally agree. I seem to have really low self-confidence and always cower to people that are arguing with me and tend to agree in the end. However, once I truly think about it, I end up thinking "woah, they really were idiotic in their logic and I was right". I notice that I do that on here sometimes.

I'm the same way. Particularly around Te or INTPs.
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
Well.. I am not sure exactly about what you are talking about?
But if it's what I mean it it is, I know, same here.. but I dont think it's necessary always a bad thing, it has also something with being NF, we have different goals than NTs (if you are talking about arguing with NTs).. also sometimes the issue is not important and the other person is too convinced about being right, I can not claim that I am convinced about many things, I can always change my mind, I think it has much to do with nature not only confidence.. like when I have reviewed all options, when I considered everything... it's hard to make up my mind on something.

About unconscious... there are good methods to reach it, and process emotions, but its hard.
Well, I was saying that I agreed with you that being "logical" will only bring you confidence if you are only a little shaken in your confidence. I told you that anecdote to show how it relates to me. I was talking about how when people in general (not particularly NTs) start arguing when I am pretty sure about my logic and I start cowering to them in the end because I am insecure about most things. However, after I think about it, it turns out that I was right much of time.
 
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