• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[ENFP] Common ENFP issues

Dreamer

Potential is My Addiction
Joined
Jul 26, 2015
Messages
4,539
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
794
In my case, there is a lot of history attached to it as I grew up with several NTPs, which left its...well, mark on me.:)

These days, I can get on with ENTPs just fine, but it especially helps once you get to know them a bit. It can be hard to gauge what their 'jokes' exactly mean, and for me, understanding what the other person values (and figuring out exactly how harmful they are to others) is paramount. It is a lot easier to laugh and joke around with them once you actually know where you stand with them, in my experience.

I've found that their 'trolling' can be a mutual 'inside' joke between them and their 'target', and once I realise that, I have absolutely no problems with it, but due to my past, I tend to be acutely aware of anyone not respecting a 'no' from the other person, instead trying to one-up them, even if the other party isn't interested in playing the game. Hand in hand with that goes the tendency to only value intelligence and logic, above all else, and looking down on those that 'arent up to their standard', as such. And from that, a tendency to 'dehumanize' and 'revoke their respect as it has to be earned' for some reason, even down to the most basic levels can crop up.

And that...I tend to react to pretty badly.

I understand wanting to play games. I understand playing devil's advocate - I do that myself plenty. I even understand being uncomfortable with vulnerability and not wanting to necessarily be near people who are vulnerable. What I don't understand (or rather, I do understand, but won't abide) is the belief that anyone who shows vulnerability is weak and must be 'taught a lesson' or destroyed, just because you yourself don't know how to handle vulnerability. Or the belief that others should learn to play your game, if they want to be able to stop you, as otherwise it's their fault that you get away with what you get away. That others should 'toughen up' instead of whine at you that you should stop harassing them.

Again...let me re-iterate, this is certainly NOT true for every ENTP out there. But it is this trait that I find the hardest to deal with and I have in the past, due to my history, taken their jokes as a sign of that trait being present, due to being unable to gauge whether they meant their jokes or not. These days, I try to reserve judgement and find out first, and get to know them. I'm also starting to get better at actually shifting my perspective and more reliably predicting when it's likely to be a joke. But it's still unnerving.

I tend to only joke around roughly with others that are actually *IN* on the joke and that know me well enough to know Im joking (or, I'll announce in big neon letters that I'm joking, to avoid any misunderstandings), so it can be uncomfortable to not be in the know. That said, I have no qualms whatsoever with 'playing rough' and will do so myself, once I'm familiar with the person and on good terms with them - that can be an absolute blast :)


...is this what you were looking for?

This is what I tell people all the time, including Brainy boy. If I tease you, it means I like you :D I just find it such a fun way to enjoy one another's company. Otherwise, I wouldn't troll someone or tease them because I don't yet understand their past, what they're all about, etc. It's not that I walk on eggshells around anyone I'm unfamiliar with, but it's more of a mutual respect thing for me. Simply said, I'll respect your feelings if you respect mine. I won't potentially trample over your values if you don't trample over mine, or least, make an attempt to understand me. It's actually a massive turn on (ok not sexually haha) if someone takes the time to learn of my perspective. I tend not to share it often and instead, find more interest in other's perspectives, so if someone does give me that pleasure, I'm theirs.

It can be a softspot of mine too, to be thought of as dumb or slow, so if some NT pokes fun at that side of me, some lack of "intellectual" prowess, you won't win any favors from me at all. It's not just about them feefees, but them feefees are VERY important in navigating the social realm and in understanding others. I almost feel sorry for those that overlook that potential. But these are just some typical F/T differences too.

I'm curious if you feel your growth around NTPs may have influenced you in some ways, in how you think and perceive the world? I grew up around NTJs, LOTS of engineers in my family too haha, so heavy-handed Te was basically force fed. I won't say that I have the Te of a dom or aux, but I do feel I can use it to my advantage when the time calls for it too. It's certainly aided how I communicate my thoughts to people too. I couldn't imagine what it would be like to translate the goobody goop up in my head if I didn't have some universal way to structure and deliver such thoughts!
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
This is what I tell people all the time, including Brainy boy. If I tease you, it means I like you :D I just find it such a fun way to enjoy one another's company. Otherwise, I wouldn't troll someone or tease them because I don't yet understand their past, what they're all about, etc. It's not that I walk on eggshells around anyone I'm unfamiliar with, but it's more of a mutual respect thing for me. Simply said, I'll respect your feelings if you respect mine. I won't potentially trample over your values if you don't trample over mine, or least, make an attempt to understand me. It's actually a massive turn on (ok not sexually haha) if someone takes the time to learn of my perspective. I tend not to share it often and instead, find more interest in other's perspectives, so if someone does give me that pleasure, I'm theirs.

It can be a softspot of mine too, to be thought of as dumb or slow, so if some NT pokes fun at that side of me, some lack of "intellectual" prowess, you won't win any favors from me at all. It's not just about them feefees, but them feefees are VERY important in navigating the social realm and in understanding others. I almost feel sorry for those that overlook that potential. But these are just some typical F/T differences too.

I'm curious if you feel your growth around NTPs may have influenced you in some ways, in how you think and perceive the world? I grew up around NTJs, LOTS of engineers in my family too haha, so heavy-handed Te was basically force fed. I won't say that I have the Te of a dom or aux, but I do feel I can use it to my advantage when the time calls for it too. It's certainly aided how I communicate my thoughts to people too. I couldn't imagine what it would be like to translate the goobody goop up in my head if I didn't have some universal way to structure and deliver such thoughts!

That's great - it does sound like a great advantage :)

Let's just say that in my case...it very much shaped who I am, but it took a long time before I figured out how to actually capitalise on it. The bolded was, well, how you could describe my childhood, so it pretty much killed my self-esteem and my FiTe, at the time. Don't get me wrong - they loved me...they just..couldn't see the value in how I approached life - and they weren't exactly shy about driving that point home.
 

Rebeka

New member
Joined
Oct 26, 2016
Messages
49
MBTI Type
ENFP
I can't see Flirtin, Attention Whoring or Leading People On in me at all.

I don't know how to flirt (and no one has every thought I was flirting with them), I'm very aware of when I'd be perceived as an attention whore in most situations (although I will allow myself to bask in attention from time to time like everyone else) and I never lead anyone on.

I'm very self-aware though, something I wrongly assume most other ENFPs to be. Maybe it's just because I have a high usage of Fi.

Actually the attention whore is something defines me incredibly. I cannot have the enough sensibility to notice some social rules of behaviour sometimes.. and tend to strongly clash with sfj people... ofc i never mean to cause struggle but i notice some of these people angry with me very often, and I never get to exactly know why
 

Red Memories

Haunted Echoes
Joined
Jun 3, 2017
Messages
6,315
MBTI Type
ESFP
Enneagram
215
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
*when you relate to half of these issues but you're not an ENFP* XD
 

hpdean

New member
Joined
Jun 17, 2017
Messages
4
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
9w3
This is super spot on, sometimes I start to drift away from feeling like I'm actually an ENFP & then I'll see something like this & BOOM it hits me just how much of an ENFP I really am. I do every single one of these things, & it's funny because a lot of these traits (especially attention whoring, talking about ME, coming across as shallow, etc.) are congruent with my personality disorder (Histrionic Personality Disorder), so then I start to wonder, maybe...just maybe, is there a relationship between the two?

Are some personality types more susceptible to personality disorders, or are people with personality disorders outliers in the world of personality types in that their personality disorder determines their type rather than the other way round?

But anyways, awesome analysis!! Super spot on and in depth! :D
 

Red Memories

Haunted Echoes
Joined
Jun 3, 2017
Messages
6,315
MBTI Type
ESFP
Enneagram
215
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I related to so much ENFP stuff after relating to this and reading more that I figured I would see if anyone says I am not an ENFP. :p
 

Forever_Jung

Active member
Joined
May 23, 2009
Messages
2,644
MBTI Type
ESFJ
ENFP Issue: When you breathe life/pixie dust onto people/situations, and then they enjoy it so much they lock you in a cage. Then they wonder why you're sad and not sprinkling dust anymore.

One of the most common things I hear from people: (some variation of) "I wish I could take you home with me and you could just follow me around and entertain me all day."

I know they think of it as a compliment, but I couldn't imagine a worse fate.
 

burningranger

Ambience seeker
Joined
Aug 3, 2017
Messages
248
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Are some personality types more susceptible to personality disorders, or are people with personality disorders outliers in the world of personality types in that their personality disorder determines their type rather than the other way round?

No, it's just that personality disorders are a load of crap of people who were too lazy to understand what was happening and create a label to explain the behaviour. Grrr....I can't say how much it angers me for people to buy a label about themselves for a whole lifetime because some asshole thought it was enough. It then becomes a self-fuilling prophecy and an IDENTITY for that person...and then dig themselves a whole thinking there is something wrong with them.

Always, always question medical labels. Specially labels created by a medical science that has been, for the most part, unable to offer real long term solutions to any given problem.

Until our medical communitty undesrtand the nature of the mind, and what REALLY is at the heart of our mental and emotional state....people are liable to make a lot of really crass mistakes that will harm people. Don't get me started on stuff like clinical depression and brain chemicals n stuff.
 

Dreamer

Potential is My Addiction
Joined
Jul 26, 2015
Messages
4,539
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
794
Though unsure of my E/I, I will gladly try and oblige your request, Fidelia, as I do believe that your thread was and still is in more than one way illuminating.

Fellow ENFP's, if I name stuff that you don't identify with or I forget stuff..lemme know ;)
I'd like to encourage the other types to start their own thread..much can be gained from it.


Here goes:

Misunderstandings:

1) Weirdness. NeFi tends to give ENFPs a weird, zany kind of aura, making them come off as erratic, random, flaky, illogical and sometimes socially retarded, despite being so annoyingly likable. ENFPs tend to run circles around people and need to play with thoughts and ideas a bit before settling on a conclusion, to make sure they've seen it from all angles and to make sure it actually fits accurately into their inner world (or if their inner world needs adjusting). This playfulness can also be displayed just for fun, making it sometimes hard to see where the ENFP is going with a certain train of thought (if they're going somewhere at all with it). Rest assured though, there's always a motivation, drive and reason for it.

2)Heart on the sleeve. ENFPs connect through Fi and Fi usually doesn't waste time getting to know someone. It jumps to the intimate part of the conversation as that is who the person *really* is..which is what is relevant to Fi. And that tends to either go over extremely well, to the point where people just end up telling them their life stories and childhood trauma's or...really badly, as people just consider it rude, inappropriate and impolite, not to mention wayyy too intense

3) Flirting. Due to the ENFP tendency to jump right to the intimate part of the relationship (the need to get to know people for who they are) and them not receiving or losing the copy of the social guidelines manual, ENFPs are often perceived to be big flirts when they're actually just genuinly intrigued by people. (to avoid future derail on this, I'll admit that I too was like this but I have become a conscious flirt over time!)

4) Crude and insensitive. Their Ne can sometimes get ahead of them, causing them to toss out blunt things before socially filtering them and framing them better. This especially happens when they're overly excited about some new piece of information.

5) Attention whoring. Most ENFPs have no clue what they did wrong when they get accused of this and experience it as oppression of their right to express who they are. Once again, it's usually a clash of group values versus the need for authenticity, and a poor grasp of the social rules that is at the base of this. As they tend to experience things very profoundly, and they wear their hearts on their sleeves, the expression of these things can be perceived as an act of attention whoring, though most ENFPs don't have a clue how to play social games (once again, somehow we didn't get the manual :D), though this may vary depending on the ENFP's surroundings while growing up.

6) Making excuses and refusing to appologize. An ENFP will typically try to explain to the other person why they did something, not as a way to weasel out of the responsibility, but to increase understanding and harmony. Similarly, they will often not be aware of the fact that their transgression is once again in that social manual that everyone seems to know, and therefore not see it fit to actually appologize for something that to them was not intended in harm and in their eyes also didn't really harm anyone.

7) Leading people on. As ENFPs tend to share intimate details easily with others, and often have others reciprocate, a misunderstanding can arise between the two people in that relationship as to the status of the other person. ENFPs tend to love easily and like spreading that love, making people feel loved and being loved in return. It creates a special harmony, a being in sync that's very pleasurable, as well as a bond which makes everyone feel safe. However, as time is limited and there are many people to get to know and love, it can put pressure on the already existing relationships. Also, Fi doesn't require frequent contact to keep this bond alive. This often leaves the other partner feeling hurt and rejected, while the ENFP's affection really hasn't waned at all. Similarly, it can give the illusion of a stronger bond than was intended by the ENFP:


8) Not being thoughtful, reliable or considered loyal. It hurts an ENFP more than anything to hear that. The thing is, since we're stuck with our heads up in the clouds and, we value our own private time, we're a tad oblivious and we don't wanna be intrusive. That can feel like we don't care. Nothing could be further from the truth though. Ask. You'll find that an ENFP is rarely too busy not to help you, but you do have to ask. As we tend to be very easy-going and change our plans on the go, it's rarely an inconvenience to help out a friend in need. It is only if I see someone is truly overwhelmed with emotion that I'll prod them myself, to see if I can help.

9) Always talking about ME. ENFPs tend to speak in the 'I'-person, because they experience everything in such an individualistic way. Add to that that we know most people find us weird and we don't wanna speak for others who might experience things different as we're often told that we're the outsiders anyways. On top of that there's a serious need to be understood as the desire to connect is there but clearly it's hard as we're weird :shock: This tends to grate people to no end, despite the good intentions of the ENFP as it seems to be all about 'him'. Also, we work with analogies a lot, which is our way of relating. When someone tells us something, the way to let them know that we understand what they're saying is by equally sharing a similar story. Quid pro quo basically. You tell me something about yourself and I'll sync up with you by sharing something similar about myself. This is the way to get to know each other. Unfortunately, we can get wrapped up in that process, and get overenthused in sharing...:blush:

10)
Tendencies:

1) Chaos, chaos, chaos. My god, do we live in a world of chaos. Plz don't ask me where my phone is, or my keys, though I will find things that I don't use that often easily in my mess. And there's no way I have the attention span to actually make a system and stick to it

2) Flakiness. Wherever the mood takes me, is where I go, making it hard to plan *anything* or not feel forced when I do agree to something when later I don't feel like it anymore

3) Indecisiveness/procrastination Too many damned options and all of the appealing, or worse..all of them not good enough! What's an ENFP to do except for wait, procrastinate and hope it another option presents itself!

4) Self-absorbed. Living with my head in the clouds, I don't always see what's going on around me, sorry, and I so don't know how to turn that off! Plz, if you need my help, I'll gladly give it to you, just tap me on the shoulder to get me back to reality though :doh:

5) Drama Queen. Fi can feel sooooo f*cking intense, it burns. The pain can be overwhelming. Unloading on others however...not very nice, however hard it can be to contain yourself. Learning social rules and having a close friend who understands you is a definite must.

6) Maintaining a network. My god, do I suck at that and does it drain me. But it is vital, if you care for your friends. I do my best to be there for my friends, but I warn them all in advance that if I ignore them, it's not on purpose and they just have to whack me harder over the head, coz I can be sometimes very hard to reach due to my obsession with new shiny and self-reflecting.

7) No follow-through whatsoever. This is suchhhh a pain. There's so much to do an d so little time to do it in that often, when we start a project and see where it should end up, but obstacles get in the way, we get impatient. And the next little bit of shiny is already tempting us. Since we're bogged down in the process and we've seen in our mind how it will likely end, it's just more alluring to figure out the next bit of shiny instead of waiting for things to come together :doh:

8) And then..when we do get into that 'Must follow through!'-phase..get out of our way. Yeah, I truly hate that one as well. It's the whole, 'This shit needs to be done and otherwise I'm just sitting around wasting my time so get the f*ck out of my way, now!' thing. Te. Since we're not exactly that good at it and cannot swing it around for that long (it's frigging tiresome!), most of us tend to have the finesse of a frigging bulldozer when wielding that thing. It just makes people run for cover. The second I invoke that, I'm beyond patience, and things better start happening, even if I have to ram things through people's throats, or start hitting a machine hard. It better be working, dammit! And the second there's the smallest hitch, the thing/person responsible is in serious trouble. This results in my tossing my phone somewhere hard, and freaking people out by the authoritive tone in my otherwise so chipper or calm voice. I've been told my eyes shoot thunderbolts and could kill a man the second I get that way. The reason for this is, I'm in a situation I don't wanna be in, I cannot avoid (see next point!) and I wanna get out, NOW! You're a moron if you stand in my way, seriously. End of discussion.

9) Avoidance. Man, I love that strategy. If I can avoid problemsolving, especially if it's somethign that requires a lot of work, energy or thinking things through, I will. If I can wing it, I'll take that over planning it out and going through it, as it's such an energy saver. Gets me in all kinds of trouble when I overestimate my capacity to wing it though :doh: (I'm slowly getting better at planning only a little while mixing it with winging it though :D)

10) Oversensitivity. Because an ENFP struggles to tame the Fi-beast, and the pain can be intense, it is very easy to cause emotional turmoil in an ENFP, especially when addressing the part of them that they're either very proud of in a negative way, or the parts that they're very insecure about. The reason for this is that the ENFP is already aware of this, or doesn't feel accepted, and it's like rubbing salt into a wound or denying them the right to be themselves. An ENFP is also unlikely to go push other peoples buttons like that, unless they're for some reason oblivious to them (Ne-hyperdrive) or angry with that person for some reason (Te-hammer, lethal at that point!), and will most of the time feel really guilty about doing so later and likely appologize for it. For that reason, they can very much overreact when someone does point out their flaws or talk about their person (or what they perceive to be a personal attack in any case), as they themselves would never cause anyone willingly that kind of harm. Little do/did they know that others don't have that same experience and therefore do not respond in the same way. Often, I would envy those that were able to take criticism so well, but for the life of me did not understand how they remained so calm under it all, or didn't consider it rude.

My own specific issues:

1) I really really hate what I perceive to be emotional guilttripping ( I grew up in a house of Fe-people, not all equally healthy). It makes me rebel beyond all reason. If you ask me to do something for you genuinly, I'll jump through every hoop to make it so, if I know it to be important to you. Whine that I haven't done it yet, while you didn't even ask, and I'll bend over backwards and cut my own throat before I give you what you want. I *am* working on this :blush:

2) I hate bureaucracy and housework with a vengeance. It is mindboggling boring, always comes back, you're never done with it and it doesn't gain me any satisfaction at all, not to mention it feels like something you get forced into again (see 1)). These days, I've found that if I need to mull things over, I just get started on a simple task that needs doing as well, that way I don't feel pressured for that task and I can put my mind to work on something else.

3) I *suck* at finding things. Like, seriously suck at it. I have my INTJ find it all for me, because, even if I bother, I'll go over a spot 4 times and still not find the item I need.

4) I love freedom but leadership can be draining on me. I rather be the 'right hand', as constantly having to think ahead, plan and direct people can be quite daunting.




Ok..I'm sure there's more, but I'll go hide under a rock for a while while this storm already starts up :peepwall:

I realize you started this in 2010, but I've only just NOW seen the first post to this amazing thread. I love your desccriptions here as they resonate so much with me, and the really interesting part of how you described the ENFP tendencies, is that you explain what exactly is going on in the mind of the ENFP that show the motivation behind these tendencies, and THAT's what I resonate with, not the outward persona of the ENFP type, but those inner workings behind the front. If only type descriptions went behind the facade as you've done here :)

This was a nice read after a long day at work. Thank you.
 

Poki

New member
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
10,436
MBTI Type
STP
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
Teflon - immature ones. Its when they can just dust tue world off as if its not their fault and no consequences and just skip off into the sunset ignoring all the lessons, the emotions, the details for a small subset of logic held onto that says..."its not my fault"
 

Abcdenfp

Terpsichore
Joined
May 19, 2017
Messages
1,669
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
7W8
ENFP Issue: When you breathe life/pixie dust onto people/situations, and then they enjoy it so much they lock you in a cage. Then they wonder why you're sad and not sprinkling dust anymore. One of the most common things I hear from people: (some variation of) "I wish I could take you home with me and you could just follow me around and entertain me all day." I know they think of it as a compliment, but I couldn't imagine a worse fate.
#ditto .. every time they pull out the cage I sigh , can't you just observe me in my natural habitat.
 

stoic

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2017
Messages
23
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
954
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
All the ENFP's I've encountered have been quite foolish. Although, they have such a passion for knowledge that it's hard not to fall in love with them as an INFJ.
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
All the ENFP's I've encountered have been quite foolish. Although, they have such a passion for knowledge that it's hard not to fall in love with them as an INFJ.

I guess thats why im always intrigued but then utterly turned off by most infjs i meet - their need to judge what they do not understand as foolish :shrug:

I ll admit to recently having met an exception to that rule. He does judge but he also questions and revisits that judgement and actually puts in the effort to understand and refine his judgement. Its quite adorable to watch and poke at :D
 

Forever_Jung

Active member
Joined
May 23, 2009
Messages
2,644
MBTI Type
ESFJ
I guess thats why im always intrigued but then utterly turned off by most infjs i meet - their need to judge what they do not understand as foolish :shrug:

I ll admit to recently having met an exception to that rule. He does judge but he also questions and revisits that judgement and actually puts in the effort to understand and refine his judgement. Its quite adorable to watch and poke at :D

I know it can hurt to be dismissed so summarily, but I think a lot of those "judgments" are usually more provisional/amenable than you think. It's just unless you are close to the INFJ, you don't really get to see an update on their beliefs down the road. I think that's what you're seeing in action right now with your exception. :D

I think most things happen too fast for them, because they have to consider a lot of info before they can decide anything. Have you ever had to make a decision that if you were forced to answer right away you would definitely say "no", but if you were allowed to take a while you might say yes? That's Ni-dom life.

I think it's just easier for them to reject and revisit, than it is to tear everything down and rebuild every time they encounter new info. In a way, it takes humility to modify your initial judgments so frequently.

That doesn't help you in real time though, if you know an INFJ who constantly shoots down your notions/interests/etc.
 

Lord Lavender

Bluered Trickster
Joined
Oct 21, 2016
Messages
5,851
MBTI Type
EVLF
Enneagram
739
Instinctual Variant
so/sp
A common ENFP problem is that you guys have the second rate dom Ne he he he he he unlike ENTPs who have the superior dom Ne :wink:.
 

stoic

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2017
Messages
23
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
954
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I guess thats why im always intrigued but then utterly turned off by most infjs i meet - their need to judge what they do not understand as foolish :shrug:

I ll admit to recently having met an exception to that rule. He does judge but he also questions and revisits that judgement and actually puts in the effort to understand and refine his judgement. Its quite adorable to watch and poke at :D

I think those predetermined judgments often stem from how reactionary and idealistic they can be. I always find myself rationalizing ENFP's thoughts, especially when they seem to just blurt out stuff(that might be a turbulent thing, idk). They're really free-spirited too. I'm a person of boundaries and I need time to myself. The ENFP's I've met normally have a hard time respecting that. They have a very childlike nature to them, one of which is fun to be around but not as interesting on an intellectual level as say the ENTP.
 

Qlip

Post Human Post
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
8,464
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
A common ENFP problem is that you guys have the second rate dom Ne he he he he he unlike ENTPs who have the superior dom Ne :wink:.

Our Ne goes into the 5th dimension, so you can't always see how high it bounces.
 

Starry

Active member
Joined
May 22, 2010
Messages
6,103
A common ENFP problem is that you guys have the second rate dom Ne he he he he he unlike ENTPs who have the superior dom Ne :wink:.



tumblr_nr56093Exn1utn1fuo1_500.gif
 
Top