[MBTI General] Do do do your dirty words come out to play when you are hurt?

[sculpting]

Many ENFPs will note that you should not back us in a corner.

It is a bad idea. If you push us hard enough, and hurt us deeply enough we can lash out and hurt you horrifically.

Jung pointed out we all carry "complexes" within us that seem to be combinations of unconscious functions. When under stress these unconscious aspects of our personality emerge to defend our egos. After we lash out, most ENFPs feel very remorseful and horrified by the hurt they have caused. It is something we dont tend to repeat often.

But always respect an ENFP if they ask for space or you will get cut.

 

[HollyGolightly]

Orobas I totally agree with you. My ENFP sister is like this.

After we lash out, most ENFPs feel very remorseful and horrified by the hurt they have caused. It is something we dont tend to repeat often.

Once she has realised she has hurt me (or anyone else for that matter) she is absolutely mortified. I always feel that ENFPs have a lot of bottled up emotion and if you push them enough..my god you will pay for it. And it's actually painful to watch as you know that they don't want to say these things (well this is the case with my ENFP sister anyways).

 

[Virtual ghost]

Many ENFPs will note that you should not back us in a corner.

It is a bad idea. If you push us hard enough, and hurt us deeply enough we can lash out and hurt you horrifically.


Jung pointed out we all carry "complexes" within us that seem to be combinations of unconscious functions. When under stress these unconscious aspects of our personality emerge to defend our egos. After we lash out, most ENFPs feel very remorseful and horrified by the hurt they have caused. It is something we dont tend to repeat often.

But always respect an ENFP if they ask for space or you will get cut.

Examples ?

 

[Unkindloving]

I have to be unbelievably hurt throughout a period of time or accosted by someone completely random/rude to throw out the retaliation, but it is intense. It doesn't take me long to weed out where a person's weak spots are, but the courtesy of a civil interaction or a normal level of argument is that i won't tread on those weak spots. It can sound terrible, but they are kept for future reference in a reserve. I've had enough situations where it's been pushed more than enough.

And what if a person is not hurt by anything you say ?

Then you're doing it wrong.
I believe everyone has their buttons and you just need to find the correct way to push them. I've had a few people act as if i didn't faze them in the slightest, but gradually deteriorate because of it.
Also, determining if it is worth the trouble to push those buttons. A number of people won't be selective over who they retaliate on and why. Not taking into account what may be unintentional.

 

[ReflecTcelfeR]

To those who have posted here and those yet to come:

Do you find yourselves starting the arguments, or are you usually antagonized first? When the regret of lashing out occurs is it because you realize the statement that they made wasn't as harsh as the retaliation you made? If this last question is true how quickly do you rebuild the relationship with the one in which you had the argument with?

 

[cafe]

I have to be pushed really, really hard before I say really mean stuff, usually.

I will snark if I'm cranky or frustrated, though. And I can give a pretty good third degree lecture when provoked.

 

[Phantonym]

To those who have posted here and those yet to come:

Do you find yourselves starting the arguments, or are you usually antagonized first? When the regret of lashing out occurs is it because you realize the statement that they made wasn't as harsh as the retaliation you made? If this last question is true how quickly do you rebuild the relationship with the one in which you had the argument with?

I rarely start arguments. I might push other people to start them if I'm frustrated enough by previous events.

As my agenda isn't mostly about hurting the other person as much as I can, I guess I regret lashing out because I realize that it doesn't always have the effect I imagined it would have, the point I wanted to make doesn't get across, so I've created needless drama that doesn't really get me anywhere. Rebuilding the relationship might never happen, but in order for that to happen, some things must have been festering for a very long time. Usually the anger subsides fast, but since I'm awfully stubborn, it might still take a while before things get "normal".

 

[Virtual ghost]

Then you're doing it wrong.
I believe everyone has their buttons and you just need to find the correct way to push them. I've had a few people act as if i didn't faze them in the slightest, but gradually deteriorate because of it.
Also, determining if it is worth the trouble to push those buttons. A number of people won't be selective over who they retaliate on and why. Not taking into account what may be unintentional.

Maybe.

Also I can come as "rude" towards you without you pushing any buttons (if you must know). The reason why I am in this therad is exactly because I have seen Fs "exploding" around me so many times and in so many different ways.

 

[alexshippee]

To those who have posted here and those yet to come:

Do you find yourselves starting the arguments, or are you usually antagonized first? When the regret of lashing out occurs is it because you realize the statement that they made wasn't as harsh as the retaliation you made? If this last question is true how quickly do you rebuild the relationship with the one in which you had the argument with?

Sometimes I start the arguments. Usually they just annoy me and say something and they say something back and it just escalates. I kind of have a short fuse when it comes to my father and my brother. Anytime they talk it bothers me, as horrible as that sounds. And usually I don't regret what I say to them. That sounds so mean. I swear it isn't as bad as it sounds, I guess you'd just have to be there.

If I ever lash out at anyone else though, like friends or my mommy, I usually feel automatically guilty. I usually apologize right after.

 

[MonkeyGrass]

I really have to be crushed and caught off guard in order for this to happen, and that takes a lot...

...but in the rare incidence of that happening, yes. I want to hunt them down, find the weakest point of their soul and piece it without mercy, and then walk away so their spirit dies in a lonely fashion.

If they're an impenetrable fortress of carefully constructed "T"-ness, I want to kill their dog.

Do I ever actually DO this? Not really. I always end up listening to them and identifying with them. Blah. LOL.

If very tired and cranky and pushed past my boundaries, or if my privacy is violated, I've been known to publicly dress someone down, exposing things they weren't really aware I even knew about them. But that's in my weakest, most immature moments, and it happens rarely these days.

 

[Unkindloving]

To those who have posted here and those yet to come:

Do you find yourselves starting the arguments, or are you usually antagonized first? When the regret of lashing out occurs is it because you realize the statement that they made wasn't as harsh as the retaliation you made? If this last question is true how quickly do you rebuild the relationship with the one in which you had the argument with?

I'm usually antagonized first and don't react until i know it is intentional and a concerted effort.
I don't tend to lash out unless i feel exceptionally threatened so i don't tend to regret it. Sometimes it happens with people i date and i'll explain to them why i felt threatened etc.
Sometimes it will take anywhere from six months to a few years to rebuild. A lot of the time, both parties need to alter aspects of themselves and detach from one another. I had this happen with an INTP who became controlling over me in the absence of his ex, so i lashed out at him. Three years later we are rebuilding, but it was warranted and necessary.

Maybe.

Also I can come as "rude" towards you without you pushing any buttons (if you must know). The reason why I am in this therad is exactly because I have seen Fs "exploding" around me so many times and in so many different ways.

Well you are an INTJ. They have this nice built-in 'rude'ness system like a Terminator. It's simply in your programming and some can understand that, while others cannot.
How do you feel you are rude without having your buttons pushed?
Would you say any of the F-explosions you witnessed were effective or warranted?

 

[ReflecTcelfeR]

Hmmmm... does it tend to be a direct attack, or more passive-aggressive? I suppose do you just shout the flaw, or do you antagonize them with something that represents the flaw within them that you perceive? I ask because a very good NF friend of mine seems to have become more aggressive towards me. He has identified himself as an INFP and he just seems to criticize every physical flaw about me. It annoys me, but doesn't really offend me... unless I'm tired then everything does. I suppose I'm wondering how close I am to a tactical strike. If this is a sign, or no.

 

[Xellotath]

I didn't know that it was an ENFP thing!

Yes, I am horrified of lashing out when I'm hurt. In fact there has never been a time where I have gone "yes, that explosive reaction there was 100% justified!" In fact once I'm done verbally crucifying the person, I always temporarily indulge in the childish "I wish I had a time machine so I could fix everything" fantasy.

It's like I'm horrified at having revealed my fangs at all. And I know that there's a very serious possibility that the other person will be incredibly well-guarded against me, ruining all of the "potential" for anything and everything. And if I exploded without reason, they would have caught a glimpse of just how fast I put things together, in which case I would be branded as paranoid - a stigma that could take years to clear up.

My guess is that an FJ would probably deal with the sense of potential finality better. But as for me, the cooldown after an explosion is like waking up in a viper's nest. (apologies to snake lovers)

 

[Unkindloving]

Hmmmm... does it tend to be a direct attack, or more passive-aggressive? I suppose do you just shout the flaw, or do you antagonize them with something that represents the flaw within them that you perceive? I ask because a very good NF friend of mine seems to have become more aggressive towards me. He has identified himself as an INFP and he just seems to criticize every physical flaw about me. It annoys me, but doesn't really offend me... unless I'm tired then everything does. I suppose I'm wondering how close I am to a tactical strike. If this is a sign, or no.

For me, it depends on the relationship and the extent of what they are doing. I'd venture to say it is initially passive-aggressive. If the behavior persists, it will become a direct attack.
Were i you, i'd confront him. Ask if there is an issue and explain that you've noticed remarks that you aren't offended by, but find rather annoying. Most of the INFPs i've known have attempted to offend, but could never quite find the buttons. It could be what's going on or he is just projecting.

As far as i know, ENFJ vs INFP tactical strikes are quite different. They don't tend to be seek and destroy missiles as much as my kind of folks do.
Anyone- correct me if i'm wrong. I'm curious.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Well you are an INTJ. They have this nice built-in 'rude'ness system like a Terminator. It's simply in your programming and some can understand that, while others cannot.
How do you feel you are rude without having your buttons pushed?
Would you say any of the F-explosions you witnessed were effective or warranted?

1. To quote my NF mother from a few days ago. "You are are a black hole that sucks every joy out of people and events". The thing is that I am capable of talking to a person over an hour without saying anything personal.
So Fs are likely to feel cornered when they are around me. However I am just doing my thing and persuing what interests me.
However I did something about this since my own INTJness told me that this is not good. So it does not happen that much anymore.

Also I can take someones beliefs apart and return them in pieces.


Actually I have realized that when an F explodes it is offten best to argue with them so that they can vent. Since if I remain calm and logical they will not forget the incident anytime soon. (what is often not strategically wise)


2. It is really hard to effect me with emotions (especially negative ones)
So emotional attacks are quite unlikely to work if you want to upset me.
Actually I can come as a really cold bastard sometimes.


For example I remember when a few years back my parents told me that the neighbour that watched over me when I was something like 6 ended in hospital becuse of problems with her heart.
While I responed simply with "OK" and countined to pursue my interests.


Also a few years back one boy I knew pretty well was smashed into pieces by a truck. However I came to funeral and faked empathy/sympathy directly into faces of the parents since I didn't feel particulary bad (or good) because of this.


Another example is when my ESFJ grandmother fell a few years back.
So when she was saying how it all happened to rest of the family I have accused her for BS-ing. Since laws of physics make her dramatic story quite unlikely. (what did upset some people)


So as you can see I am quite likely to annoy Fs. I don't do this "deliberatly" but it happens since I value the truth. I simply don't pay that much attention to emotional aspects of things so Fs get annoyed and/or scared sometimes around me.


Plus because of Te I am not that much passive. So it is no wonder that I can come across as a sociopath to people that have met me face to face.

 

[Unkindloving]

1. To quote my NF mother from a few days ago. "You are are a black hole that sucks every joy out of people and events". The thing is that I am capable of talking to a person over an hour without saying anything personal.
So Fs are likely to feel cornered when they are around me. However I am just doing my thing and persuing what interests me.
However I did something about this since my own INTJness told me that this is not good. So it does not happen that much anymore.

Also I can take someones beliefs apart and return them in pieces.

Actually I have realized that when an F explodes it is offten best to argue with them so that they can vent. Since if I remain calm and logical they will not forget the incident anytime soon. (what is often not strategically wise)

Does mommy-Antisocial-one have a more specific type? You may have mentioned somewhere, as i remember you mentioning that specific sentiment before.
I've noticed this a lot with INTJs, actually. They compartmentalize fantastically. This is something that absolutely baffles most NFs because facts and feelings are welded together. When we observe someone who can separate them both and continue it for extended periods of time, it's as if they are purposely keeping things from us or themselves. In reality, it can just be their default mode and they are fine.

As for the arguing, i'd say that is smart if you are correct in your assessments. For a lot of NFs, it will still infuriate the hell out of them until they can calm and process.

2. It is really hard to effect me with emotions (especially negative ones)
So emotional attacks are quite unlikely to work if you want to upset me.
Actually I can come as a really cold bastard sometimes.

For example I remember when a few years back my parents told me that the neighbour that watched over me when I was something like 6 ended in hospital becuse of problems with her heart.
While I responed simply with "OK" and countined to pursue my interests.

Also a few years back one boy I knew pretty well was smashed into pieces by a truck. However I came to funeral and faked empathy/sympathy directly into faces of the parents since I didn't feel particulary bad (or good) because of this.

Another example is when my ESFJ grandmother fell a few years back.
So when she was saying how it all happened to rest of the family I have accused her for BS-ing. Since laws of physics make her dramatic story quite unlikely. (what did upset some people)

So as you can see I am quite likely to annoy Fs. I don't do this "deliberatly" but it happens since I value the truth. I simply don't pay that much attention to emotional aspects of things so Fs get annoyed and/or scared sometimes around me.

Plus because of Te I am not that much passive. So it is no wonder that I can come across as a sociopath to people that have met me face to face.

It's interesting. I play both of these fields and can grasp both sides of why it would be annoying or why it isn't emotion-inducing. Personally, i would react as you did to the news of the neighbor and the situation with your grandmother, but not as such in the funeral situation.
INTJs just don't scream empathy, but Fs will either try to pry it out of them or avoid them due to it. Basically, we infuriate ourselves in doing this.
What would you say is an ideal place to strike against you? If you don't mind the question

 

[Yloh]

I noticed this about myself... I dont always follow through, but when someone hurts me I have an insatiable desire to hurt them back equally or say something back to crush them equally.

I wonder how many types do this, I would assume this is a mostly NF thing. The NTs I have dealt with can be nasty too but they don't ever seem to get hurt and want to hurt back the same way I have seen NF's.

I wonder where this stems from aside form immaturity I mean, some people need to bite back.

When I get hurt by someone, I feel betrayed. My mind goes like "How dare you hurt me, you must feel my pain".

Part of it is being hypersensitive mixed with immaturity. As I'm becoming wiser, my mind begins to rationalize the situation and comes up with a reasonable way to respond to hurtful actions.

 

[copperfish17]

"Always forgive your enemies - nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde

Now to be more serious. Okay, so someone hurt you/pissed you off. Why would you stoop to their level by getting back?

I've done this "lashing out" thing a couple of times when I was younger. Cutting Ti language + Inferior Fe lashing out is a terrible, terrible thing - when I lashed out I had absolutely no remorse, before AND after the act. I trudged on like a bull in a china shop, to put it metaphorically. Needless to say, the lashing out didn't help the relationship in question at all. It never solved any problems. It never gave me the outcome that I desired. It ALWAYS came back to bite me on the ass.

Getting back is only a "short-term solution" to problems. I've learned this the hard way. I genuinely believe that nothing can be gained from revenge, except the short-term euphoria that comes right after the act. Then again, that euphoria isn't worth the bullsh!t that will likely follow.

I make it a point not to lash out to people at all - especially with people I care about and share good relationships with. It's almost impossible to anger me in the first place, but it's good to be on the lookout, always.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Does mommy-Antisocial-one have a more specific type? You may have mentioned somewhere, as i remember you mentioning that specific sentiment before.
I've noticed this a lot with INTJs, actually. They compartmentalize fantastically. This is something that absolutely baffles most NFs because facts and feelings are welded together. When we observe someone who can separate them both and continue it for extended periods of time, it's as if they are purposely keeping things from us or themselves. In reality, it can just be their default mode and they are fine.

As for the arguing, i'd say that is smart if you are correct in your assessments. For a lot of NFs, it will still infuriate the hell out of them until they can calm and process.


It's interesting. I play both of these fields and can grasp both sides of why it would be annoying or why it isn't emotion-inducing. Personally, i would react as you did to the news of the neighbor and the situation with your grandmother, but not as such in the funeral situation.
INTJs just don't scream empathy, but Fs will either try to pry it out of them or avoid them due to it. Basically, we infuriate ourselves in doing this.
What would you say is an ideal place to strike against you? If you don't mind the question

1. I am pretty sure that my mother is a ENFP.


2. Acting like a unhealthy SF is quite likely to annoy me. Same works for people that don't have any Jness at all or people with certain political beliefs.
But in those cases I just calmly walk away and that is it. Since I have along ago realized that arguing with some people us simply pointless.

However if you want me to explode ..... that is quite unlikely