[ENFP] Brutally honest ENFP?

[HotpinkHeatwave]

For quite some time now, I've found myself being much more outspoken than usual, and much more honest. Honest to the point where I'm just downright mean (even borderline cruel), sometimes.

I try very hard not to be mean to my friends, but to people I don't know or care about? Ouch. If they upset me, they're in for a world of hurt.

I think that I am starting to care less about the feelings of everyone around me.

Is this normal for ENFPs?

Is it possible my F trait is... Diminishing? Shifting to T?

Or am I going through a weird funk?

 

[Malkavia]

I am brutally honest. Too much.

This past year Ive been trying to work on it. Ive gotten better but sometimes when I first meet people they think I dont like them. I do I promise!

 

[slowriot]

I have additional question, do you boss around with people?

 

[Aleksei]

It's highly probable that your tertiary Te is kicking your ass.

 

[Malkavia]

I have additional question, do you boss around with people?

I dont think so. I have been in plenty of leadership positions and I think I have taken them upon very well.

You mean boss around like give orders like theres no tomorrow right?

 

[chris1207]

It IS Te. ESFP's do it too, but with much more frequency it seems (maybe ESXX's are more extroverted in general than ENXX's.)

I logged on to post about this actually. Can't find the topic but Lady Jaye (ENFP) basically told an ENFJ (presumably male) that she's learned that in life ENFJ men have problem because there Feelers who are men. I'm not sure if I got it 100 % right but that's like saying that Feeler men are a blight on society and they should just blow their brains out because they'll never fit in.

Probably one of the rudest things I've seen on here. I'm sure some of it has to do with improper Fe-Te and Fi-Ti exchange across FP/TJ's and FJ/TP's but that doesn't make her statement any less fucked up. I'm not gonna give leniency to someone who has knows an ENFJ as well as she does and still comes out with something like that, especially given the fact that you have to think, think and rethink stuff that you type.

Really makes me fume. That advice is no advice. I hate people that tell me I have a problem and have 0 advice on what to do about it.

 

[Aleksei]

(maybe ESXX's are more extroverted in general than ENXX's.)

They are. Se is the most hyper-extroverted of all eight Jungian cognitive functions, followed by Fe. Ne's external interest focuses on brainstorming, and it has relatively little interest in socialization beyond that, making many ENxPs semi-introverted.

 

[HotpinkHeatwave]

I have additional question, do you boss around with people?

What do you mean? Boss people around? No, not that I know of atleast. I can take leadership roles, but I don't drill people.

 

[HotpinkHeatwave]

It's highly probable that your tertiary Te is kicking your ass.

Tertiary Te?

 

[Malkavia]

It IS Te. ESFP's do it too, but with much more frequency it seems (maybe ESXX's are more extroverted in general than ENXX's.)

I logged on to post about this actually. Can't find the topic but Lady Jaye (ENFP) basically told an ENFJ (presumably male) that she's learned that in life ENFJ men have problem because there Feelers who are men. I'm not sure if I got it 100 % right but that's like saying that Feeler men are a blight on society and they should just blow their brains out because they'll never fit in.

Probably one of the rudest things I've seen on here. I'm sure some of it has to do with improper Fe-Te and Fi-Ti exchange across FP/TJ's and FJ/TP's but that doesn't make her statement any less fucked up. I'm not gonna give leniency to someone who has knows an ENFJ as well as she does and still comes out with something like that, especially given the fact that you have to think, think and rethink stuff that you type.

Really makes me fume. That advice is no advice. I hate people that tell me I have a problem and have 0 advice on what to do about it. [edit]

I have not been on this forum long but I havent seen anything like this from Lady. She seems wonderful.

 

[sculpting]

It IS Te. ESFP's do it too, but with much more frequency it seems (maybe ESXX's are more extroverted in general than ENXX's.)

I logged on to post about this actually. Can't find the topic but Lady Jaye (ENFP) basically told an ENFJ (presumably male) that she's learned that in life ENFJ men have problem because there Feelers who are men. I'm not sure if I got it 100 % right but that's like saying that Feeler men are a blight on society and they should just blow their brains out because they'll never fit in.

Probably one of the rudest things I've seen on here. I'm sure some of it has to do with improper Fe-Te and Fi-Ti exchange across FP/TJ's and FJ/TP's but that doesn't make her statement any less fucked up. I'm not gonna give leniency to someone who has knows an ENFJ as well as she does and still comes out with something like that, especially given the fact that you have to think, think and rethink stuff that you type.

Really makes me fume. That advice is no advice. I hate people that tell me I have a problem and have 0 advice on what to do about it. [edit]

Wow. Lady Jaye is one of the kindest, sweetest enfps here honestly. She is amazingly sweet-I am a brutal hellish, flame breathing, mind dissecting dragon bitch in comparison. Just sayin... lady jaye is angellic.

Sounds like you took her factual Te observation of ENFJ men she had observed-then continued with your analysis of what her facts actually meant as a personal insult-not what she said.

Does Fe/Ti misread a flat Te statement of fact as a subtle Ti insult? Also-Fe "completes the sentence" meaning it makes convos sound polite-but each Fe user completes the more negative translation in their own minds. Te/Fi does NOT do that. With Te/Fi, what you see is what you get. Meaning it sounds like you completed lady's sentence, on your own....and thus developed meaning she never actually intended.

Interesting.

And yes OP. Very often I state things as facts or very bluntly even when no emotive content is involved. Simple "thoughts" can sound rude via text. In person this comes across okay unless I am very agitated or upset-then I can sound bitchy.

 

[Lady_X]

It IS Te. ESFP's do it too, but with much more frequency it seems (maybe ESXX's are more extroverted in general than ENXX's.)

I logged on to post about this actually. Can't find the topic but Lady Jaye (ENFP) basically told an ENFJ (presumably male) that she's learned that in life ENFJ men have problem because there Feelers who are men. I'm not sure if I got it 100 % right but that's like saying that Feeler men are a blight on society and they should just blow their brains out because they'll never fit in.

Probably one of the rudest things I've seen on here. I'm sure some of it has to do with improper Fe-Te and Fi-Ti exchange across FP/TJ's and FJ/TP's but that doesn't make her statement any less fucked up. I'm not gonna give leniency to someone who has knows an ENFJ as well as she does and still comes out with something like that, especially given the fact that you have to think, think and rethink stuff that you type.

Really makes me fume. That advice is no advice. I hate people that tell me I have a problem and have 0 advice on what to do about it. [edit]

lady jaye is a very thoughtful conscientious poster who would not intentionally be cruel to someone. i'm sure she did not mean her words in the way you heard them.

edit: haha orobas we both had to say something about that! funny...

 

[Moiety]

It IS Te. ESFP's do it too, but with much more frequency it seems (maybe ESXX's are more extroverted in general than ENXX's.)

I logged on to post about this actually. Can't find the topic but Lady Jaye (ENFP) basically told an ENFJ (presumably male) that she's learned that in life ENFJ men have problem because there Feelers who are men. I'm not sure if I got it 100 % right but that's like saying that Feeler men are a blight on society and they should just blow their brains out because they'll never fit in.

Probably one of the rudest things I've seen on here. I'm sure some of it has to do with improper Fe-Te and Fi-Ti exchange across FP/TJ's and FJ/TP's but that doesn't make her statement any less fucked up. I'm not gonna give leniency to someone who has knows an ENFJ as well as she does and still comes out with something like that, especially given the fact that you have to think, think and rethink stuff that you type.

Really makes me fume. That advice is no advice. I hate people that tell me I have a problem and have 0 advice on what to do about it.

You are obviously not very comfortable with your F nature to react that way. Which is probably the kind of "data" LadyJaye is basing herself on to say what she did (which btw is super duper utterly despicable....on Mars maybe) in the first place.

 

[Aleksei]

Tertiary Te?

Each type is the result of four Jungian cognitive functions, which are subordinate to each other depending on their order of preference, and supposedly balance each other out: One Intuitive process, one Sensing process, one Feeling process and one Thinking process. As an ENFP, your four processes are Ne (Extroverted Intuition: theorizing, zany ideas, synthesis and finding hidden patterns), followed by Fi (Introverted Feeling: personal values, keeping in touch with what you believe and staying true to yourself), followed by Te (Extroverted Thinking: organization, segmenting, objective standards, reliance on empirical data, finding what works and applying it; the "boss" function so to speak), and finally Si (Memory, experience, reliance on what you have previously learned to be true and reliable).

As a Feeler your main mode of operation is Intuition and Feeling, but on occasion your tertiary Thinking function could cut in and make you brutally honest, or give you other odd character traits generally associated with prick xxTJs. I myself have highly balanced functions, so I often come off as ESTJ because of this.

Hope that explains it.

 

[CzeCze]

OP, how old are you? Perhaps this is your tert Te coming out.

I think there is nothing wrong per sae with being direct. However, saying things out of left field or when unnecessary is rude and get you social blowback (I think our ENTP cousins are more familiar with this ).

I think in balanced ENFPs, we are aware of how people will perceive what we say and we can say things that are direct but also well spoken so they are as well-received as possible. Or not, if we consciously choose to do so.

I think in this case, the key to getting a handle on Tert Te and integrating it is learning how to direct it and not having it startle you to where you say things and then go, "Why'd I say that?" or feel entitled to say things that people think are rude or hurtful just because you are angry/hurt/or just noncommital yourself.

I guess you could say that in ENTPs it's Fe that tempers the alienating/abrasive effects of pure Te but in ENFPs it's Fi.

 

[Aleksei]

ENTPs don't have Te, they have Ti (which is nowhere near as abrasive).

 

[Jaguar]

ENTPs don't have Te...

That's as ridiculous as saying ENTPs don't have an amygdala.
People have the ability to use all the cognitive processes.
What varies from individual to individual is the level of consciousness.

 

[Aleksei]

Alright they have almost no Te, then. You have a point but it must be stressed that people don't have an equal inherent ability to use all eight functions, because people are not of equal or uniform in mental ability. I'm utterly shit at using Ni, myself, for example.

 

[Jaguar]

Alright they have almost no Te, then. You have a point but it must be stressed that people don't have an equal inherent ability to use all eight functions, because people are not of equal or uniform in mental ability. I'm utterly shit at using Ni, myself, for example.

I never suggested people use all 8 equally.
But all of this is purely theoretical and what holds true for one person-even within the same alleged type- may not hold true for the next person.

The biggest factor in function development is familial and environmental influences.
There are very few people left in this forum who actually buy into the "canned" function orders MBTI claims.
MBTI is but one theory, Aleksei. It doesn't mean it's accurate.
I'm just asking you to keep an open mind, that's all.

 

[chris1207]

You are obviously not very comfortable with your F nature to react that way. Which is probably the kind of "data" LadyJaye is basing herself on to say what she did (which btw is super duper utterly despicable....on Mars maybe) in the first place.

Self-improvement is one of the main focuses for people of the NF temperament. In ENFJs, this is curtailed to self-actualization. Telling someone that 'who they are is the problem' is an egregious offense to an ENFJ.