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[INFJ] Seeking feedback from outside the confines of INFJ thinking

Z Buck McFate

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Something interesting happened tonight with a neighbor, and it seems like a really good example of those microcosm moments that build up to a doorslam: I’m interested in hearing how other types would have dealt with it.

I have new neighbors that moved in this past week directly in back of me. Earlier this afternoon, their kids were throwing rocks at the back of my house and broke the glass in the patio door. I don’t remember what they were aiming for- they weren’t trying to break glass, but they did. I called the police instead of going to their house and talking to the parents directly because I wanted to intimidate the kids into not doing it again. About an hour later, the parents came over- with the kids- apologized profusely, made the kids admit what they’d done and apologize themselves, and assured me they would take care of the broken panes. They fully owned up to how unacceptable it is and overall gave me a solid impression that they are respectful people who are genuinely embarrassed. We exchanged phone numbers and planned to get in touch about how to replace the door.

All of that^ went down very respectfully**. My issue is with what happened next. I was washing my face, getting ready for bed when the grandfather knocked on the door- around 9 pm (the neighbors are grandparents, the kids were their grandchildren). I had to dry up and get somewhat re-dressed to answer the door, which took a couple of minutes. They were no longer at the door by the time I got there, so I walked into the front yard to see if I could catch whoever it was. I noticed the gate to my backyard was open.

My first reaction was to feel really angry. My first thought: if someone doesn’t answer the door- especially at 9 pm- then whatever needed to be checked out in that person’s backyard should wait until the next day. The shades I have covering my windows are translucent, the only way to see inside the house at night is to be standing up close to the window. And even so- I’ve got an 8 ft high wooden fence around my backyard- so it seems like I shouldn’t have to worry about someone seeing in my house. If I am home alone, I won’t think twice about walking around the house in my underwear sometimes. I am a really private person, the thought of someone taking the liberty of going in my backyard without my permission disturbs me.

I walked around into the backyard to find the neighbor measuring the dimensions on the door (standing up close to the window of my living room with the translucent shades). His grandson was with him, probably to hold the flashlight for him. In short: if I hadn’t heard him knock on the door, it’s entirely possible they both might have caught me dancing around my living room in my underwear- scratching my butt, picking my nose, or any other number of things people might do while they don’t have to worry about being seen.

Here’s the integral INFJ turning point: once I saw how frazzled he was, my anger immediately faded. This is a prime example of a situation where I go- from sensing something is clearly ‘off’, feeling offended and getting angry about it- straight into empathizing with the other side, thinking “it’s no big deal” and deciding not to make an issue out of it. I could see that getting the door replaced as soon as possible was weighing heavily on him, and I wasn’t willing to point out to him how I was more non-plussed about the privacy invasion than I was about the broken door. It truly, instantly felt like ‘no big deal’: no harm, no foul. I decided I’d wait and say something if it ever happened again. I didn’t want him to feel like his efforts to amend the situation respectfully by fixing the door as quickly as possible went unappreciated.

I realize, to some extent, my knee-jerk reaction to contain my anger and empathize is based on the wish that others would stop and think about both sides before exploding in anger at me for something I’ve done. But the ‘do unto others as you would have them do unto you’ approach to getting along with people falls short sometimes in the sense that it can resemble ‘my way is the best way’. I think maybe INFJs have a more averse reaction to having someone snap at them in anger, I think we feel the weight of the other person’s anger/injured feelings more than most types. Sometimes I even think we sense more anger in that other person than is actually there (because it takes a LOT of anger for us to lash out in that same way).

Anyway, I’m trying to break out of ‘my way is the best way’. I’m wondering how that same event would go down for other types. How would you have reacted in that situation: both internally (thought process) and externally (how would you actually have behaved)?


I feel compelled to point out that- while I’m using this incident with my neighbor as an example- I really don’t think I’ll have a problem telling this specific person not to wander into my backyard without my knowing if it happens again. I’m trying to get at that underlying shift which tends to happen in INFJs- from intense annoyance to it being ‘no big deal’- and causes problems in friendships and/or relationships when it begins to accumulate. I want to see what that ‘annoyed/offended’ process looks like in other types.

**edit: OKAY. Things to know before you get critical of me for calling the police. The op was already too long-winded so I didn’t put these details in, but the thread is almost getting derailed by their omission. (1) When I say ‘kids throwing rocks at my house’, I mean junior highschool age kids, laughing- in broad daylight- throwing large rocks (2” diameter) directly at the back of my house from their backyard. (2) When I say they broke 2 panes on my patio door: it’s a sliding glass door, both 36X78” panes are shattered from top to bottom. And it’s old- so it isn’t a matter of replacing the panes- the entire door and frame are going to have to be removed and a new one put in: EXPENSIVE. I’m just glad I happened to be home at 3 pm, because I otherwise would have assumed someone tried to break in and would have ended up paying for it myself. (3) While some of my neighbors are nice, respectful people- there are enough questionable people in the area to make me wary. In the past 12 months alone: the entirety of my exposed wood fence has been tagged with gang graffiti twice and I’ve had a windshield wiper (the entire metal arm) ripped off of my car while it was parked in my driveway. There are enough kids living in my area getting their shits n giggles out of destroying property that it wasn’t unreasonable for me to assume that’s what I was dealing with- and I wanted them (the kids) to know that I won't hesitate to call the cops when they destroy my property.

For the record: I have a 16 year old son. If someone were to find him behaving like those kids when he was their age, I wouldn’t have a problem with the cops being called. That door will likely cost a thousand dollars or more to completely replace; they’ve got to learn it’s absolutely not acceptable to destroy someone else’s property like that for impulsive shits n giggles. If I had known the grandparents were so nice and respectful, *maybe* I would have called them first; but judging from the kids’ behaviors, I wouldn’t have guessed that’s what I’d find.
 
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P

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:shock: Reading through the OP made me see so much of myself, the way I process things and reactions I've had in different situations are so similar.

It would be interesting to see other responses. Thanks for sharing. :)
 

Arclight

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If you want to look at it in MBTI terms.. your gut reaction sounds Fi not Fe

So I would consider that.

In general terms what you have are people who are trying to do right after a wrong and maybe were bit over zealous about it.
Your reaction is that a good person either way.

But you went all Fi 1st ..
 

Esoteric Wench

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your gut reaction sounds Fi not Fe... you went all Fi 1st ..

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with Arclight. Z Buck McFate sounded like she was using Fe to me... textbook Fe in fact.

Maybe I can shed some light on this as an ENFP who has Fi as her auxilliary function and Fe as a shadow function. Per CognitiveProcesses.com Extraverted Feeling is about connecting with others and considering the needs of the group. Fi is more.... it's sort of hard for me to articulate what Fi is. It's sort of like considering the value of your values.

For me, Fi is about what is Right (with a capital R). It transcends social norms. Let me repeat this because this is the heart of the matter. Fi for me is about finding the essence of Rightness. This is the primordial Right that social norms grew out of, but they are only a reflection of the principles that I seek to guide my behavior.

For example, about a year ago, an INFJ male in my acquaintance engaged in some behavior I found morally reprehensible. Fe, as I understand it, would have led me to respond in some manner in keeping with social norms and in a way that I could connect with him at least enough to have strong empathy for his side of things.

Perhaps, if I had auxillary Fe instead of Fi, I would have privately seethed but decided to not rock the boat by confronting him. Or, maybe I would have doorslammed him. But my Fi finds these choices a bit “little picture.” Afterall, my Fi is concerned with the underlying truths of the social norms that so inform Fe. So in this respect, social norms are only a point of reference for me.

After much reflection, I decided that a bigger moral issue was at stake than not rocking the boat. This gave me the self-assuredness to point out his transgressions to him… social norms be damned.

I didn’t make this decision rashly. I knew there would be some serious social fallout from it. And, I knew that what I had to say would hurt and shock him. So how can I, who as an ENFP is so concerned with people liking me and making the people around me comfortable, do something that she knows is going to provoke antipathy and evoke much pain? I could do it because of my Fi. I tried to deliver my diatribe with as much kindness as possible, but I was very direct in pointing out his sins. I just HAD to do it because it was the Right thing to do.

To an outside observer, it might have appeared I was trying to hurt this person or that I had no filters. But nothing could be farther from the truth. I truly care about this person and weighed my decision very carefully. I tried to make the most moral choice possible. And I guess I felt like social norms were rather limiting considering the bigger principle at stake.

It seems to me that for Bucky Z McFate, Fe came into play first when she reasoned through her decision to call the police. Her decision was the result of a cognitive process in which she chose the most efficient option that would force the offenders into socially correct behavior. That is Fe.

Bucky Z McFate, I find what you wrote here very interesting. I'm going to have to ponder a bit... In the meantime, I wanted to tell you that it gave me a lot of insight into the INFJ essence.
 
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Esoteric Wench

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I think analyzing how Fe and Fi would have handled this differently can tell you a lot about how INFJs work. See the chart below:
INFJ Hierarchy of Primary Functions
  1. Ni (Dominant) - Foreseeing implications, transformations, and likely effects
  2. Fe (Auxillary) - Connecting and considering others and the group
  3. Ti (Relief or Tertiary) - Analyzing, categorizing, and evaluating according to principles.
Both Fe and Fi are about being considerate and cooperative. My Fi would give me a natural way to express my anger w/o feeling like I was violating one of my core values. In other words, I wouldn't see rocking the boat as such a problem. Thus, stress expressed. Stress released. I move forward. No doorslam.

Unresolved anger due to Fe preventing the INFJ from expressing it can cause uncomfortable emotions to build up and spill over. Eventually, teritiary Ti kicks in which means all sorts of antics ensue.

Our tertiary functions are relief valves that handle the overflow from our dominant and auxiliary functions. They are either on or off. And we usually don't have conscious control of it.

Introverted Thinking is about analyzing, categorizing, and evaluating according to principles. And, this goes a long way explaining why INFJs might feel doorslamming is a good idea. If tertiary Ti kicks in for an INFJ, then they try to categorize. If they judge that a person needs to be put in the "keep at arms length" category or the "doorslamming category," for example, then the INFJ quickly shifts gears and recategorizes the person.

It also explains why sometimes INFJs feel so horrible after doorslamming someone. After the doorslam, when Ni or Fe is in charge again, the INFJ may agonize over their tertiary Ti-driven decision, which is not in keeping with Fe values.
 

Arclight

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Thank you for clarifying..

See in my case I would feel sympathy, (even if I couldn't empathize because I was too busy being upset), for the grandfather and child.. But My Fi would go wild over the initial thought that someone is in my personal space.

Same behaviors different causes ..
 

Z Buck McFate

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:shock: Reading through the OP made me see so much of myself, the way I process things and reactions I've had in different situations are so similar.

It would be interesting to see other responses. Thanks for sharing. :)

Thanks SiB, I was hoping other INFJs might chime in- to also give me a sense of how common this experience is. :) It really seems to me like it's a major component of the doorslam, so it's good to hear if this is as common an INFJ experience as I suspect it is.

If you want to look at it in MBTI terms.. your gut reaction sounds Fi not Fe

So I would consider that.

In general terms what you have are people who are trying to do right after a wrong and maybe were bit over zealous about it.
Your reaction is that a good person either way.

But you went all Fi 1st ..

I'd actually been wondering if the problem isn't lack of Fi: the initial sense of feeling offended is never concrete enough for me to give it much weight, it seems to disappear too quickly when I step back and throw the other person's point of view into the mix. It *seems* to disappear. Yet when it happens on a regular basis with someone, a distinct feeling of dissonance begins to accumulate- that's what I'm looking to get rid of here.

I'm not sure if it's even helpful to bring the functions into this, per se. I'm just looking to compare the process of 'automatic thoughts' I have when I get annoyed to the process other people go through.

edit: esoteric- I'm a 'she'. Just for the record. I posted this^ without seeing the inbetween posts yet, I'll get back to them soon.
 

Lux

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I'd actually been wondering if the problem isn't lack of Fi: the initial sense of feeling offended is never concrete enough for me to give it much weight, it seems to disappear too quickly when I step back and throw the other person's point of view into the mix. It *seems* to disappear. Yet when it happens on a regular basis with someone, a distinct feeling of dissonance begins to accumulate- that's what I'm looking to get rid of here.

I'm not sure if it's even helpful to bring the functions into this, per se. I'm just looking to compare the process of 'automatic thoughts' I have when I get annoyed to the process other people go through.

This describes me too.

I honestly don't really get mad, I may have twinge of it, or feel annoyance or be offended, but it never never lasts. It never seems like a big deal. In your OP I would have picked up on your neighbors discomfort and my feelings of discomfort would immediately have been taken over by his. My own tend to dissipate, upon the discomfort of another. Not always, I am sure, but for the most part. It is like I am looking at the situation from a removed perspective, and I am far enough away, that I don't personally get upset.. I don't even know if that makes sense. Hmmm...
 

The Outsider

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I'd actually been wondering if the problem isn't lack of Fi: the initial sense of feeling offended is never concrete enough for me to give it much weight, it seems to disappear too quickly when I step back and throw the other person's point of view into the mix.

That is exactly how it is for me as well.

Though it seems that your initial reaction is a lot more severe than mine. I wouldn't even think of calling the police.
 

The Outsider

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I’m trying to get at that underlying shift which tends to happen in INFJs- from intense annoyance to it being ‘no big deal’- and causes problems in friendships and/or relationships when it begins to accumulate.

I do not believe that has anything to do with being an INFJ or not.
 

Z Buck McFate

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For me, Fi is about what is Right (with a capital R). It transcends social norms. Let me repeat this because this is the heart of the matter. Fi for me is about finding the essence of Rightness. This is the primordial Right that social norms grew out of, but they are only a reflection of the principles that I seek to guide my behavior.

.....

Perhaps, if I had auxillary Fe instead of Fi, I would have privately seethed but decided to not rock the boat by confronting him. Or, maybe I would have doorslammed him. But my Fi finds these choices a bit “little picture.” Afterall, my Fi is concerned with the underlying truths of the social norms that so inform Fe. So in this respect, social norms are only a point of reference for me.

After much reflection, I decided that a bigger moral issue was at stake than not rocking the boat. This gave me the self-assuredness to point out his transgressions to him… social norms be damned.

It's funny, to my Fe- finding what is "Right", looking for One Truth- is what seems "little picture" to me. It isn't a matter of adhering to social norms; it's a matter of recognizing there is no single Right, no single One Truth- and trying to discern if there's some reason why my subjective truths should matter more than my neighbor's subjective truths. The one single underlying truth is that there is never one single underlying truth.

edit: I realize this^ is because the Fe is intermingled with Ni.
 

Fidelia

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Hey Z Buck - I completely identify with your reactions. My problem with doing that only comes in when the person does other stuff later that is a problem. Then the previous incidents that I dismissed as insignificant in light of more information get brought up again and the person feels I am hanging onto a bunch of little insignificant things or that if there was a problem I should have dealt with it sooner before I felt really resentful. Unfortunately, it is difficult to make the call of when that should be because it is only in response to new information and an overall picture forming that the inconsiderateness is an overarching issue rather than an isolated incident that it becomes a real problem. Any ideas for how you make that call? I found especially in a relationship with the ESTJ who dealt with most things internally, it caused a lot of problems. I waited until I was sure something was truly a problem and when it was finally brought up, the communication was immediately shut down or the problem remained unresolved. Then any subsequent issue that reflected the same underlying cause had lots of residual gas to fuel the fire.
 

Immaculate Cloud

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To the OP,

it looks as if your little 'experiment' (calling the police instead of talking to the parents first) set in motion a whole chain of events! Let's see... If you had talked to the parents first, would they have flatly denied their children/grandchildren were responsible? That is a possibility.

But, you called the police and suddenly that made the matter (child's carelessness) became "very official".

I think that I can relate to calling the police too... Over the top, IMHO, but I can relate to its very 'detached and neutral way' of dealing with the situation. You don't get to go on the neighbors turf but they have to come on yours! Am I right?

The grandparent was probably taking this as an opportunity to teach the children to be a bit more responsible - as in, 'look we JUST moved in and you just HAD to break the neighbor's stuff!'

About your reaction when you saw them measuring your door -

I would have done the exact same thing. The empathy thing - argh - once I can "read" the person's anguish or whatever, that immediately makes me put my preferences aside to try to soothe their anguish - yea, going from annoyance to 'no big deal' in a snap.

But for that reaction to happen, I have to get the gut feeling that the other party is really, really sincere... (refer to another thread where the INFJs express annoyance that people don't simply 'fess up' but attempt to 'justify' themselves, thus provoking a doorslam)

And I think that in this situation, I would have read it like I think you did too: Decent grandpa is teaching the grandson the consequences of his carelessness/rash actions and on 'living well with neighbors'. And I would have wanted to reassure them too and say, 'look, it's no big deal, it's JUST a broken window. Once it's repaired, it will look like nothing bad happened'...

So in conclusion, the setting aside of a privilege or a right (to privacy, time alone, no phone calls or no callers after 9 pm, whatever) is really contingent upon who is making demands on that privilege/right and/or how it is done.

Sorry, I cannot discourse on Fi verses Fe, etc. This is just to say that yea, I can totally relate.
 

Z Buck McFate

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I honestly don't really get mad, I may have twinge of it, or feel annoyance or be offended, but it never never lasts. It never seems like a big deal. In your OP I would have picked up on your neighbors discomfort and my feelings of discomfort would immediately have been taken over by his. My own tend to dissipate, upon the discomfort of another. Not always, I am sure, but for the most part. It is like I am looking at the situation from a removed perspective, and I am far enough away, that I don't personally get upset.. I don't even know if that makes sense. Hmmm...


Exactly. It’s like suddenly my own feelings are just one piece of a bigger picture- no more or less important than someone else’s.

edit: And it happens the moment I'm actually dealing with the other person. Just... *snap* and my feelings are a smaller part of a bigger whole, like I'm seeing it from the outside.

Though it seems that your initial reaction is a lot more severe than mine. I wouldn't even think of calling the police.

Calling the police was really more a logical choice than something done out of anger. It’s not really an important aspect of this scenario, I could have easily left it out. It’s just that I really couldn’t be less intimidating in person. Plus, I hadn’t met these people yet, so I had no idea how they’d react. Calling the police was just the ‘easy’ way to get them to stop- and in quiet suburbs like this, it’s kind of what the police are there for anyway.

Who's to say how I would have handled it for sure. But I think I might have felt empathy for the transgressing neighbors, gently told them that they needed to respect my space, and then proceeded to laugh and talk with them about whatever came to mind.

This is what I’m looking for. Thanks. This is helpful. I want to try to work something like this more into the ‘automatic thoughts’ that happen when I get really annoyed.

Back to the cognitive crucibles INFJs experience:

I think that Fe might sometimes cause the INFJ to shut down their anger prematurely. Or perhaps said in a better way, it acts as a pressure valve the prevents the INFJ from releasing pressure in a more adaptive way. Thus, sometimes, the INFJ let's the anger/resentment/<insert whatever uncomfortable emotion here> to the point that suddenly Fe is overrun and Ti kicks in.

Ti is the INFJ's tertiary process. Introverted Thinking is about analyzing, categorizing, and evaluating according to principles. For example, "Was this the correct thing to do given the facts of the situation?" And, I think this is the third step Bucky Z McFate went through which is in part why he posted his ruminations here.

Someone on this forum once wrote that our tertiary function operated like an emergency switch that was not consciously controlled. In other words, the tertiary function is either on or off. And, you don't have complete control on flipping that switch. I thought this brilliantly described how Te (my tertiary function) worked for me. And, this explanation goes a long way in elucidating an INFJ's decision to doorslam somebody.

Introverted thinking is an internal reasoning process of deriving subcategories of classes and sub-principles of general principles. If Ti kicks in for an INFJ, and they judge that a person needs to be put in the "keep at arms length" category or the "doorslamming category" then that's exactly where the INFJ puts them quickly and decisively. Afterward, when Ni or Fe is in charge again, the INFJ may agonize over their decision because Ne or Fe would have taken a very different approach than tertiary Ti did. Here again, we see that for the INFJ, their individuals functions within the INFJ's hierarchy of functions pull the INFJ in very different directions.


I’m going to have to chew on this awhile. Also: I’m going to need you to stop calling me Bucky.
 
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Immaculate Cloud

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Hey Z Buck - I completely identify with your reactions. My problem with doing that only comes in when the person does other stuff later that is a problem. Then the previous incidents that I dismissed as insignificant in light of more information get brought up again and the person feels I am hanging onto a bunch of little insignificant things or that if there was a problem I should have dealt with it sooner before I felt really resentful. Unfortunately, it is difficult to make the call of when that should be because it is only in response to new information and an overall picture forming that the inconsiderateness is an overarching issue rather than an isolated incident that it becomes a real problem. Any ideas for how you make that call? I found especially in a relationship with the ESTJ who dealt with most things internally, it caused a lot of problems. I waited until I was sure something was truly a problem and when it was finally brought up, the communication was immediately shut down or the problem remained unresolved. Then any subsequent issue that reflected the same underlying cause had lots of residual gas to fuel the fire.

I can totally relate to the parts of Fidelia's post, which I have bolded. Having lived through similar experiences, I think that if I were Buck Z My Fate, here's the 'post window pane' scenario that I would stick to:

Once the broken glass is repaired, say thanks and keep it "formal" (after all, the police was called right?)

Smile briefly but rather formally when the door is finally repaired and say bye but don't overdo the "I am a nice neighbor and really, no big deal, kids will be kids, accidents happen" reassurance speech...

Be courteous, civil but not overly friendly. Then forget them for a while!

Give yourself and the neighbors plenty of time to become friends, years if necessary- that way you don't come across as one big pushover or doormat - which we easily give that vibe off, I think... Enjoy being the enigmatic neighbor - it works better this way! Someone wrote on a thread about keeping people in the acquaintance zone for very long before moving them to the friend zone. In this case, I'd suggest keeping the communication style firmly in the 'neighbor and nothing more' zone for a comfortable amount of time before upgrading if ever, to the 'acquaintance and occasional help' zone.

Example: you said you are a private person? If you live alone, this means that you might be called upon to "babysit" one kid or the other later on. Try to avoid that chore! You might do it out of a desire to smoothen things with the grandpa later but then, this later could cause problems. Your privacy thing versus them thinking they could call upon you to help out, etc. Therefore, don't be too friendly, too fast. It helps to turn off the mobile phone from time to time, and just be unavailable. A one-off help is ok but don't set yourself up that it becomes a habit for them to solicit your time + privacy.

That's what I would do, if I were in your shoes.
 

Z Buck McFate

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Hey Z Buck - I completely identify with your reactions. My problem with doing that only comes in when the person does other stuff later that is a problem. Then the previous incidents that I dismissed as insignificant in light of more information get brought up again and the person feels I am hanging onto a bunch of little insignificant things or that if there was a problem I should have dealt with it sooner before I felt really resentful. Unfortunately, it is difficult to make the call of when that should be because it is only in response to new information and an overall picture forming that the inconsiderateness is an overarching issue rather than an isolated incident that it becomes a real problem. Any ideas for how you make that call? I found especially in a relationship with the ESTJ who dealt with most things internally, it caused a lot of problems. I waited until I was sure something was truly a problem and when it was finally brought up, the communication was immediately shut down or the problem remained unresolved. Then any subsequent issue that reflected the same underlying cause had lots of residual gas to fuel the fire.

Exactly.

I'm asking how others react to feeling annoyed because I'm trying to reshape my own initial reactions to 'new information'. I hate that "I should have dealt with this sooner" feeling. I'm trying to figure out how to give my annoyance more weight in the first place. And the only thing I can think of is to get opinions of how others would have reacted differently- so I can pick and choose pieces to incorporate into my own automatic reactions. I'm having trouble coming up with how- to give my annoyance more weight- on my own.
 

Z Buck McFate

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Give yourself and the neighbors plenty of time to become friends, years if necessary- that way you don't come across as one big pushover or doormat - which we easily give that vibe off, I think... Enjoy being the enigmatic neighbor - it works better this way! Someone wrote on a thread about keeping people in the acquaintance zone for very long before moving them to the friend zone. In this case, I'd suggest keeping the communication style firmly in the 'neighbor and nothing more' zone for a comfortable amount of time before upgrading if ever, to the 'acquaintance and occasional help' zone.

This might sound overly cold, but I'm really not looking for any kind of friendship with the neighbors. I probably care less than I should about what my neighbors think of me, which is why I didn't think twice about calling the police to solve the 'kids throwing stuff' problem. Truly. I mean, I'm never blatantly rude or anything, but I absolutely never go out of my way to show friendship because I'm not interested. I don't like that it may sound elitest, but I just don't like wasting time on 'friendly behavior' with people who bore me. I'm not disrespectful to them, just incredibly, incredibly aloof.

Thank you for the advice though, it was thoughtful of you.
 

Immaculate Cloud

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MBTI Type
INFJ
This might sound overly cold, but I'm really not looking for any kind of friendship with the neighbors. I probably care less than I should about what my neighbors think of me, which is why I didn't think twice about calling the police to solve the 'kids throwing stuff' problem. Truly. I mean, I'm never blatantly rude or anything, but I absolutely never go out of my way to show friendship because I'm not interested. I don't like that it may sound elitest, but I just don't like wasting time on 'friendly behavior' with people who bore me. I'm not disrespectful to them, just incredibly, incredibly aloof.

Thank you for the advice though, it was thoughtful of you.

Wow, that aloof? :huh:

Me, I have gone of my way and invested much time and effort into a few friendships...I guess not all INFJ are that deliberate then.
 

Esoteric Wench

Professional Trickster
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Messages
945
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
7w8
I'm really not looking for any kind of friendship with the neighbors. I just don't like wasting time on 'friendly behavior' with people who bore me. I'm not disrespectful to them, just incredibly, incredibly aloof.

Wow! It is shocking to me to hear such a statement from an INFJ. It sounds unnecessarily separatist/elitist no matter how many "I'm not blatantly rudes" dress it up. Z Buck McFate, perhaps you are engaging in an overly Directive style of communications. (Check out a great summary about this here.)

Extreme directive communications can be interpreted as rude... oftentimes to the INFJ's surprise who thinks they were just being efficiently straightforward. For example, I think this kind of attitude is very off-putting to most other Fs in general and this ENFP in particular...

I'm forced to quote from my own post in the other thread. Even though I'm talking about doorslamming, I think the same principle can be applied to cutting off relationships before they ever begin. This is another kind of doorslamming that I find troublesome because it never even gives the other person a chance. It seems like the most basic human decency you can give another person is to judge that person based on your interactions with them and NOT based on preconceived notions:

An unhealthy/immature INFJ may engage in doorslamming in maladaptive ways... When cutting off contact with another person becomes an easy answer to the complicated process INFJs must undergo to process incoming information and navigate discomfort in their relationships.

I read once that Introverted Intuition is akin to a framework for understanding. Every time new information comes into the INFJ’s psyche, they must reprocess the entire framework to incorporate the new information. This is a very laborious process. Thus, to conserve mental energy, INFJs will sometimes dismiss new information if they judge it’s a rehashing of something they've processed previously. If the INFJ isn’t careful, they will fall into the trap of dismissing outside input too readily.

In other words, some INFJs use Fe to serve the needs of Ni by rejecting new information. A more healthy, balanced approach would be for Fe to judge whether or not the INFJ's framework is still valid given the new information coming in. This takes more mental work, but it is critical for a healthy INFJ.

An INFJ who uses their Fe to serve the needs of their Ni, rather than to check its excesses, will be rigid in their life stance. Such an INFJ may come off as opinionated, dismissive, snobbish, or arrogant. These INFJs see only what they want to see and are sorely lacking in humility.

I have to wonder if you, Z Buck McFate, have ever considered that your neighbors may have something to offer you that you have not yet considered and could not anticipate? It seems like you have already decided (after one weekend) that these people are boring. You might be right. But, you can't know for sure after one weekend. No one could. So perhaps you are jumping to conclusions too quickly. Doesn't everyone have something to offer?

I gently suggest that perhaps you might be happier if you adopted a more open stance to meeting new people.

Do you think that your Fe is being used to support your preconceived notions or are you using Fe to make sure that your framework of understanding reflects that latest facts you took in and thus you'll need a rethink.

Seems like if you reflected on the fact that you don't know everything, and that no matter how good your gut feelings about people are that you're sometimes wrong, then you would be forced to hold your judgment open for a longer period of time than one weekend.

I'm just sayin'... :hug:
 
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