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[ENFJ] ENFJ's

INTPness

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What's the best way to show an ENFJ that you are mildly interested, but also still be able to back them off if necessary (without hurting their feelings or pushing them away for good)?

I am interested in talking to her (we dated briefly some years ago) and more or less deepening the friendship (if something more develops, great - if not, no harm done), but she can sometimes get a little pushy or overbearing as if trying to push the relationship back to the place where it once was. I'm not at that place anymore and while I enjoy talking to her, I want to be able to push back when I need to without hurting her.

I've said things to other NF's in similiar situations that have hurt them - things that seemed like they needed to be said, but that the NF thought was abrasive or rude.

The ENFJ texted something to the effect of "I think I'm getting closer to being in a relationship with the person I want to be with". I wanted to say, "Well, next time we talk, you'll have to tell me about him because I know it's not me", but I refrained because I thought it might be too Ti-ish for her.

It's not that I don't want to talk, but don't push and force things. Advice?
 

OrangeAppled

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^ That phrasing sounds rather passive-aggressive....to me, it's steep with resentment.
You could say something like, "that sounds good - who is that person?". IDK, it seems more direct without revealing your personal reasons for wanting to know. It also seems more positive and supportive which may make her more inclined to open up to you.
 

Mad Hatter

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You could say something like, "that sounds good - who is that person?". IDK, it seems more direct without revealing your personal reasons for wanting to know. It also seems more positive and supportive which may make her more inclined to open up to you.

The way I see it, such a question would make the personal reasons very obvious. For what other reason would you ask such a question?
Rather than appearing supportive, it might also seem invasive.
That's my perspective, and maybe I've become a bit hypersensitive about invasiveness.

Sorry if I'm not offering any real advice here. I just can't relate to the situation - with me it's either infatuation or indifference ;)
 

INTPness

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^ That phrasing sounds rather passive-aggressive....to me, it's steep with resentment.
You could say something like, "that sounds good - who is that person?". IDK, it seems more direct without revealing your personal reasons for wanting to know. It also seems more positive and supportive which may make her more inclined to open up to you.

It's me she's talking about in the text. It feels passive-aggressive from her. Instead of saying something direct like, "I hope we can move towards something" she's saying something indirect like that - "the guy" is me. But, I'm not ready to be "that guy" quite yet. I want to continue to talk to her and get closer, but I want her to back off with that stuff because (a) I'm not into her like that at this point (I very much enjoy her company, but I'm not "drawn to her" or on the fast track to love - it's innocent right now for me), and (b) because of the fact that I'm not into her like that, I don't know how to respond to those kinds of things. It feels pushy, forced, and aggrivating.
 

TopherRed

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It's me she's talking about in the text. It feels passive-aggressive from her. Instead of saying something direct like, "I hope we can move towards something" she's saying something indirect like that - "the guy" is me. But, I'm not ready to be "that guy" quite yet. I want to continue to talk to her and get closer, but I want her to back off with that stuff because (a) I'm not into her like that at this point (I very much enjoy her company, but I'm not "drawn to her" or on the fast track to love - it's innocent right now for me), and (b) because of the fact that I'm not into her like that, I don't know how to respond to those kinds of things. It feels pushy, forced, and aggrivating.

Please, say everything you just said, in a nice way, without holding anything back. If she insists on ignoring you after that point, I would consider breaking off the friendship.
 

Heinel

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By the way, when ENFJs want to tell you something about you (Like for example, that they know you're gay), do they hint at it by talking about some other gay people that they've met? It seems to be what I am picking up, and not just from one person, even people I've just met for the first time. Am I right about it? Is it toxic?
 

Poki

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By the way, when ENFJs want to tell you something about you (Like for example, that you're gay), do they hint at it by talking about some other gay people that they've met? It seems to be what I am picking up, and not just from one person, even people I've just met for the first time. Am I right about it? Is it toxic?

Are you gay?
 

Yloh

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Some people have a one track mind. They know what they want and won't stop until they get it. What I mean by this is some people won't even stop, even though they got a flat out NO. I would flat out let her know what you are feeling regardless of the solution. Nothing is better than the truth.

This might also be a P vs J issue because you seem to have a "take things as it come" attitude. This girl has a "here is the plan, what it the progress of our friendship, are you ready for the next step yet?" attitude.

"I am interested in talking to her (we dated briefly some years ago) and more or less deepening the friendship (if something more develops, great - if not, no harm done), but she can sometimes get a little pushy or overbearing as if trying to push the relationship back to the place where it once was. I'm not at that place anymore and while I enjoy talking to her, I want to be able to push back when I need to without hurting her."

When you put (if something more develops, great - if not, no harm done) it confused me. From what you wrote, you seem like you are only interested in being good friends (and nothing more), but that statement gave me the idea that you seem interested in bringing back the relationship. I know you have a "take it as it comes attitude", but you can't give her ANY hints of "anything more that a friendship". She will devourer those hints and push to make her hopes come true. Tell her you still want to be here friend, but nothing else can happen. Don't give her a possibility of a relationship. Hopefully then she will just allow things to flow.

Some people really can't have a "take things as they come" attitude. This might be her.

If she still can't get the message, then you just might have to avoid her until she gets the message.

Good luck and hope you get some good advise from here.
 

nynesneg

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By the way, when ENFJs want to tell you something about you (Like for example, that they know you're gay), do they hint at it by talking about some other gay people that they've met? It seems to be what I am picking up, and not just from one person, even people I've just met for the first time. Am I right about it? Is it toxic?
I highly doubt this has anything to do with ENFJs specifically. More of just someone trying to skirt around a touchy subject without offending the other person. :blink: I rarely do this.


When you put (if something more develops, great - if not, no harm done) it confused me. From what you wrote, you seem like you are only interested in being good friends (and nothing more), but that statement gave me the idea that you seem interested in bringing back the relationship. I know you have a "take it as it comes attitude", but you can't give her ANY hints of "anything more that a friendship". She will devourer those hints and push to make her hopes come true. Tell her you still want to be here friend, but nothing else can happen. Don't give her a possibility of a relationship. Hopefully then she will just allow things to flow.

Some people really can't have a "take things as they come" attitude. This might be her.
This probably has to do with how much interest you guys have in the relationship. I've had times where I just wanted to "take it as it comes" in a friendship/relationship, and other times where I absolutely knew I liked that person and wanted to know a yes or no on the relationship now.

Like he said you need to give her clear signals, and stick to one way or the other. Don't lead her on at all until you know that's what you want. I can understand the context of her text if you've been off and on flirting with her and she's trying to figure out wtf you want... and you don't know what you want yourself.
 

Heinel

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I highly doubt this has anything to do with ENFJs specifically. More of just someone trying to skirt around a touchy subject without offending the other person. :blink: I rarely do this.

So it is toxic? :huh: I didn't know my presence bother people that much......

This probably has to do with how much interest you guys have in the relationship. I've had times where I just wanted to "take it as it comes" in a friendship/relationship, and other times where I absolutely knew I liked that person and wanted to know a yes or no on the relationship now.

Like he said you need to give her clear signals, and stick to one way or the other. Don't lead her on at all until you know that's what you want. I can understand the context of her text if you've been off and on flirting with her and she's trying to figure out wtf you want... and you don't know what you want yourself.


But what does it mean to be off and on? I mean, what do you guys expect from introverts (I'm assuming INTPness is one too)?
 

Poki

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If you let her know where you stand be ready to constantly stand firm and keep pushing it as you will continue to get these questions.

But what does it mean to be off and on? I mean, what do you guys expect from introverts (I'm assuming INTPness is one too)?

Thats a J trait which we know nothing about. We are dimmer switches:happy:
 

OrangeAppled

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Please, say everything you just said, in a nice way, without holding anything back. If she insists on ignoring you after that point, I would consider breaking off the friendship.

Exactly.

There's no communication here. He thinks she is sending passive-aggressive hints, but so is he. Neither will outright say what they really want. That's going to lead to more problems than just being upfront about what you want and what you feel.

She wants a relationship, but you just want to stay friends. Well then tell her. But you're also going to have to accept that she may move on to someone else romantically. Expecting her to hang around as a single friend just in case you want a relationship with her in the future is not fair.


The way I see it, such a question would make the personal reasons very obvious. For what other reason would you ask such a question?
Rather than appearing supportive, it might also seem invasive.
That's my perspective, and maybe I've become a bit hypersensitive about invasiveness.

Sorry if I'm not offering any real advice here. I just can't relate to the situation - with me it's either infatuation or indifference ;)

IDK....my guy friends have discussed girls they were interested in romantically with me, so I don't see anything invasive about a conversation like that, particularly in light of the text message which brought the subject up. That's how I would talk with any friend, male or female.
 

Heinel

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Im married to an ENFJ whats your excuse :rolli:

That it's been a week and you really can hold a grudge. I guess I'm sorry that I have hurt your feelings with my arguments. I should have been more considerate. You can move on now. But you can never be an ISTP or ESTP or iSTP or eSTP or whatever half combination you can think of for as long as you continue to use these dirty Ni tactics on people.


And I'm sorry for the rest of the people who have to put up with this, it should have stayed in the SP forum.
 

Poki

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That it's been a week and you really can hold a grudge. I guess I'm sorry that I have hurt your feelings with my arguments. I should have been more considerate. You can move on now. But you can never be an ISTP or ESTP or iSTP or eSTP or whatever half combination you can think of for as long as you continue to use these dirty Ni tactics on people.


And I'm sorry for the rest of the people who have to put up with this, it should have stayed in the SP forum.

I honestly didnt realize I was in a grudge with you. You smokin crack?

edit: and I suck and keeping track of who posts what, sorry. I am really not a people person.
 

INTPness

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Thanks for all the input.

I guess what I left out is that she just slowly started calling me and re-initiating contact again. And, like I said, I enjoy talking to her - she's a cool person. Nothing has ever been said about a "relationship" to this point - just subtle hints in the things she says and asking me certain kinds of questions. So, I don't feel that I've "held anything back" or "failed to communicate". I'm just enjoying her friendship. There was nothing for me to communicate to her - she initiated contact and I'm fine with that.

I see her as someone that it could "potentially" work out with - and I guess that's where I'm not being fair to her. Since it is just now becoming clear that she wants more than just a friendship, out of fairness I guess I need to be very direct and stick to that. I don't want the advances or her implying that there is something there when there isn't, so I should let her know that those things aren't OK.

My original post was simply because I have no problem being direct with her, it's just that in the past I've been direct with NF's in ways that they found to be abrasive and hurtful. I want to be direct with her, but without hurting her in my typical NT fashion. It's something that has caused problems for me before, so I'm trying to learn how to soften the way I come off or at least make it more diplomatic. Then you get into the whole, "not being yourself" and trying to be someone you're not.

But, good advice so far. Thanks.
 

Poki

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Thanks for all the input.

I guess what I left out is that she just slowly started calling me and re-initiating contact again. And, like I said, I enjoy talking to her - she's a cool person. Nothing has ever been said about a "relationship" to this point - just subtle hints in the things she says and asking me certain kinds of questions. So, I don't feel that I've "held anything back" or "failed to communicate". I'm just enjoying her friendship. There was nothing for me to communicate to her - she initiated contact and I'm fine with that.

I see her as someone that it could "potentially" work out with - and I guess that's where I'm not being fair to her. Since it is just now becoming clear that she wants more than just a friendship, out of fairness I guess I need to be very direct and stick to that. I don't want the advances or her implying that there is something there when there isn't, so I should let her know that those things aren't OK.

My original post was simply because I have no problem being direct with her, it's just that in the past I've been direct with NF's in ways that they found to be abrasive and hurtful. I want to be direct with her, but without hurting her in my typical NT fashion. It's something that has caused problems for me before, so I'm trying to learn how to soften the way I come off or at least make it more diplomatic. Then you get into the whole, "not being yourself" and trying to be someone you're not.

But, good advice so far. Thanks.

Ive responded to my wife before "So whos the lucky guy?" then a few line below said how I felt. She responded "is whos the lucky guy an inside joke?" then a little while later realized what I meant and said that she was so busy trying to come up with a similiar response that she completely missed my joke.
 

Domino

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I don't understand the ambiguity.

If I really truly liked what you were selling, I'd drag you to the ground like a wounded gnu.
 

nynesneg

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Thanks for all the input.

I guess what I left out is that she just slowly started calling me and re-initiating contact again. And, like I said, I enjoy talking to her - she's a cool person. Nothing has ever been said about a "relationship" to this point - just subtle hints in the things she says and asking me certain kinds of questions. So, I don't feel that I've "held anything back" or "failed to communicate". I'm just enjoying her friendship. There was nothing for me to communicate to her - she initiated contact and I'm fine with that.

I see her as someone that it could "potentially" work out with - and I guess that's where I'm not being fair to her. Since it is just now becoming clear that she wants more than just a friendship, out of fairness I guess I need to be very direct and stick to that. I don't want the advances or her implying that there is something there when there isn't, so I should let her know that those things aren't OK.

My original post was simply because I have no problem being direct with her, it's just that in the past I've been direct with NF's in ways that they found to be abrasive and hurtful. I want to be direct with her, but without hurting her in my typical NT fashion. It's something that has caused problems for me before, so I'm trying to learn how to soften the way I come off or at least make it more diplomatic. Then you get into the whole, "not being yourself" and trying to be someone you're not.

But, good advice so far. Thanks.

Excellent comment. Your maturity and desire to communicate is highly commendable. :yes:

I think your conclusions are right on track. I would simply add to that in your direct conversation of letting her know you feel,
1) you'll want to pick a setting that's condusive to open conversation (Ie, IRL not chat/email),
2) try not to sound sarcastic (the first txt response sounded somewhat that way even if was unintentional)
3) and give her an opening/encouragement to explain her point of view as well so you both have a clear understanding.

Good luck bud!
 
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