[ENFP] The ENFP Paradox

[brazz]

Well, I guess that just goes to show we are paranoid.

I took the self-righteous bit as a reply to my comment two posts before where I was trying to defend myself, so I can see why I would think I was being treated unequally.

I think I'm just disappointed because I imagined this would be a place where I could say my opinions without being looked upon negatively (someone saying I sound self-righteous while defending myself against someone who called my opinion self-righteous seems negative/hostile/unwelcoming to me, but that's just me).

 

[targobelle]

oh yes there you go....

deep breaths okay it's really not that hard.

It would seem that there is this thing with reading posts and providing a proper reply with enfp's there seems to be more scanning than reading going on......

 

[brazz]

Heh, is it a me thing or is it an ENFP thing that I hate it when people tell me to take deep breaths?

Anyway, I enjoyed this for all of a week or so. I think I'm done with this.

 

[targobelle]

this forum? or this thread?

I am guessing you to be a young enfp

 

[CzeCze]

It would seem that there is this thing with reading posts and providing a proper reply with enfp's there seems to be more scanning than reading going on......

Hahahah, how did you know???

And, open call to everyone, but is anyone going to respond and continue to throw down this 'self-righteous' gauntlet? Because, dude, I'm not done arguing yet.





P.S. Do you get that when I post, it's usually tongue in cheek?

P.P.S. 'Cause I hate to diminish from the humor of that last emoticon by injecting 'yes this is a joke'...

P.P.P.S. But seriously, I'm not done arguing.

 

[targobelle]

< enfp

I just know these things

 

[autumn]

That echoes with me. I know that I'm generally liked, but I feel like it's mostly a passive sort of thing, eg they like me only because I haven't annoyed them. But outside of my friends, I don't feel like they nessecarily regard me as one of their favourite people, or even as a person they might otherwise consider spending time with / inviting somewhere, etc. So I suppose that is probably a respect issue. Even at work, I wonder sometimes why other people who started the same time as me are given more responsibility/taught more about the business (I've only really worked in retail/shop assistant sort of thing so far, so it's in that sort of capacity). And yes, if I objectively look at it, the others are more responsible and motivated than I am, so it's only fair, but still, it'd be nice to be valued.

Maybe we feel like our best traits (whatever we feel they are) are not really seen and appreciated by the world at large? And the things people generally like us for are things are either we don't see as particularly good or strong traits in ourselves (like our ability to adapt to every situation and be totally dependant on pleasing other people seems to be a love-hate thing with ourselves) or things we take for granted, and thus aren't sure why people like us? And consequently are insecure that they do.

I think this is very insightful. Maybe this is a silly example, but I have at times felt that I was not as well-liked as I would prefer since I would sometimes see other people being visited or invited places where I wasn't. I knew none of these people disliked me, and were in fact my friends, and additionally that I have a reputation for being "friends with everyone" and "loved by everyone". But it was more like a respect or worth issue...why did I have to be the one to initiate an activity? Why didn't other people invite me more often than I invited them? The more I think about this, the sillier it seems. Maybe it's as simple as
1. I don't need to be invited every time, and I am still liked even if this is the case, and
2. People know that I tend to initiate social opportunities, and it becomes habit more than anything else to expect that I will be doing more initiating than they will.

But to a sensitive NF with dominant Ne seeing all kinds of possibilities, sometimes the pouting comes a little before the laying out of logical facts.

Fineline said:
"I think that all types can be in this situation. We all have strengths and can be the hero in the right setting. But in the wrong setting our strengths may be squandered; our strengths may come across as sterile or even counterproductive.

ENFPs have a playful, holistic approach to problem-solving. ENFPs can really shine when a situation is novel, touchy, and involves a lot of sensitive variables. But if a problem is routine or requires a critical rather than holistic approach, then the ENFP's talents may be wasted. The ENFP may have nothing more to contribute than mere playfulness. And even if that's welcomed by the others around them, it's not really what the ENFP wants to be valued for."

This was also very insightful, and follows directly upon the previous quote from arcticangel about ENFPs perhaps feeling sometimes that our best traits aren't seen by the world at large, and so we're kind of liked, but not taken as seriously and appreciated on as deep a level as we'd like because it sometimes seems we're liked on a more tangential level for our very good but less essential skills. Not that it's bad to be liked for your pleasing less essential skills, but there is an understandable appeal to being truly appreciated on a deeper level.

 

[autumn]

Perhaps many ENFPs are also accustomed to frequently show outright our approval for others, and since not all types are like this, we do not always receive such straightforward data in return, leaving the Ne wandering about and thinking of all kinds of creative reasons why this could be.

 

[RDF]

I'll write up something later (tomorrow or the next day) and post it here. I'll try to tie it in with ENFPs so that it won't represent a derailing of this ENFP thread.

I did post some notes and ideas, but they grew in scope to the point that I used them as a thread starter in the "MBTI..." forum. (I feel bad about scattering related posts all over different threads, but the latest one didn't really belong in this thread.)

Here's the link:

http://www.typologycentral.com/foru...-bastardized-version-personalitypage-com.html

 

[targobelle]

I'm always amazed at the essay like writings that other types seem to do. With their complete understanding and grouping of MBTI personality types. It's always so much to read and oh so overwhelming.

Is that just me or enfp types in general?

 

[RDF]

I'm always amazed at the essay like writings that other types seem to do. With their complete understanding and grouping of MBTI personality types. It's always so much to read and oh so overwhelming.

Is that just me or enfp types in general?

As I said at the start of that essay, those are mostly just notes for my own use. I was just capturing a Te moment, with the hope that the idea might come in handy later in combination with some other application.

But I realize that it's a bit much, so I put it in a different thread. Personally I would never read a long technical essay like that either, unless I was very interested in the material already.

I just put it up for anyone else that might be interested, and also to follow up on my promise to post some additional notes. (Didn't want to get accused of bailing on a commitment, no matter how casual.)

 

[targobelle]

As you can tell I became overwhelmed by all there was available there as far as information goes and I overlooked it all, quickly scanning it to see if anything jumped out at me.

 

[CzeCze]

I'm always amazed at the essay like writings that other types seem to do. With their complete understanding and grouping of MBTI personality types. It's always so much to read and oh so overwhelming.

Is that just me or enfp types in general?

Nope, me too!

Honestly, I do the pan and scan a lot. Meaning I liberally "scan" (ahem) as opposed to read word for word a lot of text when people are discussing the in-depth mechanics of Ti and Te, etc. and debating back and forth.

Honestly, I don't know what most these things really mean.

Someone here tried to explain the difference between socionics vs. MBTI typing to me and I was like

I literally had nothing to say.

Hahahaahaha, man we are not making ENFPs look good to the more technically minded types right now.

 

[targobelle]

Nope, me too!

Honestly, I do the pan and scan a lot. Meaning I liberally "scan" (ahem) as opposed to read word for word a lot of text when people are discussing the in-depth mechanics of Ti and Te, etc. and debating back and forth.

Honestly, I don't know what most these things really mean.

Someone here tried to explain the difference between socionics vs. MBTI typing to me and I was like

I literally had nothing to say.

Hahahaahaha, man we are not making ENFPs look good to the more technically minded types right now.

It's alright..... although put me in a secure political environment and I have had people begging for more and hanging on to my every word. So you see we have stuff up there it just takes a lot to get us to really share what's going on. I gotta wonder if we look like the stereotypical 'blonde' where everyone thinks she's stupid but the reality is, more often than not, that she never felt comfortable enough with sharing what was going on in that pretty lil head b/c too many people had laughed at her......

or am I just injecting my own life in there.....

 

[CzeCze]

Shucks, thanks for the hug.

I gotta wonder if we look like the stereotypical 'blonde' where everyone thinks she's stupid

You know, reading some other comments on the forums and especially the 'fictional nf' thread -- I really think so!!! Actually worse, I think people think ENFPs are all fluffy and cute Cute is a 4 letter word. I really don't think people take ENFPs that seriously.

more often than not, that she never felt comfortable enough with sharing what was going on in that pretty lil head b/c too many people had laughed at her......

or am I just injecting my own life in there.... .

That really sucks you feel people have tried to control you by laughing at what you have to say -- because that's what it comes down to. People can't handle the truth! Hahaha, but seriously if you have a 'pretty little head' sometimes it's too much for people to handle that you're more than that and they (sometimes inadvertently) try to put you in your place. Which is their problem not yours.

I wish you luck on your journey to being the formidable ENFP debater par excellence that I know is in you. If having a [pink cuddly] ENFP bodyguard helps you say what you feel like, just let me know. I personally want to hear what everyone has to say, especially other ENFPs!

My own story is a little different, because I've always been quite happy to engage in 'debate'.

HAAHAHAHAHA. While I may have some areas of functional non-expertise, overall I'm more than comfortable giving my opinion on things...even if everyone forgot to ask me.

 

[targobelle]

thanks for listening. I have never gotten the pretty lil head thing, I have gotten the awe you are just too cute to take seriously.

I always back away from a debate though, it's too much for this brain to take, too much for my emotions to engage in. *sigh* I married an entp he debates he's never wrong, it's just easier that way......

 

[niffer]

LOL. Honestly, I don't get it either.

I think we have the potential to understand it though. It's just all the information and all the effort and time it would take to read through the pages and pages of explanations isn't exactly appealing.

 

[arcticangel02]

Ya. I find I start to read things like that and usually my attention span just goes out the window and I skip over the rest. Only when it's really engaging (or I have to read it!) can I manage long blocks of writing.

If you put it in smaller blocks, I'm sure I'd be able to cope with it and understand it fine.

As far as giving my opinion on things, yeah, I find unless it's a comfortable, casual debate with my family, I'll usually remain quiet or just input a few small points, because I'm just not that sure of my own opinion/facts. (Plus I usually find myself debating with an INTP who successfully manages to pick holes in any argument I have! )

 

[shen]

I think people think ENFPs are all fluffy and cute Cute is a 4 letter word. I really don't think people take ENFPs that seriously

ENFP seriousness= psycho's
nothing comes out mouthwize unless its from slavver... one flung drama is worth ten in the bush
the boss goes and does everything in his/her power to remove you from the affected area forever.
policies/house rules/rota's get changed by affected person/people
other people go

yeh were cute

 

[Usehername]

Nope, me too!

Honestly, I do the pan and scan a lot. Meaning I liberally "scan" (ahem) as opposed to read word for word a lot of text when people are discussing the in-depth mechanics of Ti and Te, etc. and debating back and forth.

Honestly, I don't know what most these things really mean.

Someone here tried to explain the difference between socionics vs. MBTI typing to me and I was like

I literally had nothing to say.

Hahahaahaha, man we are not making ENFPs look good to the more technically minded types right now.

lol i explained it to my ENFP friend; he read it and he's like, "umm, why are you motivated by the need to be competent? why do they need to do so much? do you have like relaxation issues or something?" he was very seriously baffled and astounded that anyone could be motivated by such things. i think he understood that he was different but he just thought other people were better at organizing their crazy minds.

i was frustrated with him not b/c he wouldn't read it (if i really begged him he would do it) but because i feel like with a conscious awareness of what he unconsciously pwns, he could literally pwn life. it's like there's a universally-unlocking key on the top shelf and he just sees no need to reach his arm up there to use it b/c he has one that works on 90% of the doors anyway.