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[INFJ] INFJ + ENFP = Transcendental Romance. INFJ + ESTJ = Duality. Any thoughts?

nomadic

mountain surfing
Joined
Jul 15, 2008
Messages
1,709
MBTI Type
enfp
wow. i never circle, i just look at each layer until it peels away, cus it takes time for me to get really attached. and if i find something too much to handle, then i just kinda phase out...

there's actually this infj girl i know, and we get along pretty electrically. if that can describe it. she has made it clear to me the door is ajar for me... but there's reasons i can't go after her, and haven't in the past...but but if i was forced to be together with her, i would be happy on many levels.
 

Skyward

Badoom~
Joined
Jul 3, 2008
Messages
1,084
MBTI Type
infj
Enneagram
9w1
Elaur's post is spot on with me. If I like someone in even a slightly romantic way I have already lost. I wont get the relationship because I'll be trying to hard. I have to learn to take things more objectively or I'll put the person on a high pedestal. Romantic interest seems only successful only after I have become friends with the person and understand them better.
 

IEE623

New member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
196
MBTI Type
NeXx
To the OP, I think ESTPs would be a better match for INFJs. There is still on-going argument about the comparative introverts between Socionics and MBTI. A lot of ppl believe the IxxJ in MBTI would be Ixxp in Socionics and vice versa.
 

Cheat1011

New member
Joined
Feb 28, 2009
Messages
18
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
5w4
INFJ = MBTI INFP

Socionic labels it INFJ because an INFP's dominant function is a judging one, Introverted Feeling.
 

the state i am in

Active member
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
2,475
MBTI Type
infj
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
my understanding too is that duals are infp-estj and infj-estp which seem much more accurate in my experiences. i think estp especially makes more sense for infj females, and the estp and estj males for females makes sense especially for 4s and 9s who are said to look for a parental figure (1s, 8s, and maybe? 6s) and often dig etj guys and etp men. infj 6s and 9s generally get along well with 3s bc they feel safe (that outward 3 confidence is oh so reassuring!).

5s also often like 2s, which is partly why 5 intps can go for esfjs or enfjs so easily. 4s and 4 wings often feel like 2 is going backwards or the wrong direction (disintegration). 6s and 5w6 are probably more appreciative of 2w3 than 5w4, who wants intensity.

i like enfp a lot. i like dominant intuitives a lot. but i am a 5w4 and i pretty much need to communicate profoundly continuously or i feel bottled up, so sharing perceptions and perceptual legibility/interpretation/anticipation are absolutely crucial for me. as a 5 i get 4s and i get 6s. 7 is like the 5 antidote. it pulls you out of your shell. 8 and 3 do not mesh easily with 5. we all think we're (OBVIOUSLY) right and communication is terrible as a result.

4w5 infjs have a very deep need for communication but they deal with their questions and concerns and inner life more in terms of ethics (practical reason), whereas 5w4 deals more in terms of knowledge/truth (the universal). as such they can hold out longer without communicating profoundly and meaningfully, as they see their individual journey as more of a behind-the-scenes backdrop for their lives (a quiet, PRIVATE project). whereas 5s need to chart-the-course more assertively or they feel wasted and incomplete and purposeless.

we used to talk about infp and infj as mirror images of each other. infj and enfp are more mirror images. n, f, t, s just facing in the opposite direction each moment. left-brained and right-brained version. infj and entp are like alter egos with the same judgment just flip-flopped in order of importance. and intj and infj share the exact same cartography on their journey.

infj males are less likely to go for a T woman, but in the end it does promote growth and self-sufficiency and rationality in a very positive way. tho at times the intense F saturation of an nf woman, too, is extremely refreshing, cleansing, and regenerative (for all things F- colors, music, art, delicate shades of feeling, selfhood, personal values (read: valuation), etc).

also, some people test way more partners before being able to accept anyone. some people accept others almost wholly right off the bat. some are far more dedicated/committed to ltr and others don't need it nearly as much, or value it at different points in their lives enough to make it worth its while. these somes make all the difference when you don't line up with another and don't see why.

enfps seem scattered to infjs bc their thru traffic is so much higher and the idea that they are so much more capable as extroverts asserting their wills in the world makes us feel like we are at a disadvantage. our insecurities and defenses are largely built out of these fears, which stem from our lack of practice and lack of formulae to consult when we need to make something happen. we seem them scattered so far across the soil and worry so much about the grammar of the situation as if it will protect us, and oftentimes we are inexperienced enough and do not have the efficacy/confidence to realize that someone could, in fact, want to stay with us at all, choose our travel package over that of our competitors. and we're just afraid of getting hurt, which happens easily when you haven't shed your relationship baby fat and disillusioned yourself (and your incomplete and inaccurate upbringing/heritage) in the fiery furnace of the world.
 

mwv6r

New member
Joined
Nov 22, 2008
Messages
208
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4w5
Given the choice, I'd pick ENFP over ESTJ any day. No offense to the many fine ESTJs out there, but I just find that the ESTJ/INFJ dynamic is best as professional business partners or something of that nature. In the workplace we have a healthy respect for each others' strengths, but friendship-wise we have next to nothing in common and as far as a relationship goes, there is zero chemistry. This is just my personal experience of course, I know in this forum I've read of some instances of INFJs having successful relationships with ESTJs.

Anyway.... INFJ+ENFP chemistry = AMAZING. I love me some ENFPs. Relationship-wise I don't know if I could keep pace with one, but as far as light flirting and friendship I find it to be a really fun dynamic. :hug:
 

Wonkavision

Retired Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2009
Messages
1,154
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
7w8
By the way--

I just noticed that Personalitypage.com lists INTJs and INFJs as ideal partners for ENFPs.

link: ENFP Relationships

(it's at the bottom of the page)
 

TopherRed

New member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
1,272
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Enneagram
2w3
Instinctual Variant
so/sx
One of my favorite reference sites. ^
 

LotsOfHeart

New member
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
298
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
4
I never really thought the S/N thing made the world's biggest difference, like a lot of people do. Then again, that's just my opinion.

I don't really care if someone lives in the present or the future. I just care about their character traits, and I've found whether they know things intuitively or observe things through the senses, in most cases it has very little correlation with character being good or bad.

The character traits are picked up by nature and nurture, personal choices, their other traits such as extroversion/introversion, E/I and J and P.

However, whether someone is intuitive or sensing, to me, is pretty unimportant in most cases. The point is, living entirely in the present or living entirely in the future is unhealthy either way, so a truly healthy person won't do either. If someone has trouble seeing the big picture, it doesn't make them a bad person. Likewise, if someone is relatively unobservant about the present, it doesn't make them bad either.

The only types where sensing can affect things negatively for me is ESFJs. I get along great typically with ENFJs, but turn them into a guardian termperment and I can have issues, simply because I have trouble getting along with most ESJs I've met. Introverted sensing judgers, not so much trouble, but extroverted ones, can have trouble appreciating anything that's different from what they expect to be normal, and that annoys me to no end. Then again, I get along great with some other ESFJs I've known. ESTJs, I can usually avoid fighting with, but there is a definite tendency to clash because they typically believe the system works and INFJs often want to change it into something we feel is better.

Otherwise, sensing people have skills I wish I had sometimes. They're often great dressers, can take care of the day to day things, observant, etc. I would have no problem dating an intuitive or sensing person.
 

SuperFob

New member
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
264
MBTI Type
INFJ
I think that, while any two types can get along, the ENFP-INFJ combo has a lot going for it.

There seems to be a difference in sense of humor, from what I can tell.
A difference in the sense of humor or the existence of it?
 

Wonkavision

Retired Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2009
Messages
1,154
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
7w8
A difference in the sense of humor or the existence of it?

Just a different sense of humor.

It seems like INFs don't like mean or crass humor as much as ENFs, but I really don't know---it probably depends.

It's not something I've put a lot of thought into, just a half-assed guess as to why I've personally clashed with INFJs.
 

Edasich

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2007
Messages
192
Enneagram
4w5
Just a different sense of humor.

It seems like INFs don't like mean or crass humor as much as ENFs, but I really don't know---it probably depends.

It's not something I've put a lot of thought into, just a half-assed guess as to why I've personally clashed with INFJs.
I'm INFJ and about 1/4 of my sense of humor is crass, as embarrassed as I am to admit that, haha.

My favorite sense of humor is definitely dry humor tho...love it!
 

fill

"Everything in its place"
Joined
Jun 28, 2009
Messages
507
MBTI Type
entp
Enneagram
753
Just a different sense of humor.

It seems like INFs don't like mean or crass humor as much as ENFs, but I really don't know---it probably depends.

It's not something I've put a lot of thought into, just a half-assed guess as to why I've personally clashed with INFJs.

Hah, I'm quite the opposite of what you describe. People can mistake me for a complete dick for my sarcastic behavior at times. For example, in my English class we were discussing gender; all the guys went one place and the girls another to discuss complications between gender. One of the guys said, "It gets complicated when a girl is really into you but you're not into her. It's sort of awkward." I thought the tone was way too serious in the group, so I decided to lighten it up and say, "I think it's funny," and instead of laughter people looked at me like I was Satan. I had to say at least three times I was kidding.

I really tend to keep my humor to myself for this exact reason. People really can't see the 'deeper' part of it where I'm actually making fun of the people that would say something dick-ish like that.

Actually, I've noticed ENFPs are just people who have the balls to say what I'm actually thinking instead of being really 'nice' and keeping it to themselves.
 

BlahBlahNounBlah

New member
Joined
Dec 16, 2008
Messages
1,458
MBTI Type
ENTP
Enneagram
7w6
Hah, I'm quite the opposite of what you describe. People can mistake me for a complete dick for my sarcastic behavior at times. For example, in my English class we were discussing gender; all the guys went one place and the girls another to discuss complications between gender. One of the guys said, "It gets complicated when a girl is really into you but you're not into her. It's sort of awkward." I thought the tone was way too serious in the group, so I decided to lighten it up and say, "I think it's funny," and instead of laughter people looked at me like I was Satan. I had to say at least three times I was kidding.

I really tend to keep my humor to myself for this exact reason. People really can't see the 'deeper' part of it where I'm actually making fun of the people that would say something dick-ish like that.


Befriend more ENTPs.
 

jixmixfix

Permabanned
Joined
Jun 21, 2009
Messages
4,278
I would like to get as many inputs as possible from you guys.

Socionics states that duality is the most rewarding relationship because it satisfies both partners' needs for completeness. Stages in this relationship also vary from being shaky to unbreakable (ONLY if there are mutual attractions and both partners have the same goals in life). I've met some ESTJs throughout my life, but they just don't seem to notice my presence (the introvert dual is supposed to fade in the background).

Regarding the ENFP: I LOVE ENFPs:wubbie:. I adore ENFPs:wubbie:. It's been my dream to end up with one, be it friendship or family life:yes:. I wish there could be more. But the 2 ENFPs that I met seemed very....distant. I even showed them my sincere intention to be friends. But oh well, maybe other ENFPs can explain about this, not just for romantic relationships but friendships as well:hug:.
I can still see how loving ENFPs are. They think far ahead and use feelings when making decisions, which can be seen as irrational. However, those are what make them dedicated to their relationships.

Your comments are appreciated. Thanks! :hug::)

ISTPS are suppose to be another good combo with INFJS. ISTPS are in the same quadra.
 

jixmixfix

Permabanned
Joined
Jun 21, 2009
Messages
4,278
Just a different sense of humor.

It seems like INFs don't like mean or crass humor as much as ENFs, but I really don't know---it probably depends.

It's not something I've put a lot of thought into, just a half-assed guess as to why I've personally clashed with INFJs.

ENFP dual is suppose to be ISTP and I agree with this. I find ENFPs are attracted to me, and I find them attractive as well. I also notice instances of other ISTP-ENFP relationships working really well. According to socionics the quadra is ISTP-ENFP INFJ ESTJ. ISTP and ENFP being duals and ESTJ and INFJ being duals. But any of the four combinations get along well with each other.
 

blomiki

New member
Joined
Sep 28, 2009
Messages
31
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
-
INFJ + ENFP = AMAZING!

"Anyway.... INFJ+ENFP chemistry = AMAZING. I love me some ENFPs. Relationship-wise I don't know if I could keep pace with one, but as far as light flirting and friendship I find it to be a really fun dynamic."

I am an ENFP that has jut fallen in love - after 3 years of friendship - with my INFJ best friend. Transcendental Romance is right. We are ridiculous. I understand what you say about "keeping pace" - I think he and I both sometimes wonder about my crazy happy all-over-the-place life.

Also, I don't want to only share my quieter, more intense moments with him. That's where it's awesome to see the INFJ "dual character" come through. He can be quiet and intense most of the time and then when he's in a social setting where he feels comfortable, he becomes so outgoing and witty and he can win anyone over in 5 minutes... amazing to see him switch between quiet, even shy, and totally withdrawn in some settings, and then see him loud and social the next.

All I can say is the people are right about the NF match... It is deeply fulfilling to be his girlfriend.
 

BMEF

Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2009
Messages
50
My favorite teacher is an ESTJ! I think that he is extremely inspirational and amazing! Yet, I think that an INFJ doesn't like an ESTJ at first sight. When I first heard about
him (he's a physical education teacher) from older students, I was afraid from him. When he first started teaching me, I was always quiet and only nodded my head if he asked me or the class a yes-or-no question or gave me some personal advice. After months of showing him a lot of respect, I took things to the next level. I started to greet him whenever I saw him in one of the school's hallways. A year later, I started to talk to him more casually and thanked him for many things, like teaching me (ESTJs love receiving credit) :)
Now, we're like good student-teacher friends. If it weren't for him, then I would've never loved sports.
 
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