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[INFP] Accepting your Flaws..INFPs

Scott N Denver

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Apr 25, 2009
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I guess I DO miss the point and this is typical of me in dealing with my INFP.. I am intelligent an observant but When it comes to her.. and you, now.. I simply miss the point..

being a perfectionist when you are not perfect .. especially morally and ethically.. is illogical.. all you do is set yourself up disappointment by setting standards that cant always be maintained by you or the people you love

Logic does not necessarily interest us. And sometimes the pursuit of something, even if the final goal is ultimately unattainable, is where value is found.

Seriously though, we don't place much emphasis on pure logic. Especially not when dealing with others. Common INTJ INFP pitfall/miscommunication IME.
 

Scott N Denver

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I guess I DO miss the point and this is typical of me in dealing with my INFP.. I am intelligent an observant but When it comes to her.. and you, now.. I simply miss the point..

being a perfectionist when you are not perfect .. especially morally and ethically.. is illogical.. all you do is set yourself up disappointment by setting standards that cant always be maintained by you or the people you love

but we are better people, and help make a better world, for trying...

reasonableness in expectations, especially of ourselves, is not something that we are known for being good at :cheese:
 

OrangeAppled

Sugar Hiccup
Joined
Mar 20, 2009
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sp/sx
YES!!!!!! but that is also my failing.. I want results and can rarely give her the time she needs..

but after she has mulled and apologized.. If of course I was in fact correct in the 1st place...It seems that the admission itself is something that cannot be accepted and the she goes on the offensive..

it would have been wonderful indeed, if she could have also toughened up a little or at least realized my ultimate goal was harmony between us..and not take it as an all out personal attack..I am not always soft.. but I try to be fair honest and just in lieu.. I guess that is just not what she needs

Add some compassion in with that fairness & honesty, and you'll probably achieve the softness necessary to deal with her. After all, if an approach is not effective, then it doesn't matter how "right" you are. Approach can be everything in this case.

If she's attacking you as a way to deflect from the issue at hand, then that is immaturity though.


I guess I DO miss the point and this is typical of me in dealing with my INFP.. I am intelligent an observant but When it comes to her.. and you, now.. I simply miss the point.

Yes, this happens a lot with people and INTJs and INFPs, in my experience. I found I really puzzled the INTJs I dated briefly. The INFP is like an abstract work of art. Just appreciate, don't try and make sense of it all :D
 

JivinJeffJones

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Ok, let me answer the OP. Welcome to the board, btw. Sorry to hear about your relationship.

Is this common for INFPs in general.. or was it simply a poor dynamic of our personality types???

No, I'd say it's fairly common for an immature INFP, or an especially insecure older one.

Do you guys and gals have trouble knowing you have the odd less than desirable trait??

No no, we are already well aware we have them. We just don't like having them pointed out to us as a general rule. Especially at length. This is a type weakness which can be overcome but takes a bit of work.

Good luck!
 

Jack_Rabid

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May 14, 2009
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ISFP
Logic does not necessarily interest us. And sometimes the pursuit of something, even if the final goal is ultimately unattainable, is where value is found.

Seriously though, we don't place much emphasis on pure logic. Especially not when dealing with others. Common INTJ INFP pitfall/miscommunication IME.

I like you INFPs.. you have a wisdom about things that are so alien to me..
even If i don't see logic.. I see the value of your approach to things..But it's like trying to teach a cat how to bark.. that sort of emotional depth escapes me.. and My girl tried but the intensity of her feelings overwhelms me and the burden of trying to live up those ideals can be so taxing
 

Jack_Rabid

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but we are better people, and help make a better world, for trying...

reasonableness in expectations, especially of ourselves, is not something that we are known for being good at :cheese:

As I have learned.. you been most insightful Scott N Denver.. I salute you
 

Scott N Denver

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I guess I DO miss the point and this is typical of me in dealing with my INFP.. I am intelligent an observant but When it comes to her.. and you, now.. I simply miss the point..

being a perfectionist when you are not perfect .. especially morally and ethically.. is illogical.. all you do is set yourself up disappointment by setting standards that cant always be maintained by you or the people you love

Your logic does not concern us. Which must be very baffling and frustrating. It behooves you to get over that though.

Also, we will make you feel all warm and gooey on the inside.

Be VERY careful in how you criticize us. As a person with lots of experience of being on the receiving side of THAT, I can tell you thats very important to us. Diplomacy and gentleness will serve you well in spades here, no matter how hard it may be for you to do so, or how much it feels like your giving in and wussifying yourself by doing so
 

Jack_Rabid

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Add some compassion in with that fairness & honesty, and you'll probably achieve the softness necessary to deal with her. After all, if an approach is not effective, then it doesn't matter how "right" you are. Approach can be everything in this case.

If she's attacking you as a way to deflect from the issue at hand, then that is immaturity though.




Yes, this happens a lot with people and INTJs and INFPs, in my experience. I found I really puzzled the INTJs I dated briefly. The INFP is like an abstract work of art. Just appreciate, don't try and make sense of it all :D

LOL You really do sound just like her.. but you are also very insightful and articulate...(not meaning she isn't).. just you and Scott have spoken to me with language I can understand and I appreciate it..
 

Jack_Rabid

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ISFP
Your logic does not concern us. Which must be very baffling and frustrating. It behooves you to get over that though.

Also, we will make you feel all warm and gooey on the inside.

Be VERY careful in how you criticize us. As a person with lots of experience of being on the receiving side of THAT, I can tell you thats very important to us. Diplomacy and gentleness will serve you well in spades here, no matter how hard it may be for you to do so, or how much it feels like your giving in and wussifying yourself by doing so

it is extremely frustrating.. And this is a well moderated sight.. so i wont get into the gooey stuff.. save to say "I know".. ;)

Sometimes it is easy for me to Give in because I love her.. but I am about fairness and compromise .. which isn't always about logic.. but rather an emotional need.. and therefore why isn't it a moral and ethical priority for my girl?? to at least give in to me 1 out of ten times??
 

Scott N Denver

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Add some compassion in with that fairness & honesty, and you'll probably achieve the softness necessary to deal with her. After all, if an approach is not effective, then it doesn't matter how "right" you are. Approach can be everything in this case.

If she's attacking you as a way to deflect from the issue at hand, then that is immaturity though.




Yes, this happens a lot with people and INTJs and INFPs, in my experience. I found I really puzzled the INTJs I dated briefly. The INFP is like an abstract work of art. Just appreciate, don't try and make sense of it all :D

OA, you might be a piece of art but I prefer to think of myself as a finely crafted katana, or maybe tai chi sword. Its very ornate and detailed, and it looks cool and gives off a nifty yet disciplined vibe, but when need be it can lay down the Fi-smack like no other. Hmm, I was making a joke, and yet its all serious/valid too. We INFP's are complex...:cheese:
 

Jack_Rabid

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OA, you might be a piece of art but I prefer to think of myself as a finely crafted katana, or maybe tai chi sword. Its very ornate and detailed, and it looks cool and gives off a nifty yet disciplined vibe, but when need be it can lay down the Fi-smack like no other. Hmm, I was making a joke, and yet its all serious/valid too. We INFP's are complex...:cheese:

Either and or.. I simply lack the grace you types need
 

Amargith

Hotel California
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I'm no INFP, but I'd say your girl never really discovered or realized that other types, such as yourself, don't see things the way she does naturally. Of course those things are obvious at the surface, but it doesn't occur to her that you have a different way of viewing the world and approaching stuff. Also, she's a Fi-dom and you're tertiary Fi..I'd say she's trying to educate you on it and doesn't realize that although it is possible to learn from her, you'll never be Fi-dom. Your strengths, which seem to be forgotten in all this, are elsewhere. Don't feel bad about this, it's not that you're inadequate, it's just that she hasn't taken enough of a distance from her Fi to see past it.

On the other hand, I dunno the context of this 'hypocrisy', but is there something that happened in the past that made her paranoid about your logs online? Does she have a good reason to demand this? She seems to be hurt or have lost faith there somehow. Could be from her past or anything.(you don't have to answer this, I'm just trying to make you check if there's a reason for her fear). If it has nothing to do with you, then try gently making it clear that you understand that she's fearful about this, but that you haven't done anything to betray her trust yet and would never dream of doing so. That you understand her need for security but would also like there to be an equal balance in the relationship where hiding things and distrusting each other have no place.

And yes, Fi-users, especially Fi-doms spend a great deal of time perfecting their ethics and morals. So they're touchy about it. It would be like telling you you're incompetent in at your job, or how you handle things. They are usually very aware of their own flaws and try desperately to sort them out or at least cover them up for the world. You touching upon that...sorta proves that they failed and reconfirms that others see that as a flaw to. On the other hand, those things are debatable as long as you make clear within that same sentence that hey....you might have this flaw but in fact it's what makes you unique, and I love you regardless. It just poses a problem in this area. I don't judge you over this, I just want this to be taken care of. Just think about it. And then walk away. Give them time to digest, and act as if everything is normal till they are ready to give you an answer.

Last note: don't feel as if you're to blame about this. You're putting in more than your share of effort, and are going tru great lengths to understand her, something she might not be able to see or be aware of and something that might benefit her to do the same for you, so you can grow together. Even Fi-users can learn how to meet in the middle on these things, you just have to get them to take a step back and see the bigger picture so they can readjust their views and values accordingly without feeling like they have to corrupt them.
 

Saslou

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If you love this person very much and are both willing to make the necessary adjustments, then it should to be a win/win situation. :)

(Sorry, just my 2 cents)
 

PeaceBaby

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Well we get along so brilliantly every way.. except conflict.. and no amount of intellect,reasoning or emotional submission seems to help.. We just end accusing each other or not listening.

You are using detached thinking to approach conflict; she is using her attached feelings to engage conflict. You want her to use reason in these situations, while she needs to use and express how the conflict makes her feel too, which to you no doubt appears irrational. Her ability to take all the factors of a situation into account will seem alien to you, since you likely don't attach much value to your feelings in what appear to be purely "logical" issues. And for her, feelings come part and parcel with almost every thought, so it is almost impossible to ignore them.

And bear in mind your so-called "rational" approach will appear cold and unfeeling to her. Even if she does have strong, well-developed Te functions.

If you emotionally submit to her as well, she can likely sense you are being disingenuous, not true to yourself at least, and this adds further to your conflict. In her eyes, it will look like you just want to "drop it" by trying to appease the situation so she "shuts up".

Let me read more of the replies here and comment further from that too. :)
 

matilda

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She probably places high personal/emotional importance on those values of hers.

"If you care about me, you must care about the things I give a damn about."
 

PeaceBaby

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I was going to write a long post after reading through this thread, but changed my mind and will tell you this instead:

The day I realized that I couldn't fix everything, couldn't save everyone, couldn't do all things, wouldn't understand all things, couldn't be perfect, I cried.

When I truly understood that my body would age and even betray me, that my mind could indeed be forgetful, that my heart wasn't always compassionate, and my soul not always open and honest, I cried.

I am not trying to be overly dramatic, but perfection means that much. Trying to be perfect may be illogical, but that still does not detract from the desired attainment of it. (We're like the Borg; resistance to that inner calling is futile!)

Your girl sounds like she has put up walls to protect her from these truths, to deflect from the harshness of them. You pointing out to her she is only human is probably not the reality check you think it is, it is paramount to telling her she is a failure.

If there is a chance for you to get back together, be gentle in this area. Be yourself though, don't just cave in to her emotional states. For any relationship to work, it requires honestly and willingness for both parties to "meet in the middle". But if I was with a man who continually wanted me to face my imperfections, it would be hard for me too. I already feel painfully aware of where I am lacking.
 

Coeur

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Criticism offends me when:
1. The person is not in a position to criticize me. For example, if I was a hairstylist and some random person on the street said that I was doing something wrong, that'd really irritate me.
2. When I think the person means it personally. Meaning: "I hate this about you. It drives me insane. I think less of you for it." That hurts. I don't like that I have traits that drive people insane. If the person meant it in an objective, "I love you anyways" way, I wouldn't care as much.
3. If it's too harsh. It isn't constructive, or neccessary. The person said it just to say it. It's like: jeez, what did I do to deserve THAT?
 

Strawberrylover

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The day I realized that I couldn't fix everything, couldn't save everyone, couldn't do all things, wouldn't understand all things, couldn't be perfect, I cried.

When I truly understood that my body would age and even betray me, that my mind could indeed be forgetful, that my heart wasn't always compassionate, and my soul not always open and honest, I cried.

Wow. That really helps me understand my INFP friends. Thanks.
 

Stanton Moore

morose bourgeoisie
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Logic is like a spellchecker for an INFP. It can point out flaws, but it's not necessary to get the point across.
 
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