[Fi] Are Fi and selfishness related?

[Lauren Ashley]

Yeah. Was just adding to the point that you Fe users need to realize that Fi users will have a subjective view on how they should treat someone.

I think that some do. After all, Fe is attuned, at least in theory, to others' wishes. But I think because of all this "flexing" to the desires of others, after a while they begin to think that it is high time that they let their own views be known. I doubt it is about trying to put the person into society's box of what's right and wrong, but to let the person know their particular view on things.

 

[heart]

When people go in the hospital or nursing homes, I hate to break this news, but they still need their allies in the outside world to help them with things, to be there and fight for them when needed as well. They need an advocate and they need someone to bring them mango ice cream and sneak it past the nurses desk when things get really desperate.

Originally Posted by BlackCat
Yeah. Was just adding to the point that you Fe users need to realize that Fi users will have a subjective view on how they should treat someone.

But as an Fi user matures, they should be able to use either Ne or Se to gain greater perspective on other people as well. It's a give and take.

 

[rainoneventide]

I don't want a friend who's doing all this shit for me just so they can be a "true friend". If I'm in a hospital and you don't want to come visit me, then don't visit me. Don't come because you feel obligated; that's insulting.

I make friends because they're interesting people that I want to be around, not because they're people who fit a "true friend" criteria. I don't base a friend's worth on shallow, insubstantial things like get well cards and flowers. Ugh. Ew. Ugh. Seriously, people.

 

[OrangeAppled]

I think this person is lost in her own little Fi world. In Fi land, you stay connected to people through your imagination & can forget to contact them in reality. 6 months can feel like a few weeks in a relationship to me. It's hard for me to maintain friendships, even though I manage to stay emotionally connected to people despite lapses in contact.

Communication is key with an INFP. YES, we need to be hit over the head & told directly what you want. NO, we do not automatically know what we are supposed to do socially. I always feel like there was a day in school I missed, and that was the day everyone else was taught the social graces but me . Thank goodness for my ISFJ mom who taught me about writing thank you cards & that sort of thing.

Quite honestly, I would not visit a sick friend, but I would probably email/call to see how they are doing. I would only visit if that friend expressly asked me to do so. Otherwise, I would feel like I was intruding. I can't say I would want to be bothered with visitors if I was laid up with a broken leg, and I tend to cast my feelings onto others.

Another thing, when I am not in the mood to socialize, I feel I am doing people a favor by staying away. I am just grouchy & moody & not good company, so I don't like to burden people with my presence. I don't see that as selfish....

 

[BlackCat]

I think that some do. After all, Fe is attuned, at least in theory, to others' wishes. But I think because of all this "flexing" to the desires of others, after a while they begin to think that it is high time that they let their own views be known. I doubt it is about trying to put the person into society's box of what's right and wrong, but to let the person know their particular view on things.

Yeah. Fi and Fe are the same process, but sort of backwards of each other I've noticed. It's the same way with the other functions too.

 

[alcea rosea]

I don't want a friend who's doing all this shit for me just so they can be a "true friend". If I'm in a hospital and you don't want to come visit me, then don't visit me. Don't come because you feel obligated; that's insulting.

I make friends because they're interesting people that I want to be around, not because they're people who fit a "true friend" criteria. I don't base a friend's worth on shallow, insubstantial things like get well cards and flowers. Ugh. Ew. Ugh. Seriously, people.

I like your post.
I'm very similar in this way.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

I make friends because they're interesting people that I want to be around, not because they're people who fit a "true friend" criteria. I don't base a friend's worth on shallow, insubstantial things like get well cards and flowers. Ugh. Ew. Ugh. Seriously, people.

Neither does anyone else in this thread...

 

[heart]

I don't want a friend who's doing all this shit for me just so they can be a "true friend". If I'm in a hospital and you don't want to come visit me, then don't visit me. Don't come because you feel obligated; that's insulting.

I make friends because they're interesting people that I want to be around, not because they're people who fit a "true friend" criteria. I don't base a friend's worth on shallow, insubstantial things like get well cards and flowers. Ugh. Ew. Ugh. Seriously, people.

Ever really been sick or disabled and had a friend who really went the distance to keep you company or give you help you didn't even ask for but really, really, really needed? Has nothing to do with get well cards and shallow gestures. But there has to be a designation for the friend who stands by and helps and the friend who is so afraid to even hear about someone else feeling sick they can't even call you. So hence my term true friend.

But you see, my friend (an Fi dom) had been disabled in a body cast years before I knew her for a time, so she understood about all vulnerability and weakness and need. It's all about what you've been through and where you've been and how you look at life.

 

[alcea rosea]

I like your post.
I'm very similar in this way.

I would like to correct my statement after reading hearts previous post.

If somebody would really bother and come to see me at hospital if I were sick, and I would feel they did it because they wanted to not because they felt obligation to do it, then I would really really really be happy about it and I would feel very much loved by this person. But i need the feeling of that person being genuine and them really wanting to do it. Otherwise, it's thanks, but no thanks.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

Ever really been sick or disabled and had a friend who really went the distance to keep you company or give you help you didn't even ask for but really, really, really needed? Has nothing to do with get well cards and shallow gestures. But there has to be a designation for the friend who stands by and helps and the friend who is so afraid to even hear about someone else feeling sick they can't even call you. So hence my term true friend.

Right. An interesting person is an acquaintance, not a friend.

If anyone thinks a friend is just someone to lay out in the sun and chew bubblegum with, I don't want to say this in a harsh way, but get real.

 

[heart]

Yeah. Fi and Fe are the same process, but sort of backwards of each other I've noticed. It's the same way with the other functions too.

This doesn't seem Fe/Fi to be though. It's more of an empathy thing and how egocentonic one is.

 

[Athenian200]

But there has to be a designation for the friend who stands by and helps and the friend who is so afraid to even hear about someone else feeling sick they can't even call you. So hence my term true friend.

If that was the purpose of your distinction... then it was well made.

I am not a true friend, because I fall into the other category (what is that one named, by the way?). You acknowledge that there IS another category, which I think is good.

Sorry for all the venom earlier, then.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

I am not a true friend, because I fall into the other category (what is that one named, by the way?).

I'd like to call them the summer soldier or the sunshine patriot.

/dramatic revolutionary comparisons

 

[Verfremdungseffekt]

She also doesn't seem to get simple rules of friendship that are to me clear as day. For example I broke my foot last year and had to spend a lot of time at home and though I told her about my accident via email pretty soon and she lived just twenty minutes walk from my flat it didn't occur to her at all to pay me a visit during these weeks. I know that if my good friend had an accident and was homebound I would be over there in a flash to cheer her up.

Did you ever ask her to come over, or are you just assuming that any reasonable person would think of doing so? Because, uh, I don't see why that in itself merits special attention. If I were injured, the last thing I'd want is people imposing themselves on me, trying to make me feel better. Since, you know, there's nothing for them to do. If I want the attention, I'll ask for it.

 

[GZA]

In a way there is an element of selfishness to Fi. It's more in the sense of "this is what I like and who I am and I don't care what you think" than the "I want THAT" kind of sense. I have selfish qualities in that ultimately if I want to do or believe something, I'll completely ignore my friend's opinions and inputs and only value my own if thats what it's worth to me. If I like a girl my friends don't really approve of, fuck em. If I like music my friends make fun of, fuck em. That kind of thing.

 

[heart]

If that was the purpose of your distinction... then it was well made.

I am not a true friend, because I fall into the other category (what is that one named, by the way?). You acknowledge that there IS another category, which I think is good.

Sorry for all the venom earlier, then.

You are an internet friend. I don't expect more than words from you. It's a different world and a different kind of relation. We have more freedom here and less responsibility.

 

[heart]

I'd like to call them the summer soldier or the sunshine patriot.

/dramatic revolutionary comparisons

I would call them acquaintances and they can be fun and interesting.

Did you ever ask her to come over, or are you just assuming that any reasonable person would think of doing so? Because, uh, I don't see why that in itself merits special attention. If I were injured, the last thing I'd want is people imposing themselves on me, trying to make me feel better. Since, you know, there's nothing for them to do. If I want the attention, I'll ask for it.

There's a middle ground between pressing help on some poor soul and being unresponsive. If someone truly cares about their friend or family member, it seems good to just say "hey, if you need help, let me know I am here for you" or "do you want some company or are you feeling too tired." There, one gave the other side a ready made way out "Oh I am so tired, but thank you for asking."

Or if the sick person doesn't want any contact at all, that's why answering machines were created.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

I would call them acquaintances and they can be fun and interesting.

Um, yeah. That too. See post #70, sentence 2 for the undramatic LA version

 

[Verfremdungseffekt]

Or if the sick person doesn't want any contact at all, that's why answering machines were created.

The fuck? Now it's the injured person's responsibility to turn away unwanted attention? The more miserable I feel, the less I want people to fuss over me. Just treat me normally and it's all fine.

This scenario just sounds like a matter of the "friend" wanting to make herself feel important.

 

[heart]

The fuck? Now it's the injured person's responsibility to turn away unwanted attention?

Well, I don't imagine a person with this sort of 'tude has a horde of people calling begging to give them help to begin with and I think folks already have an inkling who these people are in their lives anyway.