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[ENFP] WTF?! ENFPS: Engaging YET ALOOF!

LadyJaye

Scream down the boulevard
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Well that's not nice. People open up to you because they think you care.

Now I'm starting to get suspicious about you guys.

I can't speak for anyone else, but the caring I project is completely genuine. I can't care ALL THE TIME, but that's when I excuse myself from the conversation if I feel like I can't respond appropriately. I don't believe in creating a false affect I have to maintain at cost to my own emotional energy. I can be kind to another's feelings while still maintaining my honesty. Otherwise, acting like I care when I don't IS deceptive.
 

CzeCze

RETIRED
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Sep 11, 2007
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Yeah, I think that ^^ touches on what some others have said about the different between being interested and "caring" in the traditional sense. I think ENTPs and ENFPs are similar in this respect and why it bothers me when I see other people get the two confused and attribute "kindness" or "warmth" to people who I don't think are warm or kind, just curious.

You can be really enthusiastic about an idea or a story and it may be genuine curiousity but it's also impartial, dispassionate or even disrespectful curiousity (like I'm a circus freak) but it doesn't mean you are emotionally invested (or want to be) in someone or care.

I feel like people get suckered all the time, whether that was the intent or not, by people who are socially smooth or just bother to ask you more than 2 questions about your day. It bothers me. It's a classic politican/used car salesmen kinda move, I see right through it and I always have. You can't bs a bs-er! It's so freaking patronizing!

Also, sometimes when people ask you about yourself it is WAY more about them than you.

This is also why I have trouble really getting along with people who I think are overly in my business or who want to ask me deep, probing questions in passing. I'm not a specimen in a jar and I'm a self-contained person, if I want you to know something I will tell you.

And being Ne dom myself, I know the difference between pure curiousity and genuine concern or interest in me and I'm not going to open up to every random.

But I agree with LadyJaye, I think maybe immature or unealthy ENFPs may fake it to an extent, but I respect people enough not to. If I show interest it is genuine.
 

Magic Poriferan

^He pronks, too!
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I think the ENFP I know cares. In fact, an interesting thing about her is that she seems to care about any bum that wanders off the street. Her immense friendliness is probably the reason she's one of the only people I've become friends with.

However, I have a very strong sense that she is uncomfortable with intimacy. She's admitted to having problems with commitment. And she is wary of subjects that cause personal acrimony between friends.

So, the general effect is that she is very engaging, but there are a lot of places where you can step that changes her tone. She never strikes me as cold, but I can tell that she's avoiding things.

That's just the one I know, of course.
 

Ace_

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I have a good ENFP friend too and he also seems to care a lot, even about random bums just like you said. That's why I was surprised when I read the posts on the previous page. I'd hate to reveal my privacy and deep feelings to someone who doesn't care. I'd feel like the stupidest person ever. The other person might even use it against me.
 

Amargith

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I have a good ENFP friend too and he also seems to care a lot, even about random bums just like you said. That's why I was surprised when I read the posts on the previous page. I'd hate to reveal my privacy and deep feelings to someone who doesn't care. I'd feel like the stupidest person ever. The other person might even use it against me.

Honestly, I think no ENFP would ever use these things against you. At least I never would. The fact that you would open up to me like that touches me deeply. I might, if i sense you're ok with it, tease you a bit with it, but only if we're alone so nobody hears and only if you don't mind. I do care about people who do that. That bond however, becomes even deeper, when I sense that you would (and could) do the same for me. I'm ok with that not being the case however, nor do I judge you for not being able/being willing to do so. I will still hold you dear. I will just not be *as* emotionally attached to you.
 

Strawberrylover

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Thanks ergophobe! Another awesome post. I liked these in particular:

1. If I ask the other person how they are doing or as we are want to do, say something along the lines of, "hey, you don't sound like yourself"...we should expect to be able to offer the person a real conversation in return for sharing. ...If I don't have the time to do this or don't know them well enough to offer comfort, I won't push them on their mood.

5. This should have really been number 1. Take care of yourself. Retreat and recharge yourself often. We forget to do this a lot and we and our relationships suffer for it. When you sleep well, eat well and meet your commitments, you have more to offer others.

7. Schedule. We are most susceptible to mixing work and play. This is my own personal challenge. Be more disciplined at work so you get more done during work time and then don't bring any home with you. Play time is really important to us!

This last one would be particularly difficult for me as I work in an environment where the two mix and it's VERY easy to get sidetracked. Kind of like Okay I'm working working working ... ooh butterflies! ... Two hours later... oh right, I should get back to work. Argh.

I've found that specifically allotting time to work on my Si really helps. Overlooked Si is a grouchy Strawberry.
 

Jaguar

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20,647
Also, sometimes when people ask you about yourself it is WAY more about them than you.


For years I have said the questions people ask can tell you more about a person, than the answers they give.
There is someone in this forum who I will leave nameless.
Easily, they ask the nuttiest questions I have ever seen.
Their answers, are irrelevant.

Questions tell you what's on someone's mind.
BTW, I hate it when people say, "So, tell me about yourself."
I'm tempted to screw with them and tell them I'm a serial-killer,
looking for my next target.
:D
 

Jaguar

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I'd hate to reveal my privacy and deep feelings to someone who doesn't care. I'd feel like the stupidest person ever. The other person might even use it against me.


I'm the type where if you tell me your personal shit, I'll take it to my grave.
However if you dare reveal my personal shit, I will put you in your grave--early.
 

hopelesswanderer

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EXACTLY. I DREAD agreeing to a committment.

Friend: How about Saturday at eight?
Me: <reluctantly> ummmm, yeah... call me...
Friend: So Saturday at eight then right?
Me: <with smile and wink> It's definitely possible!!
Friend: Ok meet me at _____.
Me: Yeah I will call you...

They can't really pin down if I'm concretely saying yes. I like to keep my options open, but also don't like to hurt people's feelings.

I don't like scheduling events because in the present moment, in the "state" I'm in, I may truly feel like going ot the event - but when it actually rolls around a week later - I don't know what my "state" will be and chances are I will very well not feel like going!!

It's best if you let me know I'm invited, but not press me to commit - so that when it does roll around, I feel like I don't *HAVE TO* go but can *CHOOSE* to go if I want. That way we are allowed to reference our present "state" in deciding whether to go - and not guess at what our "state" will be weeks or months from now.

And yes we really do find everyone fascinating, each in their own way.


Almost this identical conversation happened to me a couple hours ago! I have a friendship like thing going on with an ENFP and last night I asked if he wanted to get lunch this week. He replied with, "Yes!" and when I woke up I gave him times that I was available during the week...he never responded. So later in the day I texted again asking if tomorrow would work and he goes, "Possibly! Let's play it by ear!"

hahah so now I understand why..I've noticed this, but was never sure if it was me or just him. He doesn't like to be held down by commitment, which is kind of ironic because I have come to realize that I need commitment for most things and I've noticed a lot of other INFJs are the same way. Yet ENFPs and INFJs are supposed to be very comparable for each other? Interesting. I'll have to bring this up to him so that he knows that I understand.
 

Amargith

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Almost this identical conversation happened to me a couple hours ago! I have a friendship like thing going on with an ENFP and last night I asked if he wanted to get lunch this week. He replied with, "Yes!" and when I woke up I gave him times that I was available during the week...he never responded. So later in the day I texted again asking if tomorrow would work and he goes, "Possibly! Let's play it by ear!"

hahah so now I understand why..I've noticed this, but was never sure if it was me or just him. He doesn't like to be held down by commitment, which is kind of ironic because I have come to realize that I need commitment for most things and I've noticed a lot of other INFJs are the same way. Yet ENFPs and INFJs are supposed to be very comparable for each other? Interesting. I'll have to bring this up to him so that he knows that I understand.

You'll see, if you reread earlier parts of the thread, that we tend to be a lot less flaky with the person we share our lives with :wink:

They tend to take priority in the attention department, for obvious reasons, as well as be 'in the know' wrt what we need. At least, thats how it works for me. I have no qualms telling my INTJ 'Not now, dear.', whereas that is way harder to explain to others. He *knows* how my moods work, as he lives them, daily. He won't look at me bizarrely when I try to explain to him why this is important and how it is I cannot work around this. Or why I even dare to give this priority - the earful you get when you try and explain this to others...:doh:

Meanwhile, he has no problems identifying which circumstances will warrant a breach of my 'cocoon' without abusing the fact that he can actually enter as he'll be shooting himself in the foot if he does - there are quite severe consequences to not allowing me to recharge, especially for me and those living with me. My vivaciousness, warmth, understanding and empathy do eventually have a limit, if not allowed to recover. And considering he very much enjoys those spoils and knows first hand what happens when I run out, it is very much a priority to him to make sure I don't.

That is more than I can say for most of my friends or the outside world.

Iow, its a very different experience being our SO vs being our friend ;)
 

skippythecat

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Dec 1, 2013
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Almost this identical conversation happened to me a couple hours ago! I have a friendship like thing going on with an ENFP and last night I asked if he wanted to get lunch this week. He replied with, "Yes!" and when I woke up I gave him times that I was available during the week...he never responded. So later in the day I texted again asking if tomorrow would work and he goes, "Possibly! Let's play it by ear!"

hahah so now I understand why..I've noticed this, but was never sure if it was me or just him. He doesn't like to be held down by commitment, which is kind of ironic because I have come to realize that I need commitment for most things and I've noticed a lot of other INFJs are the same way. Yet ENFPs and INFJs are supposed to be very comparable for each other? Interesting. I'll have to bring this up to him so that he knows that I understand.

Yes! That is so true about me too. I really try to understand people's busy life and be as flexible as I can, but it gets to me when I put a lot of effort to reaching out and get no commitment (same response) OR you don't feel like hanging out (once the commitment has been made). I will say that I will view you as a flaky person and don't care to hang out with you in the future. I take it personally because I feel like you don't respect my time yet you expect me to meet you more than half way. If you communicate to me ahead of time for whatever reasons that you can't make it, I totally respect that and will move on. No biggie.

You'll see, if you reread earlier parts of the thread, that we tend to be a lot less flaky with the person we share our lives with :wink:

Hmm, that's very interesting...I invited this enfp guy to an event awhile ago and he mention that his friend is throwing a party that same night too (okay, cool). He said that he'll try to come but he doesn't want to be flaky with me. When he said that my respect for him grew because he was honest with me upfront.

JMT.
 

five sounds

MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247
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I've gotten way better about this. I used to just say yes to everyone and flake out.

Now I make and keep plans much better and am better at communicating a "maybe" when that's what needs to be said. I do tend to either overestimate how much I can do in a given period of time or just get overwhelmed by too many plans and stop participating in plan-making. I guess the time-management piece still needs work.

Edit: oh but the "aloof" thing. Yeah, I'm off in my head a lot. I think N-doms can get caught up in analyze mode or something where we're operating just a few steps outside of what's really going on around us.

Also, I sometimes wait too long to "recharge" and I think people can be put off by a sudden shut-out.

I've also read it's a 7w6 thing to be kinda head-in-the-cloudsy. Guess I never stood a chance lol.
 

Dancing_Queen

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I'm an ENFP and I have found (and been told) that one minute I can be completely friendly, engaging, playful, charming, flirtatious. etc. and then the next minute I can be aloof, guarded, private, elusive, mysterious, and difficult to get to know.

I've reflected on this and tried to figure it out. When I'm "out and about" my curiosity towards and fascination with people intrigues me and drives me to be social. I feel like an explorer, and I am GENUINELY interested in exploring/studying/engaging with everyone/anyone.

Yet when it comes to the point where I actually need to MAKE TIME for someone, as in they want to hang out or whatever - I can suddenly withdraw and become very protective of my time, autonomy, and freedom. I can become quite elusive. When I am present, I will make you feel like you are the only person in the room, because I truly will be fascinated with you, yet I can be tough to pin down.

When someone calls me up and I don't answer the phone or the email or whatever and I start acting distant - people tell me I let them down. They want more. I flee. They say I flip flop, give mixed signals, and can be difficult to read.

Any other ENFPs experience this phenomenon? Any thoughts on why we can pull this number?

As warm, friendly, and engaging as we are we actually have a very private side that we allow few others to access I believe.

We can give the illusion of having been completely "open," yet little do they know, they have barely scratched the surface. The result - people feel very connected to us - like they *know* us - but we may not feel that same *connection* to them, although they will believe that we feel that way towards them! They are inevitably surprised to discover that we don't! That we were just being friendly!

Totally me.

I have an almost scientific interest in people. I often offer up information about myself to draw other people out and more often than not they see this as a bond formed. It isn't. I just wanted information and am personable enough to draw it out of other people. If someone doesn't want to be probed I back off and expect to be treated the same.

I am often told I'm cold and unfeeling because I can be so engaging and warm one minute and then off in my own exclusionary world the next. Just because an ENFP is curious about you doesn't mean they actually care. Remember that we lead with our perceptions, not our feelings.

Agree 100%. I'm not nearly as sentimental in my interests as it may seem.

Amen. Nothing makes me want to flee faster.

I want to give on my own terms so to speak - not for it to be EXPECTED. By the same token, I INVITE others, but do not EXPECT it.

I also have a huge need for autonomy and independence. I hate it when someone tries to "tell me what to do" or control me. I will rebel!

THIS.

My time, my space. I go to you when I want to, if I want to. Don't pester me.
 

five sounds

MyPeeSmellsLikeCoffee247
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Amen. Nothing makes me want to flee faster.

I want to give on my own terms so to speak - not for it to be EXPECTED. By the same token, I INVITE others, but do not EXPECT it.

I also have a huge need for autonomy and independence. I hate it when someone tries to "tell me what to do" or control me. I will rebel!

oh, this too big time.
 

Dancing_Queen

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Yeah, I think that ^^ touches on what some others have said about the different between being interested and "caring" in the traditional sense. I think ENTPs and ENFPs are similar in this respect and why it bothers me when I see other people get the two confused and attribute "kindness" or "warmth" to people who I don't think are warm or kind, just curious.

You can be really enthusiastic about an idea or a story and it may be genuine curiousity but it's also impartial, dispassionate or even disrespectful curiousity (like I'm a circus freak) but it doesn't mean you are emotionally invested (or want to be) in someone or care.


I feel like people get suckered all the time, whether that was the intent or not, by people who are socially smooth or just bother to ask you more than 2 questions about your day. It bothers me. It's a classic politican/used car salesmen kinda move, I see right through it and I always have. You can't bs a bs-er! It's so freaking patronizing!

Also, sometimes when people ask you about yourself it is WAY more about them than you.

This is also why I have trouble really getting along with people who I think are overly in my business or who want to ask me deep, probing questions in passing. I'm not a specimen in a jar and I'm a self-contained person, if I want you to know something I will tell you.

And being Ne dom myself, I know the difference between pure curiousity and genuine concern or interest in me and I'm not going to open up to every random.

But I agree with LadyJaye, I think maybe immature or unealthy ENFPs may fake it to an extent, but I respect people enough not to. If I show interest it is genuine.

BRAVO!!! :wubbie:

I am sick and tired of all the ENFP stereotypes that paint us like Disney characters all the time. I did really think I was an ENTP for more than a year and it weren't for some very specific things that made me pause, I'd probably would still think I was one.

I honestly don't know where people get this whole "ENFP are open books!" bull from. I blame the Maniac Pixie Girl phenom, I swear 90% of fictional ENFP examples are either one of them or a Disney princess (not to shade them, I love some of the very much).

Yes, I'm a good person, yes I'm a good friend. No, I don't wanna hear you whining about your boyfriend yet again!
 

Qlip

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BRAVO!!! :wubbie:

I am sick and tired of all the ENFP stereotypes that paint us like Disney characters all the time. I did really think I was an ENTP for more than a year and it weren't for some very specific things that made me pause, I'd probably would still think I was one.

I honestly don't know where people get this whole "ENFP are open books!" bull from. I blame the Maniac Pixie Girl phenom, I swear 90% of fictional ENFP examples are either one of them or a Disney princess (not to shade them, I love some of the very much).

Yes, I'm a good person, yes I'm a good friend. No, I don't wanna hear you whining about your boyfriend yet again!

I hate to say it, but that rep we get is because often we push it. We aren't open books, but its comfortable to have an image projected so that people are distracted with it while we evaluate them.
 

Lady_X

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BRAVO!!! :wubbie:

I am sick and tired of all the ENFP stereotypes that paint us like Disney characters all the time. I did really think I was an ENTP for more than a year and it weren't for some very specific things that made me pause, I'd probably would still think I was one.

I honestly don't know where people get this whole "ENFP are open books!" bull from. I blame the Maniac Pixie Girl phenom, I swear 90% of fictional ENFP examples are either one of them or a Disney princess (not to shade them, I love some of the very much).

Yes, I'm a good person, yes I'm a good friend. No, I don't wanna hear you whining about your boyfriend yet again!

I took that to mean that we just don't hold shit back like others might. That we prefer to be open and direct and just real. We will say the completely honest thing that not everyone will.

But you're right and I agree with you that I don't just sit and tell everyone my business. I don't even get very personal on here and I've been here a long time. It's too public.
 

Lady_X

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Also always hated the Disney princess stuff too.
 

HongDou

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BRAVO!!! :wubbie:

I am sick and tired of all the ENFP stereotypes that paint us like Disney characters all the time. I did really think I was an ENTP for more than a year and it weren't for some very specific things that made me pause, I'd probably would still think I was one.

I honestly don't know where people get this whole "ENFP are open books!" bull from. I blame the Maniac Pixie Girl phenom, I swear 90% of fictional ENFP examples are either one of them or a Disney princess (not to shade them, I love some of the very much).

Yes, I'm a good person, yes I'm a good friend. No, I don't wanna hear you whining about your boyfriend yet again!

Is it bad if I fulfill that stereotype though? :cry:
 
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