[NF] talents, hardwork, and luck : which matters the most?

[niki]

the reason i post this topic is because i know there're some of you (not only me) who has a dreams to become an artist. and this kind of talk, is usually, just unavoidable. whether sooner or later, one (an artist) has to face it, and find the answer.

so the question is this:
is whether it's talents, hardwork, or luck that matters the most?
which one?

for example - i hope this wouldn't offend any fans out there, i'm just simply using these people as examples , and from my personal opinion too - in the case of musician, you sometimes see some 'unfairness' indeed that people like Britney Spears can get more famous than the 'talented' Norah Jones..
but at the same time, though, i'm kinda glad that Christina Aguilerra (she's just soo talented, IMO) is also popular & selling well , a proof that talent + hardwork would result in something big. but what about folks like Britney, or those multitude of rappers out there, who seemingly can get rich & famous way too 'easily' ? ...is it because of the multitudes of people (or mainstream society) whom have little idea of who's the real talented one and who's not?

share your thoughts.

 

[The Third Rider]

I rather be lucky than good.

 

[Eruca]

Luck, hardwork then talent. Luck being the most important. But all 3 is best.

 

[wolfy]

It takes hard work, talent and then luck in that order.

 

[The_Liquid_Laser]

Talent comes before hard work. Luck depends on the degree. We can all count on a little luck from time to time, but being born the child of a billionaire would be extreme luck.

 

[wolfy]

Talent comes before hard work. Luck depends on the degree. We can all count on a little luck from time to time, but being born the child of a billionaire would be extreme luck.

It takes hard work to reveal talents and make something of them. They kind of go hand in hand but hard work seems the more important one to me.

 

[gloomy-optimist]

I'd think about it in a different way; the three things a person needs to be successful is talent, hard work, and charisma. Half of luck is just knowing which strings to pull and how to get on the good sides of the right people.

However, in the light of the original post, I think hard work, talent, then luck. Some few people get lucky; most people have to work for it.

 

[Darjur]

First and foremost - Competence at what you're doing. No one really gives a flying fuck whether it comes from hard work alone, hard work and talent or just plain talent. The result is the same, you are either competent at what you're doing or not. If you are not competent, no amount of luck is going to save your ass.


Then, I'd give awareness of ability, risk, social surrounding and goal. Awareness does not indicate how "good" you are at doing something, but it indicates of how much you can profit from your competence. Naturally, if your main goal is to be profitable, awareness goes in front of competence in importance, but that is not always the case, because you don't need to "aware" by yourself, you can hire people to do this job for you. In the case of musicians, that's what the manager is there for.


Then we have luck. Luck is basically the ultimate short-term solution, luck is great at giving a head start, mid revival, a honorary end or a perfect chance. But it never overcomes competence, because competence is the difference between sustaining and taking the full advantage of the opportunity and just getting a single applause, or a one-night-stand.

If you have all of the skills required for the job, luck is only going to gives opportunities to give bursts of speed to going towards your goal, but it's never going to do the whole job. I'd consider luck to be a greatly appreciated compliment. Not a requirement.

the reason i post this topic is because i know there're some of you (not only me) who has a dreams to become an artist. and this kind of talk, is usually, just unavoidable. whether sooner or later, one (an artist) has to face it, and find the answer.

so the question is this:
is whether it's talents, hardwork, or luck that matters the most?
which one?

for example - i hope this wouldn't offend any fans out there, i'm just simply using these people as examples , and from my personal opinion too - in the case of musician, you sometimes see some 'unfairness' indeed that people like Britney Spears can get more famous than the 'talented' Norah Jones..
but at the same time, though, i'm kinda glad that Christina Aguilerra (she's just soo talented, IMO) is also popular & selling well , a proof that talent + hardwork would result in something big. but what about folks like Britney, or those multitude of rappers out there, who seemingly can get rich & famous way too 'easily' ? ...is it because of the multitudes of people (or mainstream society) whom have little idea of who's the real talented one and who's not?

share your thoughts.

It's not competence, how lucky or good of a singer they are that's at work in this case. I'd say this goes nearly completely towards awareness. Both B.Spears and C.Aguilerra are in a highly "mainstream" field. Their audiences are several times higher, than those that N.Jones aims for. N.Jones is basically a niche singer.

 

[lorkan]

Thank you Darjur! A new hope has been given to me

 

[Gauche]

i think in that case you mentioned ("getting into spolight" nowadays), its mainly the case of luck; you know there are many many talented people, and also many many hard working, and they just cant be "stars" all. Like Britney Spears IMO has got no exceptional talent, and I think she wasnt hard working, she was only the lucky b*tch at the right place at the right time, and someone made profit from her. But you know, if you are talentend you could break thought by working hard (like being competitive like fellow above me said, so you get yourself up and up and finally people start to notice you and so on.) - like e.g. Leona Lewis, but surely she has also a big deal of luck (probably more luck than hard-work).

In general cases, id choose from these 3 attributes surely talent, because its starting point, and possibilites then are almost unexhaustable, then secondly hard work (having talent is enough, and often you can beat others without so big talent in that area easily, but hard work can dramatically enhance your (or that "other's" ) abilities, and put the edge on the other side), and at last luck, because its something you cannot rely on.

 

[Seraph]

Hard work, Talent, then Luck. Talent alone will only get you so far. Once you hit a certain point where everyone else is just as talented as you, then it becomes a matter of how much work you put into it.

 

[niki]

Hard work, Talent, then Luck. Talent alone will only get you so far. Once you hit a certain point where everyone else is just as talented as you, then it becomes a matter of how much work you put into it.

so doesn't this mean talent would come first, then afterwards, after you're "on par" with your competitions (ie: another 'talented' people), then that's where hard work start matters.
but in order to get 'there' (ie: hard work), the starting point is whether the person has the talent , or not, is it?

but then music industry is sometimes (or often) different matter, and market is hard to predict.. just like that Britney Spears example..
although i'd argue that Christina aguilerra is talented, even more talented than Britney, and she can have SAME success as Britney,..so in the end yes: talent DOES matter , in fact, it's very important ?
but it seems this doesn't apply to Britney's case..
i think in her case, there comes another factor: "charisma" , or "image" ? so she can get succesful like right now?
it's getting a bit complicated here

 

[nightning]

Luck really doesn't exists... there's only probability. The more times you try, the more likely you are to succeed. That said, hardwork > talents.

It's true that talent is innate, however the lack of talent can be compensated for by hardwork. Without effort, it matters very little whether you have talent or not. You will not succeed.

Does Britney Spears have talent? Surely not! But she succeeded... why? Hardwork... not exactly on her part, but on the part of her manager and her advertising group.

 

[Seraph]

so doesn't this mean talent would come first, then afterwards, after you're "on par" with your competitions (ie: another 'talented' people), then that's where hard work start matters.
but in order to get 'there' (ie: hard work), the starting point is whether the person has the talent , or not, is it?

In order to be outstanding at something, I think you need to possess the innate capability for it (talent). I will never become an NBA star no matter how much hard work I put into it. So yes, talent does get you on par with the others, but without hard work you will never stand out- because they will be working hard as well.

Ultimately it depends on your goal. If you desire to be at the top, then you need both talent and hard work, and I would submit that both are equally necessary and important. However, if you just desire to be towards the middle of the pack, then talent alone or hard work alone would suffice.

And I don't believe in luck.

 

[Litvyak]

Ultimately it depends on your goal. If you desire to be at the top, then you need both talent and hard work, and I would submit that both are equally necessary and important. However, if you just desire to be towards the middle of the pack, then talent alone or hard work alone would suffice.

I totally agree. With talent and hard work, you'll never fall. I know it's a set phrase, but it's still true: if you're willing to pay the price to reach your goal, you will reach it. You just have to know what sacrifices are you willing to make.

 

[The_Liquid_Laser]

so doesn't this mean talent would come first, then afterwards, after you're "on par" with your competitions (ie: another 'talented' people), then that's where hard work start matters.
but in order to get 'there' (ie: hard work), the starting point is whether the person has the talent , or not, is it?

but then music industry is sometimes (or often) different matter, and market is hard to predict.. just like that Britney Spears example..
although i'd argue that Christina aguilerra is talented, even more talented than Britney, and she can have SAME success as Britney,..so in the end yes: talent DOES matter , in fact, it's very important ?
but it seems this doesn't apply to Britney's case..
i think in her case, there comes another factor: "charisma" , or "image" ? so she can get succesful like right now?
it's getting a bit complicated here

Well it depends on what you mean by "talent". For a pop singer I consider being good looking to be part of "talent" because it affects how successful you will be. I simply define "talent" as natural attributes that contribute to success and attractiveness is part of that. Obviously voice is another important component too, but it's not the only one.

An example of this that comes to mind is Faith Hill. She originally had a fairly plain look. (I personally thought she was pretty, but she definitely wasn't going for mainstream sex appeal.) After a while she went for a sexier look, and her albulm sales skyrocketed.

It's true that talent is innate, however the lack of talent can be compensated for by hardwork.

No, this is simply untrue. I can practice singing every day for years, and I will still not have as good a voice as Christina Aguilera. Work and experience are enhancements to talent, but they are not replacements. Likewise education is only an enhancement to talent.

 

[gloomy-optimist]

In things like voice and looks, which require a certain physical status, it'd be difficult to compensate talent for hard work.
However, talent for music has actually been proven to be through practice, repetition, and learning. As an artist, I'd say the same goes with drawing; anyone can do it, but it takes a lot of dedication and hard work. So in ability, hardwork could definitely pay off.

 

[Valiant]

Talent, hard work. There is no such thing as luck.

 

[iwakar]

Replace luck with "circumstantial (in)opportunity"? Just an idea.

I suppose the crux of the issue is that depending on who you are, talent, hardwork, "luck", or any variable combination of the three will result in various outcomes for different people and that is "luck" in itself.

 

[nightning]

No, this is simply untrue. I can practice singing every day for years, and I will still not have as good a voice as Christina Aguilera. Work and experience are enhancements to talent, but they are not replacements. Likewise education is only an enhancement to talent.

I admit that what you've said is true. However having an exceptionally good voice is not a requirement to becoming a pop star. My working criteria was being "good enough" to succeed not being the best. Talent certainly is needed if you want to be top dog.