User Tag List

  1. #64361
    Privileged Sh!tlord ZNP-TBA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8 sx
    Socionics
    ILE Ti
    Posts
    3,074

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by small.wonder View Post

    In fact, this has often been a point I've noted about 6+7 friends, that they feel like they have a strong sense of intuition that is actually skepticism and fear. Intuition and skepticism cannot coexist in my logic, they're just opposites. I do see how anxiety-fueled suspicion can masquerade as intuition though-- making the suspicious person feel like they know this person is ______________. I tend to compare it to McCarthyism, red-scare stuff. That's anxiety, not intuition.
    So skepticism = suspicion + anxiety? Can you expand on that reasoning? Isn't intuition just another way of observation? Skepticism would be doubt placed on that observation but I don't see how it means anxiety though I can see how suspicion can easily be mixed up with skepticism. Skepticism = I'm not sure X is true because (reasons). Suspicion = I suspect that X means something else entirely (maybe a nefarious motive?). Anxiety = X makes me feel nervous, anxious, out of sorts, uncomfortable, etc. Intuition = There may be more to X than meets the eye (which could have a relation to suspicion). Also of note my intuition doesn't work within the realm of certitude. My intuition doesn't chose my answers it just displays more potential answers. Typically my logic and sometimes my feelings ( or a combination of the both) chose the answer(s).

  2. #64362
    So she did. small.wonder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Enneagram
    4w5 sx/so
    Posts
    976

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    If one wishes to investigate levels of anxiety and how perhaps to deal with them, research Enneagram, not MBTI.
    Funny enough, by discussing correlation, that's exactly what we're doing. To say that "anxiety has nothing to do with MBTI" does not say that certain MBTI types would be more/less prone to it-- especially when discussing the correlation between MBTI and E-types shows us that.
    Find my Enneagram writing here. Also, I'd love for you to take my six question Enneagram surveyEnneagram survey!✨

  3. #64363
    So she did. small.wonder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Enneagram
    4w5 sx/so
    Posts
    976

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ZNP-TBA View Post
    So skepticism = suspicion + anxiety? Can you expand on that reasoning? Isn't intuition just another way of observation? Skepticism would be doubt placed on that observation but I don't see how it means anxiety though I can see how suspicion can easily be mixed up with skepticism. Skepticism = I'm not sure X is true because (reasons). Suspicion = I suspect that X means something else entirely (maybe a nefarious motive?). Anxiety = X makes me feel nervous, anxious, out of sorts, uncomfortable, etc. Intuition = There may be more to X than meets the eye (which could have a relation to suspicion). Also of note my intuition doesn't work within the realm of certitude. My intuition doesn't chose my answers it just displays more potential answers. Typically my logic and sometimes my feelings ( or a combination of the both) chose the answer(s).
    Why yes, of course! Especially when you used my favorite explanation phrase ("expand on that")! Like many things, skepticism can have a plethora of motivations, but with 6+7 (as in 6w7 and 7w6) individuals, in my experience, it comes from two places: 1) 6 anxiety, or fear that they are not secure and sometimes 2) 7 disintegration to 1 which can cause a "false sense of justice".

    So, I'm not saying all skepticism is anxiety fueled, I'm saying that within the context of Enneagram 6 (in particular) it is. This conversation started around a claim that INFJ's often type as 6's because they have anxiety. I don't experience that (in myself or other examples I've given), and have always found e6 + INFJ to be a pretty far fetched notion for the reasons already given. I do agree that intuition is observant, but true observation can only be had from a place of clear-headed-ness and calm, not anxiety (in my experience).

    So bottom line: I'm saying that Ni is not a fear-fuled, anxious function.
    Find my Enneagram writing here. Also, I'd love for you to take my six question Enneagram surveyEnneagram survey!✨
    Likes ZNP-TBA, Hard liked this post

  4. #64364
    Privileged Sh!tlord ZNP-TBA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8 sx
    Socionics
    ILE Ti
    Posts
    3,074

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by small.wonder View Post
    Why yes, of course! Especially when you used my favorite explanation phrase ("expand on that")! Like many things, skepticism can have a plethora of motivations, but with 6+7 (as in 6w7 and 7w6) individuals, in my experience, it comes from two places: 1) 6 anxiety, or fear that they are not secure and sometimes 2) 7 disintegration to 1 which can cause a "false sense of justice".

    So, I'm not saying all skepticism is anxiety fueled, I'm saying that within the context of Enneagram 6 (in particular) it is. This conversation started around a claim that INFJ's often type as 6's because they have anxiety. I don't experience that (in myself or other examples I've given), and have always found e6 + INFJ to be a pretty far fetched notion for the reasons already given. I do agree that intuition is observant, but true observation can only be had from a place of clear-headed-ness and calm, not anxiety (in my experience).

    So bottom line: I'm saying that Ni is not a fear-fuled, anxious function.
    It's kind of fun comparing different typology systems all at once.

    I think your first paragraph summed up your point well. I've had the opportunity to know an INFJ 6 (don't know which wing) and she would often 'flaunt' her intuitive prowess because she just 'gets so many things' other people don't. Kind of had a holier than thou complex because she believed she could read anyone correctly at any time. Her 'intuition' was anxiety fueled for sure because she's more often than not suspects shady motives. She wasn't particularly open to being shown she's wrong but I think that's because far too many people in her life put her on some kind of pedestal. Given this limited experience I'm inclined to agree with you.

    I agree about Ni though I think it can be both fear fueled and also come from a calm and clear-headed place. Surely we're not going to put a protective halo around Ni-doms and say they would never get fearful and let it mess with their most dominant function. Wouldn't that happen to anyone based on the situation?

  5. #64365
    #KUWK Kierva's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Enneagram
    3w4 sp/sx
    Socionics
    SEE Fi
    Posts
    2,494

    Default Random Thought Thread

    Sometimes, it's just like, "Why won't anyone (I want) talk to me?!"
    C#2-C#5-F#5
    3 octaves, 2 notes and 1 semitone
    Supported range: F#2-F#4-C#5
    Likes senza tema, N/A liked this post

  6. #64366
    noʎ ɟo ǝʇnɔ ʍoH Mademoiselle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    MBTI
    -NTJ
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Posts
    928

    Default

    So many things has changed.
    I'm done trying to improve, things wont get better, they only change.

    I've done what I could, but I have no will.
    No one have, but God.

    This is why I'm faithful,
    I think, I really think, then I plan, most effective, and not the best because there's always room for cumilative error.
    It's the imperfection element of this universe -and we're familiar with- as long as it's in the state of chaos, where we're all moving time-frane by time-frame, we've been pushed to do so.

    And even so, the plan can work, and it does change many things.
    But it doesn't happen, I'm not getting anybetter, rightafter I solve a problem another is born, I get more skilles but it's harder every other time.

    I'm getting consumed by it.

    I've always known this, this makes sense, it's called limits.
    I respect this, I so respect this, this is when I feel God outpower me,
    I'm not the most badass person but I'm something you can't help but notice.

    I belong to the stereo type of the human who knows but can't talk.
    In history, Moses belings to the same type.

    However this only means I can't talk to people, they will hardly get the chance to understand me, but I can still impact them, cause serious damage, but I'm too wise to do so.

    The entire universe shifting in front of my eyes, I can't show anyone what I see, but it wont make any difference because I can't do anything about it.

    I'm being pushed along.
    I'm respecting every strand of force.
    This is why I worship, guys, an INTJ is too INTJ to be a fool,
    I'm doing so as I am understanding it, believing it.

    I bear it,
    not the wild animal, I mean I know it's weight.

    Sincerly,
    INTJ doing her part.
    Last edited by Mademoiselle; 06-29-2016 at 10:30 AM. Reason: Corrected the spelling, so it wont annoy you, no problem
    Imagine this is the best thing you've ever read.

  7. #64367
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    7,416

    Default

    sooooo fukiiiiiiinggggg drowzyyyy
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.
    Likes N/A liked this post

  8. #64368
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    7,416

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by small.wonder View Post
    Why yes, of course! Especially when you used my favorite explanation phrase ("expand on that")! Like many things, skepticism can have a plethora of motivations, but with 6+7 (as in 6w7 and 7w6) individuals, in my experience, it comes from two places: 1) 6 anxiety, or fear that they are not secure and sometimes 2) 7 disintegration to 1 which can cause a "false sense of justice".

    So, I'm not saying all skepticism is anxiety fueled, I'm saying that within the context of Enneagram 6 (in particular) it is. This conversation started around a claim that INFJ's often type as 6's because they have anxiety. I don't experience that (in myself or other examples I've given), and have always found e6 + INFJ to be a pretty far fetched notion for the reasons already given. I do agree that intuition is observant, but true observation can only be had from a place of clear-headed-ness and calm, not anxiety (in my experience).

    So bottom line: I'm saying that Ni is not a fear-fuled, anxious function.
    mostly bests in swot analysis, oppornunatee costs and roi, cuz social media behavior maps consumerism and analytics drive ecommerce. alsi, idk whatever, miss fortune.
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.

  9. #64369
    breaking out of my cocoon SearchingforPeace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    MBTI
    ENFJ
    Enneagram
    9w8 sx/so
    Socionics
    EIE None
    Posts
    6,618

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Archilochus
    The fox knows many things--the hedgehog one big one.
    And I am not a hedgehog......

    -------------------

    Jesus said "Blessed are the peacemakers" not "blessed are the conflict avoiders.....

    9w8 6w5 4w5 sx/so

    ----------------------

    “Orthodoxy means not thinking--not needing to think. Orthodoxy is unconsciousness.”
    ― George Orwell, 1984
    Likes Yama, N/A liked this post

  10. #64370
    So she did. small.wonder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Enneagram
    4w5 sx/so
    Posts
    976

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ZNP-TBA View Post
    It's kind of fun comparing different typology systems all at once.
    Honestly, if we actually believe them to be effective tools, we must compare and find correlation. Doing so is especially helpful with authentic identification because it reveals double standards in the way we see ourselves, and forces us to see the true self (not the self we wish we were). I guess it's like checks and balances, which is why I personally don't believe the all type combinations are possible (because some are straight up contradictory).

    I agree about Ni though I think it can be both fear fueled and also come from a calm and clear-headed place. Surely we're not going to put a protective halo around Ni-doms and say they would never get fearful and let it mess with their most dominant function. Wouldn't that happen to anyone based on the situation?
    By all means, I'm not saying that Ni-doms don't fear, I'm saying that they probably aren't prone to anxiety. Fear and anxiety are very different things: I would feel a twinge of intelligent fear if a bear was chasing me-- fear is an accurate caution signal that we have for our benefit. Anxiety, on the other hand is inaccurate in that it's fueled by improbable fear (hence why I've said it's the opposite of calm observation or intuition). Anxiety tends to think worst case scenario, and prepare for the worst that could happen-- that has Enneagram 6 written all over it. Depending on instincts, this can pertain more to physical security, emotional security or social security (among other things). Everyone feels fear, but not everyone is prone to anxiety (when the mind exaggerates fear).
    Find my Enneagram writing here. Also, I'd love for you to take my six question Enneagram surveyEnneagram survey!✨

Similar Threads

  1. [SJ] SJ Random Thought Thread
    By Giggly in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 962
    Last Post: Yesterday, 04:09 PM
  2. [NT] Random thought thread (NT version)
    By yenom in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 157
    Last Post: 12-22-2017, 08:48 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO