User Tag List

First 456

Results 51 to 56 of 56

  1. #51
    Senior Member asynartetic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    14,352

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sung Jin-Woo View Post
    It was also the first to embrace democratic means, hedonism, sexual degeneracy, and allowing woman to vote. Aka progressive.
    While it's true that most civilizations that lessened sexual mores fell soon after, it's also true that pretty much every civilization has fallen. Although I don't really like the view that history is a series of distinct civilizations and periods. It's all a lot more continuous and fluid than that. For instance, the period from the fall of the Roman Empire to the Dark Ages in western Europe really wasn't a sudden change, in that people alive in western Europe in the late 5th century and early 6th century wouldn't have really perceived they were living in a time straddling two distinct periods and civilizations. There was actually a great deal of continuity from the late Western Empire to the period post-collapse. Similar to how the period from colonial to early US independence has a lot of continuity. Americans weren't commonly referring to themselves as Americans en masse until after the war of 1812, and even then many people often referred to themselves by regional affiliation OR by where their ancestors originated for quite some time, rather than as americans.

  2. #52
    Magus daemonic Sung Jin-Woo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    1w9 sp/so
    Socionics
    ILI Te
    Posts
    3,348

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post
    Might I suggest that the reason why I'm not accepting your statements as irrefutable truth is exactly because I'm using my own logic? Perhaps I am asking for data and factual examples because that would be one way of helping to either convince me or understand my own position better. Another thing that would work might be a detailed explanation showing the how and why of how a "real" slippery slope would operate, and why it's actually true even though it might get labeled as a fallacy.

    My general experience with people using arguments that qualify as slippery slope fallacies is that it's sloppy reasoning used to support an idea that doesn't make sense in the first place, but has some particular emotional appeal for the person holding. Usually, I'm better at spotting that when the idea does not have emotional appeal for me.

    The "gays destroy civilization like in Ancient Rome" is not an idea that has any particular emotional appeal for me, since I associate it with Dubya-era conservatism. Which is quite ironic because I thought Trumpism was supposed to "socially liberal" at least in the sense that it's pro-LGBT. Personally I suspect that "pro-LGBT" elements of Trumpism are things that only really come into play when fundamentalism Muslims are in the picture, which has a direct parallel with the relationship between feminism and Dubya-era neoconservatism.
    You don't have to accept anything I say as truth, as I am not trying to convince you of anything. My point is not everything can be explained well enough to understand. I will however, try to break down why I think many things are slippery slopes in reality. It is all because of human nature, and psychology. Humans, need something to strive for. It is what gives people purpose. Having a goal is what keeps people going. Humans enjoy the process more than they do the end result. Just like we hate finishing a very good videogame, or a very good book. We want it to go on forever. This is the same for living in society. We strive for immortality, we strive to perfect and improve our lives, and those lives around us. We constantly need something new to keep us feeling like we have a purpose. Once we reach a goal, we have to find another. Then, when there are no more struggles to overcome, we turn on ourselves. How to improve ourselves, how to improve society. How to help everyone. Each time we succeed, we look for another goal. This process, will repeat forever, because it is human nature. What happens when we run out of things to improve within our realm of influence? What happens when we are powerless to improve the lives of lesser off people? We attack the things that are insignificant that we do have some sort of power over, to convince ourselves we are making an impact. Eventually, it becomes lies and narcissism. Eventually, we attack the very thing that made our societies successful to begin with. We attack our foundation, like a cancer turning on the body, slowly degrading it from the inside out. It isn't so much as X leads to Y, or gays leads to the fall of society. Its about how we ourselves decay society once it runs out of things to overcome externally, once it runs out meaningful things to strive for. Once people have to make up things to fight for. So yes, all societies eventually fall due to change. Due to progressive thinking. Due to constantly needed change, and to fight for change. Due to human nature. Human nature, is the slippery slope, and it is often overlooked. Yet it explains almost everything that has happened currently in society, and in the past, and it will predict the future.
    Masculine republics, give way to feminine democracies. Feminine democracies, give way to tyranny.
    - Aristotle

  3. #53
    ha-ha-hoo Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/so
    Socionics
    LII None
    Posts
    11,775

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sung Jin-Woo View Post
    You don't have to accept anything I say as truth, as I am not trying to convince you of anything. My point is not everything can be explained well enough to understand. I will however, try to break down why I think many things are slippery slopes in reality. It is all because of human nature, and psychology. Humans, need something to strive for. It is what gives people purpose. Having a goal is what keeps people going. Humans enjoy the process more than they do the end result. Just like we hate finishing a very good videogame, or a very good book. We want it to go on forever. This is the same for living in society. We strive for immortality, we strive to perfect and improve our lives, and those lives around us. We constantly need something new to keep us feeling like we have a purpose. Once we reach a goal, we have to find another. Then, when there are no more struggles to overcome, we turn on ourselves. How to improve ourselves, how to improve society. How to help everyone. Each time we succeed, we look for another goal. This process, will repeat forever, because it is human nature. What happens when we run out of things to improve within our realm of influence? What happens when we are powerless to improve the lives of lesser off people? We attack the things that are insignificant that we do have some sort of power over, to convince ourselves we are making an impact. Eventually, it becomes lies and narcissism. Eventually, we attack the very thing that made our societies successful to begin with. We attack our foundation, like a cancer turning on the body, slowly degrading it from the inside out. It isn't so much as X leads to Y, or gays leads to the fall of society. Its about how we ourselves decay society once it runs out of things to overcome externally, once it runs out meaningful things to strive for. Once people have to make up things to fight for. So yes, all societies eventually fall due to change. Due to progressive thinking. Due to constantly needed change, and to fight for change. Due to human nature. Human nature, is the slippery slope, and it is often overlooked. Yet it explains almost everything that has happened currently in society, and in the past, and it will predict the future.
    This makes enough sense, except, it's not just progressives looking for things to overcome. Trying to revert things back to some myth that never existed is also a constant battle in its own way. It can never succeed at anything except making society less adaptable, which doesn't seem like a source of strength to me. But then, I think my adaptability has helped me to thrive as an individual, so I'm biased. I think if my entire worldview was about me wishing I lived in 1969, 1989, or 1999, I'd be nowhere. Instead, I position myself to understand where things are going and prepare for that. There's lots of different ways someone can do that.
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi



  4. #54
    Magus daemonic Sung Jin-Woo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    1w9 sp/so
    Socionics
    ILI Te
    Posts
    3,348

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post
    This makes enough sense, except, it's not just progressives looking for things to overcome. Trying to revert things back to some myth that never existed is also a constant battle in its own way. It can never succeed at anything except making society less adaptable, which doesn't seem like a source of strength to me. But then, I think my adaptability has helped me to thrive as an individual, so I'm biased. I think if my entire worldview was about me wishing I lived in 1969, 1989, or 1999, I'd be nowhere. Instead, I position myself to understand where things are going and prepare for that. There's lots of different ways someone can do that.
    Conservatism isn't about not adapting, its about resisting change and preventing the almost autoimmune response human nature has on society. Same goes with religion I think. No matter how non-sensical it can be, it is a psuedo "purpose giver" to many. It does help in many ways. I think individualism can also be harmful past a certain extent. One of the reason I identify as a conservative, is because I want to slow down the speed of decay. I don't want to see it in my lifetime. How can anyone live, when it feels like everything is going insane and suicidal? It becomes hard to find meaning, if at all. Its depressing to know my future will become darker with each passing decade.
    Masculine republics, give way to feminine democracies. Feminine democracies, give way to tyranny.
    - Aristotle

  5. #55
    Rhinocorn Norexan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Enneagram
    8w7 sp
    Socionics
    LIE Te
    Posts
    1,842

    Default

    Those who have a power must use power for evil.

    Why?

    Those with gun has a power to kill you but that doesn't mean all people with guns will kill you, even if you provoke them they won't. Same as aliens or any other being with more brain then humans. Aliens can obliterate Earth whenever they want but they don't want do this because such an action would be evil.

    If you are immoral scum on Earth I am not.
    True Neutral 8 1 6 3 7 5 Teexcellent>Niexcellent>Figood>Tigood>>>>Siaverage>Fe unused
    "I WIL NOT F%CK YOUR MIND. YOUR MIND IS ALREADY F%CKED. I WILL JUST PULL THE TRIGGER."
    ===Logical Crusader===

    Dail [or Daer] ú-[o] chyn [or fyn/thyn] [?] Ú-danno i failad a thi; an úben tannatha le failad.

  6. #56
    A Bittersweet Symphony... The Cat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    MBTI
    ESFP
    Enneagram
    478 sp/sx
    Posts
    15,508

    Default

    Bazinga
    With all due respect,
    The Cat.

    I am the Cat who walks by himself; and all places are alike to me...
    I let the melody shine, let it cleanse my mind, I feel free now.
    Who knows what goes on in the mind of a cat?


Similar Threads

  1. [NF] Commonalities/differences between ENFP and ENFJ
    By proteanmix in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 09-23-2015, 02:35 PM
  2. [NT] NTs: how do logical fallacies make you feel?
    By Society in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: 06-03-2013, 02:45 PM
  3. [INFJ] Is it common for INFJ's to come out of abusive/neglectful homes?
    By ReadingRainbows in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 51
    Last Post: 02-19-2009, 09:27 PM
  4. Alternative logic systems versus sociopathic traits.
    By Park in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 68
    Last Post: 09-22-2007, 04:56 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO