User Tag List

First 12

Results 11 to 20 of 20

  1. #11
    Power in the Shadows. Maou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    638 sp/sx
    Socionics
    ILE Ti
    Posts
    4,438

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hexylis View Post
    Nope. I value honesty, authenticity, and directness even in the face of consequences. I wouldn't even know how to manipulate people if I wanted to. Wouldn't have the conscience to follow through if I tried.
    What I was thinking when I posted this, is how I talk to someone when they are upset. Would you really tell someone crying, that they were the reason they were in that situation to begin with? Manipulation isn't all bad, sometimes being kind is manipulation. Half truths and white lies.

    And when someone is direct and honest, they also open themselves up to vulnerability to rejection, by the person they are being direct to. (Its why it's a widely unpopular approach) How you react to that directness, and honesty can forever change that person's behavior towards you. For example, if you immediately reject their observation, they will recoil with negative feelings. Even if you think their observation is shallow or incorrect. That person will be far more likely to not be direct.
    "A known evil is better than an unknown good."

  2. #12
    Senior Member Earl Grey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    3,861

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Maou View Post
    What I was thinking when I posted this, is how I talk to someone when they are upset. Would you really tell someone crying, that they were the reason they were in that situation to begin with? Manipulation isn't all bad, sometimes being kind is manipulation. Half truths and white lies.
    An interesting thing- people have called me tactful or even kind, which is much easier in real life when my body language gives away that I'm not being aggressive. Not so much online, so I'm surprised that it still comes across. There's something I call 'effective truth'- I'm not particularly good at reading emotions, but what I do is see if telling someone something will be productive at all. If not, I don't say it- it has the unintended but not unwelcome side effect of not hurting feelings. Not telling people things upfront is possible without manipulation- it is not at all manipulation, unless you capitalized on it for your own gain at the expense of the other person, which is manipulative and ultimately unkind.


    And when someone is direct and honest, they also open themselves up to vulnerability to rejection, by the person they are being direct to. (Its why it's a widely unpopular approach) How you react to that directness, and honesty can forever change that person's behavior towards you. For example, if you immediately reject their observation, they will recoil with negative feelings. Even if you think their observation is shallow or incorrect. That person will be far more likely to not be direct.
    This is an issue with me. I have adapted to telling people, mostly people I think prone to behaving that way, upfront that they can be direct. Sometimes it takes a few more tries than usual, but I've only had very few people that didn't work on (interestingly- those with abuse backgrounds, which is understandable).

    However, what you write is specific and narrow, and while a consequence of directness, isn't an inherent consequence of a direct personality. It is also a skill to 'reopen communication'- oftentimes people read a rejection as something that stops there- you can make sure that it doesn't. Continuing the conversation by communicating alternatives and why they are interested in the matter helps them know you aren't an asshole even if your speech style is very direct. I have had people continue being honest with me because they can count on being able to do so. Rejection isn't too bad- also comes without being manipulative, or unkind.
    風 の 神
    Do you really think your prayers will be answered?

  3. #13
    Vulnera Sanentur Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    24,953

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Earl Grey View Post
    An interesting thing- people have called me tactful or even kind, which is much easier in real life when my body language gives away that I'm not being aggressive. Not so much online, so I'm surprised that it still comes across. There's something I call 'effective truth'- I'm not particularly good at reading emotions, but what I do is see if telling someone something will be productive at all. If not, I don't say it- it has the unintended but not unwelcome side effect of not hurting feelings. Not telling people things upfront is possible without manipulation- it is not at all manipulation, unless you capitalized on it for your own gain at the expense of the other person, which is manipulative and ultimately unkind.

    This is an issue with me. I have adapted to telling people, mostly people I think prone to behaving that way, upfront that they can be direct. Sometimes it takes a few more tries than usual, but I've only had very few people that didn't work on (interestingly- those with abuse backgrounds, which is understandable).

    However, what you write is specific and narrow, and while a consequence of directness, isn't an inherent consequence of a direct personality. It is also a skill to 'reopen communication'- oftentimes people read a rejection as something that stops there- you can make sure that it doesn't. Continuing the conversation by communicating alternatives and why they are interested in the matter helps them know you aren't an asshole even if your speech style is very direct. I have had people continue being honest with me because they can count on being able to do so. Rejection isn't too bad- also comes without being manipulative, or unkind.
    What is the difference between directness and a direct personality? If what you are saying is that directness and manipulation are not the only options, I agree. It is possible to be direct and to navigate any negative repercussions as you describe - by continuing the discussion to explain your statements and demonstrate your concern. It is also possible to be direct AND kind/considerate, they are not mutually exclusive, though of course it is possible to be direct and harsh, even scathing. As a matter of fact, if someone feels the need to resort to manipulation rather than directness, at least in a situation where they really are not trying to engineer some specific outcome, other than just not offending the other person, then I would consider them to be lacking in confidence, or perhaps even interpersonally lazy.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  4. #14
    Senior Member Earl Grey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    3,861

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    What is the difference between directness and a direct personality? If what you are saying is that directness and manipulation are not the only options, I agree. It is possible to be direct and to navigate any negative repercussions as you describe - by continuing the discussion to explain your statements and demonstrate your concern. It is also possible to be direct AND kind/considerate, they are not mutually exclusive, though of course it is possible to be direct and harsh, even scathing. As a matter of fact, if someone feels the need to resort to manipulation rather than directness, at least in a situation where they really are not trying to engineer some specific outcome, other than just not offending the other person, then I would consider them to be lacking in confidence, or perhaps even interpersonally lazy.
    Directness as an approach, where an indirect person can sometimes be direct, and a person who is direct by default/nature. Both have different approaches when it comes to interaction, with the latter usually running into the kind of trouble Maou mentioned. I'm saying you can be a direct person and be kind and unmanipulative- just as you say, they are not mutually exclusive. And yes, that is what I was expressing.
    風 の 神
    Do you really think your prayers will be answered?

  5. #15
    ฅ^•ﻌ•^ฅ Hexylis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    MBTI
    XXXX
    Enneagram
    XXX
    Posts
    3,883

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Maou View Post
    What I was thinking when I posted this, is how I talk to someone when they are upset. Would you really tell someone crying, that they were the reason they were in that situation to begin with? Manipulation isn't all bad, sometimes being kind is manipulation. Half truths and white lies.

    And when someone is direct and honest, they also open themselves up to vulnerability to rejection, by the person they are being direct to. (Its why it's a widely unpopular approach) How you react to that directness, and honesty can forever change that person's behavior towards you. For example, if you immediately reject their observation, they will recoil with negative feelings. Even if you think their observation is shallow or incorrect. That person will be far more likely to not be direct.
    How to talk to someone when they're upset isn't manipulation, it's tact...and sometimes more than that, such as just lying to make someone feel better. To manipulate is to control or influence (a person or situation) cleverly, unfairly, or unscrupulously.

    I would not directly say "it's your fault" but no, I would also not lie to them as an alternative. I believe doing so robs someone of the opportunity to learn from it so that they will not repeat it and have to go through it again; thus, it is ultimately not the kind approach. In any case, no, I don't do half truths and white lies. It's very rare that I will lie, and in 99% of cases it's a matter of survival for me and it always eats at me afterwards.

    I'm not sure what being open and honest has to do with it but quite honestly I don't see the logic in being accepted for not being yourself (it isn't even you they are accepting). That's really not the discussion though. To get back to the discussion...ultimately, there are alternative approaches. It is less "one or the other" than suggested here.
    ⸸ภ๏ ร๏ɭคςє⸸
    Likes Maou liked this post

  6. #16
    ฅ^•ﻌ•^ฅ Hexylis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    MBTI
    XXXX
    Enneagram
    XXX
    Posts
    3,883

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Maou
    And when someone is direct and honest, they also open themselves up to vulnerability to rejection, by the person they are being direct to. (Its why it's a widely unpopular approach) How you react to that directness, and honesty can forever change that person's behavior towards you. For example, if you immediately reject their observation, they will recoil with negative feelings. Even if you think their observation is shallow or incorrect. That person will be far more likely to not be direct.
    Still wanted to reply, but figured I'd do it in a separate post since it's somewhat off-topic. I will just say no one is perfect and if someone reacts this way after feeling their observation was shut down one time......well, I'll just say it would be on the person who recoiled to say they were bothered by it (instead of recoiling) in order for the two of them to talk it out. Communication is key in relationship building. People are going to do shit that hurts others unintentionally, and if they change forever and can't talk about it instead of recoiling, well...that person is probably quite isolated internally because that's how you resolve matters. A therapist will tell you that honest and open communication is essential in relationship building. A lot of people are afraid to do this though because it makes them feel vulnerable. At the end of the day though, people aren't mind readers and people aren't perfect.

    There's also sometimes a good reason for something to be shut down. I'll use a different instance as an example. Say a student suggests an answer to a teacher teaching a class, but the teacher immediately says "no, that's not correct." Should the student be bothered that their answer was rejected? Does the teacher not already know the answer? People do get offended in similar (but less obvious) situations though. They believe their answers are true, thus when they're automatically told they're not, they're offended...but the person telling them they're not sometimes is able to see a lot more of what's being assessed than the person who made the observation has access to. It's just as important to try to understand why the observation would not be correct.
    ⸸ภ๏ ร๏ɭคςє⸸
    Likes Maou liked this post

  7. #17
    ฅ^•ﻌ•^ฅ Hexylis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    MBTI
    XXXX
    Enneagram
    XXX
    Posts
    3,883

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Maou View Post
    And when someone is direct and honest, they also open themselves up to vulnerability to rejection, by the person they are being direct to.
    I also just wanted to point out...that people can be vulnerable to rejection either way, even because of this very act. For instance, authenticity is something I value highly and I find it difficult to respect those who aren't and I tend to see it as weak when people orbit more around image-oriented pride/insecurity rather than being true to themselves. Thus, the very thing they are trying to achieve through their actions is the very thing their actions cause them not to achieve with me. People are going to reject you one way or another. Can't please or earn the approval of everyone. But this action is kind of like...sacrificing who you are not even for approval necessarily, but for a certain response...and one that isn't even guaranteed. I've noticed I tend to dislike people who are like this. Even if I don't agree with what the direct person says, I still at least respect and appreciate their honesty and directness. I also respect their individuality and entitlement to be different or have a different perspective.
    ⸸ภ๏ ร๏ɭคςє⸸
    Likes Maou liked this post

  8. #18
    Inactive For A Bit RadicalDoubt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    639 sp/so
    Socionics
    LII Ti
    Posts
    1,057

    Default


    Not Sociopathic
    Your answers suggest you are not sociopathic. In clinical contexts, cases such as yours should be investigated, but most likely would not meet the criteria for the diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder.

    “My deplorable mania for analysis exhausts me. I doubt everything, even my doubt.” Gustave Flaubert
    | 6w5 3w4 9w1 sp/so |

  9. #19
    Kawaii Jazzy Orchid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    172 sx/so
    Posts
    3,299

    Default

    Not Sociopathic
    Your answers suggest you are not sociopathic. In clinical contexts, cases such as yours should be investigated, but most likely would not meet the criteria for the diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder.
    However, please note that tests such as this one cannot replace the judgment of an actual healthcare worker. If you feel that these results are inaccurate, you should schedule an appointment with a doctor or a mental health professional now.

  10. #20
    Member Cupcakemonster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    MBTI
    ESTP
    Enneagram
    728 so/sx
    Posts
    71

    Default



    Moderate Indication of Sociopathy
    In my defense I was left unsupervised
    My level of sarcasm is based on your level of stupidity
    ESTP
    Se > Ne > Ti > Fe > Ni > Te > Fi > Si
    7w8 2w3 8w9 so/sx (The Free Spirit)
    SCUAN primary social (Big 5)
    Sanguine
    Chaotic good
    Slytherin
    Taurus sun | Leo moon | Libra rising | Gemini mercury

Similar Threads

  1. ActualMe test
    By wyrdsister in forum Online Personality Tests
    Replies: 172
    Last Post: 08-01-2015, 12:27 PM
  2. Philosophical personality test
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Online Personality Tests
    Replies: 323
    Last Post: 09-03-2013, 10:06 PM
  3. Eliminating negative beliefs in few minutes, "test"
    By Chloe in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 11-13-2011, 04:36 PM
  4. Eliminating negative beliefs in few minutes, "test"
    By Chloe in forum Online Personality Tests
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-12-2011, 10:44 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO