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  1. #61
    awwwwwwwk Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtual ghost View Post

    Even in USA there are troubles with water reservoirs lately








    Etc.
    Heh, you should check out Cadilliac Desert. It doesn't really address global warming, but it does talk a great deal about water in the American west. The most interesting parts, I think, are the sections discussing the Colorado river as well as the L.A. aqueduct.

    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    I'm sure the current administration and ruling party is simply hoping they die before they get here. Or mowing them down at the border, which has also been suggested. Unless they are coming from Norway or some other white people country. All of this has actually been said so anyone who has an issue with it, take it up with Trump.

    In the end, doing something requires mass organizing on a global level. We live in Fortress America now, this is never going to happen. My suggestion is to start donating money to and voting for every candidate that also puts this problem front and center., that grasp the global size of the problem and are willing to move away from a solely capitalist economy to make it happen.
    I think global warming is inevitable at this point, unfortunately. Too many politicians on both sides of the aisle have just dragged their feet with the issue (Actually, I'm probably the most angry at the 2008 Democrats about this...you can't criticize Republicans for inaction, and then when you get a chance to do something, do absolutely nothing because you think it will hurt your chances at reelection). I suppose the issue becomes how we all deal with it.
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi



  2. #62
    awwwwwwwk Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    I'm sure the current administration and ruling party is simply hoping they die before they get here. Or mowing them down at the border, which has also been suggested. Unless they are coming from Norway or some other white people country. All of this has actually been said so anyone who has an issue with it, take it up with Trump.

    In the end, doing something requires mass organizing on a global level. We live in Fortress America now, this is never going to happen. My suggestion is to start donating money to and voting for every candidate that also puts this problem front and center., that grasp the global size of the problem and are willing to move away from a solely capitalist economy to make it happen.
    I think global warming is inevitable at this point, unfortunately. Too many politicians on both sides of the aisle have just dragged their feet with the issue (Actually, I'm probably the most angry at the 2008 Democrats about this...you can't criticize Republicans for inaction, and then when you get a chance to do something, do absolutely nothing because you think it will hurt your chances at reelection). I suppose the issue becomes how we all deal with it.

    Basically, the difference between the two parties has been this:

    Republicans: Human-made climate change is a myth.

    Democrats: Climate change is real, but we can't do anything about it because it might hurt the economy and we want to get re-elected.

    Very Hobson's choice.
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi



  3. #63
    Senior Member asynartetic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post
    I think global warming is inevitable at this point, unfortunately. Too many politicians on both sides of the aisle have just dragged their feet with the issue (Actually, I'm probably the most angry at the 2008 Democrats about this...you can't criticize Republicans for inaction, and then when you get a chance to do something, do absolutely nothing because you think it will hurt your chances at reelection). I suppose the issue becomes how we all deal with it.

    Basically, the difference between the two parties has been this:

    Republicans: Human-made climate change is a myth.

    Democrats: Climate change is real, but we can't do anything about it because it might hurt the economy and we want to get re-elected.

    Very Hobson's choice.
    To be fair, Obama tried to do a lot to address it during his two terms. Republicans (most of them, anyway) tried to block him every step of the way.
    “Some people underestimate how erotic it is to be understood.” -Mary Rakow
    “In all chaos there is a cosmos, in all disorder a secret order.” -CG Jung
    “I have made a ceaseless effort not to ridicule, not to bewail, not to scorn human actions, but to understand them.” -Baruch Spinoza

  4. #64
    awwwwwwwk Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by asynartetic View Post
    To be fair, Obama tried to do a lot to address it during his two terms. Republicans (most of them, anyway) tried to block him every step of the way.
    I thought he didn't have enough Democratic votes because of the reason I just stated?
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi



  5. #65
    Senior Member asynartetic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post
    I thought he didn't have enough Democratic votes because of the reason I just stated?
    That's true. But as the party leader, at least he tried to get his party to do more. Many did try to work with him on this and lost elections in 2010 and 2012 as a result of trying to do something.
    “Some people underestimate how erotic it is to be understood.” -Mary Rakow
    “In all chaos there is a cosmos, in all disorder a secret order.” -CG Jung
    “I have made a ceaseless effort not to ridicule, not to bewail, not to scorn human actions, but to understand them.” -Baruch Spinoza

  6. #66
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post
    I think global warming is inevitable at this point, unfortunately. Too many politicians on both sides of the aisle have just dragged their feet with the issue (Actually, I'm probably the most angry at the 2008 Democrats about this...you can't criticize Republicans for inaction, and then when you get a chance to do something, do absolutely nothing because you think it will hurt your chances at reelection). I suppose the issue becomes how we all deal with it.

    Basically, the difference between the two parties has been this:

    Republicans: Human-made climate change is a myth.

    Democrats: Climate change is real, but we can't do anything about it because it might hurt the economy and we want to get re-elected.

    Very Hobson's choice.
    I don't criticize Republicans only because I know the only difference between them and Democrats on the issue of climate and fossil fuel industry is offer to suck dick for contributions just a bit faster than Dems. But that's all in the past, I was just addressing what to do going forward.

    Understanding that denialism is front and center to places like the Marshall Institute, The State Policy Network, FreedomWorks, Americans For Prosperity, all conservative, libertarian and right wing is important but in the end - there is nothing anyone can do about it so why do anything - is the only thing they offer. That's also the party line of the GOP as they get money in the billions from these groups plus the Kochs, Cato and Heritage. If nothing else convinces a person that environmental disruption is real - just look how hard these groups work to deny it.

    Sure Obama tried to do a great deal to address this. He failed because he continued to think that he could work with Republican leadership. It didn't work then and won't work now. Both parties are ideologically cohesive, there is no "across the isle". Until more, I guess liberal, people grasp this and stop hoping for it, we go nowhere on any issue.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  7. #67
    awwwwwwwk Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    I don't criticize Republicans only because I know the only difference between them and Democrats on the issue of climate and fossil fuel industry is offer to suck dick for contributions just a bit faster than Dems. But that's all in the past, I was just addressing what to do going forward.

    Understanding that denialism is front and center to places like the Marshall Institute, The State Policy Network, FreedomWorks, Americans For Prosperity, all conservative, libertarian and right wing is important but in the end - there is nothing anyone can do about it so why do anything - is the only thing they offer. That's also the party line of the GOP as they get money in the billions from these groups plus the Kochs, Cato and Heritage. If nothing else convinces a person that environmental disruption is real - just look how hard these groups work to deny it.

    Sure Obama tried to do a great deal to address this. He failed because he continued to think that he could work with Republican leadership. It didn't work then and won't work now. Both parties are ideologically cohesive, there is no "across the isle". Until more, I guess liberal, people grasp this and stop hoping for it, we go nowhere on any issue.
    I mean, I suppose I sound a little black pill about all of this, but that's not really my view. I just can't see politics changing quickly enough to prevent this (of course, of been wrong before about what people are ready for...... I was entirely wrong about the path of the 2016 primaries, for instance) . Not when people still act like folks like Joe Biden are viable options.
    A path is made by walking on it.

    -Zhuangzi



  8. #68
    Digital ambition Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julius_Van_Der_Beak View Post

    I think global warming is inevitable at this point, unfortunately. Too many politicians on both sides of the aisle have just dragged their feet with the issue (Actually, I'm probably the most angry at the 2008 Democrats about this...you can't criticize Republicans for inaction, and then when you get a chance to do something, do absolutely nothing because you think it will hurt your chances at reelection). I suppose the issue becomes how we all deal with it.

    I prefer Climate change since the temperature isn't the only problem in the mix.


    I mean this is the picture that shows how Arctic cap looks right now and you really don't have to be a genius to realize that this is just too little ice, even for this time of the year.




    Plus here is the map that shows current sea temperature when compared to average.



    However even if we stop burning the fossil fuels what we already put out should melt the remains completely in the foreseeable future. Not to mention that various feedbacks are also starting to openly kick in. Therefore once the Arctic is ice free during summer time we will actually start to see real rises in temperatures and Greenland will seriously start to melt. So sea level will start to rise at more observable rate.


    Therefore the idea that we can dodge this mess completely is done. The only thing we can really do now is take time and effort to prepare the world for what is coming and keep global emission at least somewhat under control, so that we don't hit too hard into all this. However expecting even that may be too much to hope for when it comes to modern politics.
    Likes cascadeco liked this post

  9. #69
    Digital ambition Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virtual ghost View Post
    I prefer Climate change since the temperature isn't the only problem in the mix.

    Therefore the idea that we can dodge this mess completely is done. The only thing we can really do now is take time and effort to prepare the world for what is coming and keep global emission at least somewhat under control, so that we don't hit too hard into all this. However expecting even that may be too much to hope for when it comes to modern politics.
    Or if you want it in concrete:


    1. All global agriculture must be properly watered and protected from weather extremes as much as possible. Since otherwise we will surely have many regional conflicts for resources and endless refugees.

    2. Stock market needs to be educated that there will be "earthquakes" and that they shouldn't panic over everything.

    3. There have to very active plans to plant more trees, since they help regulate the climate and they are natural counter to fast desertification, since they hold large quantities of water in them.

    4. There needs to be more investments into building more water accumulations, since the water wouldn't be so "certain" resource anymore.

    5. Everything that can be recycled should be, since that saves energy and doesn't pollute so much the drinkable water that will be getting scarce through most of the world.

    6. There have to be active attempts to make sure we don't have more than 2 children per mother. Especially in naturally dry areas.

    7. More regional economy, transporting stuff around the world is heavy pollutant and everything that can be produced more locally should be. Plus even if some parts fall into chaos this way this woudln't hit everyone openly. Especially since mass transport in bad weather will be more of a challenge, what if surely kick in as a factor when the sea starts to claim coastal infrastructure more often.

    8. Less meat consumption.

    9. Forbidding the building of buildings in low areas next to the sea and large flooding rivers.

    10. Upgrade power grid and invest into newer technologies and research regarding the electricity.


    This will be a struggle for sure but with this you can ease the problem and make sure that things stay at least somewhat functional. Because if chaos kicks in it is game over.

  10. #70
    Lord Grumpus Tellenbach's Avatar
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    The one solution that really would have made a dent in global CO2 levels is nuclear power and we all know where the 2 parties stand on that.

    I'm sorry, but some of the solutions offered up (like banning fossil fuels or banning cows) are just stupid.
    I wanted to be an ancient astronaut theorist growing up so I could have someone narrate my stupid ideas on national tv.

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