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What type is House?

What type is House?

  • INTP

    Votes: 72 18.0%
  • INTJ

    Votes: 120 30.0%
  • INFP

    Votes: 2 0.5%
  • INFJ

    Votes: 2 0.5%
  • ISTP

    Votes: 4 1.0%
  • ISTJ

    Votes: 4 1.0%
  • ISFP

    Votes: 2 0.5%
  • ISFJ

    Votes: 4 1.0%
  • ESFJ

    Votes: 6 1.5%
  • ESFP

    Votes: 5 1.3%
  • ESTJ

    Votes: 3 0.8%
  • ESTP

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • ENFJ

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • ENFP

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • ENTJ

    Votes: 25 6.3%
  • ENTP

    Votes: 148 37.0%

  • Total voters
    400

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
INTJ:
Do whatever works.

ENTP:
Try whatever.

Anyway, I work with formally tested ENTPs and INTJs (closely with the ENTPs - at a distance from INTJs). The most sarcastic, bitter and unapproachable ENTP is on par with the nicest INTJ I know... and house share nothing with the ENTPs I know - friends or co workers. I can understand, if disagree, with the E vs I bit (ENTJ vs INTJ) because of his screwed up life... but the ENTP thing makes no sense.

Can you identify where the mislogic is? Or are you going based on commonality? If that's the case, then you're stretching what type theory is/does.
 

ptgatsby

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 24, 2007
Messages
4,476
MBTI Type
ISTP
Can you identify where the mislogic is? Or are you going based on commonality? If that's the case, then you're stretching what type theory is/does.

You are also observing his behaviour and assigning it to a type. The filter between observation and interpretation is what is being disputed. Commonality is all we have (be it with what is expressed and assumed to be part of the functions, or via the test, or trait measurements... which in theory should all be the same.)
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
You are also observing his behaviour and assigning it to a type.
You are incorrect. I'm observing behavior, assigning it to a cognitive function, and then going from there to decide type (since that's what type is determined by).
The filter between observation and interpretation is what is being disputed.
I realize that, but I think that if those who were questioning really knew what to look for in terms of the functions then there would be far less question.
Commonality is all we have (be it with what is expressed and assumed to be part of the functions, or via the test, or trait measurements... which in theory should all be the same.)
In theory yes, however it's so difficult to create a test that collects accurate information since there are such things as 'self serving bias' which says that people will ascribe traits to their own persona if they view them as positive. That's why there's necessity to learn what nuances to search for when differentiating functions and attitudes of those functions.

--------------------

My belief is that you and anyone else who says INTJ are going based not on the functions, but your experience with ENTPs/INTJs.

It's not enough to LOOK like an INTJ. You have to use Ni and Te, and House does not. At least not avidly.

That's what type theory is. Not common threads of behavior observed across a large percentage of a particular type. There are differences, among those of the same type persuasion. That's because the functions can yield very different behavior. They driving force behind them is the same though.

By employment of the same dogma you use, I could easily say "The INTJ thing doesn't make any sense" and it would carry just as much weight as your comment. I'm asking for specific points of mislogic.
 

fiona

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
22
MBTI Type
INTJ
Before I put my point of view here, I should admit a few things:

I am a doctor.

Colleagues often comment on how I startle them by 1. remembering unusual patterns and case studies in medicine 2. coming up with plausible diagnoses that they hadn't considered, because they look for horses but I'm aware that just occasionally the guy down the road decided to import a zebra.

I'm an INTJ, so naturally I'm going to argue for my own type.



House is an INTJ who has been partially socialised by his training.

Most of you are tending to the 'INTJs don't need anyone' argument, forgetting that actually INTJs do, they just have 10ft thick walls around them which makes it look as though they don't.

To become a consultant in a major western hospital you have to teach, so much so that those of us who would generally avoid that sort of interaction become first desensitised to it, and then (sometimes) start to require it. It is also one of the few rewards for the logical mind - an audience of almost-peers agreeing that your deductions were correct. INTJs like to be recognised as right by those who have a similar knowledge base. In House's case another doctor at his level would work in another specialty, ie not have the same area of expertise, and so any recognition from them would be of no value. His juniors are heading towards his knowledge base, so he does get something from them as an audience. He has consequently acquired a set of behaviours associated with coming up with a diagnosis which actually involves a significant degree of performance to an audience. He will therefore start to perform to those who are not his peers, because he's actually well inside his own head, and by now the audience can be anybody.

His friendship with Wilson is classic, too. Wilson, though often temporarily hurt by things House says, has the ability to look past them to the underlying human being. He knows House likes him; he knows House would bite his tongue out rather than say the words. House's behaviour in concealing the answering machine message and making Wilson stay on in his flat is typical INTJ 'I'll do what I think is best for you no matter what you may feel about it' behaviour. Where their friendship staggers is when House's need to do what he knows is right clashes with his loyalty to Wilson. Right wins out; Wilson knows it always will, and this is the one permanent crack in an otherwise solid friendship. This is the point on which Wilson has to give if their friendship is to survive. On the other hand, there is enough trust on House's part for him to let Wilson see that he can and does empathise with the distress he's caused. Though perhaps most sensors might find that too subtle and insist that 'he doesn't care' when in fact he cares too much - these are the situations where INTJs become so distressed that they can withdraw completely and become quite dissociated from reality.

House follows his own book - it's a deeply logical thought process, trying to match symptoms and signs to an underlying pathology. It's Holmes, as always - 'whatever you're left with, however implausible, must be the truth.' He doesn't use other people's books/thought pathways/logic, because these have clearly failed. He may be using what look like intuitive leaps (I was once told that my thinking was so lateral I'd lateraled myself out of the window) but in fact it's simply a mix of logic and statistics (also known as experience), combined with deep expertise and a willingness to look for things that are very unusual.

INTJs also indulge in solitary sensory experiences, be it standing in a shower for hours or riding at speed on a motorbike. It's the rare time in which they let their thought processes idle and give free rein to the feelings of the moment.

He also left a woman because she did something she'd promised not to. He knows she did the right thing, but she broke a promise. He can't trust her any more.

INTJ.
 

INTJMom

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2007
Messages
5,413
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w4
Aw, I wanted to see if she could guess. Anyway, yeah, I'm ENTP.
Thank you. (I thought you were being INTJish)

I'm still learning here!
These wrong type IDs give me the wrong impression or make me think what I already believe is wrong.
It gets me all confuzzled!:shock:
 

fiona

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
22
MBTI Type
INTJ
Oops - the poker group.

I gave that one some thought and then forgot to mention it. I do meet (and talk to) strangers in odd situations. I think it's because people can be quite fascinated by INTJs - we have a lot of good traits: Clever (in specific areas), often busy with lots of things, always interested to talk to someone who knows a lot about an area we are not expert in, we don't offload huge amounts of personal information on people we barely know. Usually someone else has to start the conversation, but if they're intelligent, quick on the uptake etc and I see them regularly in a non-threatening social situation, I might agree to meeting in another social arena with firm boundaries. I'm not a poker player, but if I were then that would be ideal - a situation with rules and a fixed end point. And I'd have it in my house so that I was in control - I'd feel uncomfortable in someone else's house.

Still INTJ.
 

Magic Poriferan

^He pronks, too!
Joined
Nov 4, 2007
Messages
14,081
MBTI Type
Yin
Enneagram
One
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
My belief is that you and anyone else who says INTJ are going based not on the functions, but your experience with ENTPs/INTJs.

It's not enough to LOOK like an INTJ. You have to use Ni and Te, and House does not. At least not avidly.

No. The most prominent INTJ in my life is my older brother, and he doesn't act like House in a lot of ways.
I will admit that there are mechanics to the MBTI that I dislike and don't even particularly believe.
That could make a very big difference in our opinions.

Thank you. (I thought you were being INTJish)
I'm still learning here!
These wrong type IDs give me the wrong impression or make me think what I already believe is wrong.
It gets me all confuzzled!:shock:

So far, I haven't been thrown for a loop by anyone's disguise.
It's because they always pick something three or four letters off, and that's just way too easy.
I seem to be always capable of guessing a person's type within a one letter margin of error.
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
Thank you. (I thought you were being INTJish)

I'm still learning here!
These wrong type IDs give me the wrong impression or make me think what I already believe is wrong.
It gets me all confuzzled!:shock:
So it's hindering analysis? Eh... probably shouldn't be learning to type people through forums, but if it works, why not?


Your little drawing violated my delicate sensibilities,
but then I had to laugh (the INTJ in me laughed). :blush:

You did draw that?
No I just happened across it on the internet and hot linked it. Ha, no, I'm not quite so clever as to have come up with it, but I was certainly able to see a connection, and what great timing. It was an exaggerated analogy.


No. The most prominent INTJ in my life is my older brother, and he doesn't act like House in a lot of ways.
I will admit that there are mechanics to the MBTI that I dislike and don't even particularly believe.
That could make a very big difference in our opinions.
What parts?
 

Magic Poriferan

^He pronks, too!
Joined
Nov 4, 2007
Messages
14,081
MBTI Type
Yin
Enneagram
One
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
The first thing that comes to mind is the fact that the meaning of J and P are reversed for Introverts.
What the hell is that for?
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
The first thing that comes to mind is the fact that the meaning of J and P are reversed for Introverts.
What the hell is that for?

J and P doesn't change, it tells what function is extraverted. Js have Te, or Fe, in their first two functions. Ps have Ne or Se, in there.

It's not which one comes first. I think you're thinking like scionics (which has a more logical layout IMO, but fails in other places). Socionics uses J and P to figure out which comes first, and then the name of the function is decided by T/F or N/S respectively and the attitude determined by I or E.

I say, forget MBTI, and look at the cognitive functions. It's basically agreed that House uses intuition as his first function and thinking as his second. Either Ni Te (INTJ) or Ne Ti (ENTP). The attitudes of these functions really are present if you watch the show carefully (with the functions in mind).

See, everyone sees that house is a mean bat who doesn't like people and immediately hug the introvert tree, ignoring that I and E is irrelevant to liking or disliking people. At the same time though, the presence of intuition looms over his personality like an enormously thick raincloud, often storming on the ground (equated to the cases in my analogy) which combined with the cursory assessment leading to introvert brings us to INTJ.

ENTP is the better fit, as I see it, because while he doesn't necessarily enjoy the socializing aspect, he really is fed by people or objects' presence. He draws energy from working with/beside them, where the INTJ does not. INTJ may be able to work with people and objects, but his preference, being introverted is to seclude into the subjective intuition.

Notice that all of House's 'aha!' moments are while he's with other people. This is what's known as extraverted intuition, which will dip into Ti (his analysis of the case) and graft concepts to it, using the energy and ideas generated by and while around people.

Anything that house figures out on his own isn't as profound as the amazing realizations that an INTJ will figure out. He uses deductive reasoning (the definition of which is almost identical to that of Ti) while on his own. You'll see him looking at the white board quite often trying to deduce more and more until he's found a set of rules (all diseases follow rules -- the observable effect this is manifest in symptoms) so he can use those rules to find a more applicable solution.
 
Last edited:

INTJMom

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2007
Messages
5,413
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w4
So it's hindering analysis? Eh... probably shouldn't be learning to type people through forums, but if it works, why not?
...
Well it's just one way to see types in "action" and to sort of "verify" if I really know my stuff.. I am an INTJ after all. I don't have a lot of interaction with real people.

Like the other person who mentioned something, I haven't been deceived either, but my first reaction is to assume I'm wrong and the type someone put down is right.
Some people get irritated if you question their type.
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
Well it's just one way to see types in "action" and to sort of "verify" if I really know my stuff.. I am an INTJ after all. I don't have a lot of interaction with real people.

Like the other person who mentioned something, I haven't been deceived either, but my first reaction is to assume I'm wrong and the type someone put down is right.
Yeah I understand.
Some people get irritated if you question their type.

Those people are either unsure of their type, but want to be sure, or they wish to be a certain type, and don't want their bubble in which personal desire is king to be ruptured. One way or another, it's probably safe to say on these forums that it's a bad habit to be in to question people's type... unless you like conflict, in which case trudge on.
 

INTJMom

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2007
Messages
5,413
MBTI Type
INTJ
Enneagram
5w4
Yeah I understand.


Those people are either unsure of their type, but want to be sure, or they wish to be a certain type, and don't want their bubble in which personal desire is king to be ruptured. One way or another, it's probably safe to say on these forums that it's a bad habit to be in to question people's type... unless you like conflict, in which case trudge on.
I didn't know Ps could be so "black & white" about things.
You seem to be highly opinionated and definite in your judgments.
This is normal for ENTPs?
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
I didn't know Ps could be so "black & white" about things.
You seem to be highly opinionated and definite in your judgments.
This is normal for ENTPs?

This is why I hate judging people by single dichotomies. It is the opinion of Ti, that there is only one way of viewing things. Especially seen in NTPs, the users of Ti, will continually combine systems to find THE logical truth.

Ti also is very willing to re-examine its conclusions, but in my case, I confess, I have a hard time allowing anyone else to make me do it.

But yes, it is common and likely for TPs to be stubborn - you're basically just saying I'm stubborn.
 

MacGuffin

Permabanned
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
10,710
MBTI Type
xkcd
Enneagram
9w1
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
ENTP is the better fit, as I see it, because while he doesn't necessarily enjoy the socializing aspect, he really is fed by people or objects' presence. He draws energy from working with/beside them, where the INTJ does not. INTJ may be able to work with people and objects, but his preference, being introverted is to seclude into the subjective intuition.

Notice that all of House's 'aha!' moments are while he's with other people. This is what's known as {extra}verted intuition, which will dip into Ti (his analysis of the case) and graft concepts to it, using the energy and ideas generated by and while around people.

Anything that house figures out on his own isn't as profound as the amazing realizations that an INTJ will figure out. He uses deductive reasoning (the definition of which is almost identical to that of Ti) while on his own. You'll see him looking at the white board quite often trying to deduce more and more until he's found a set of rules (all diseases follow rules -- the observable effect this is manifest in symptoms) so he can use those rules to find a more applicable solution.
Beautiful, couldn't have said it better myself. Esp. the part about being with other people (fixed the bolded part).

Still waiting for an INTJ supporter to do this kind of analysis. fiona got fairly close, but leaned too heavily on her own experience.
 

Nocapszy

no clinkz 'til brooklyn
Joined
Jun 29, 2007
Messages
4,517
MBTI Type
ENTP
Beautiful, couldn't have said it better myself. Esp. the part about being with other people (fixed the bolded part).

Still waiting for an INTJ supporter to do this kind of analysis. fiona got fairly close, but leaned too heavily on her own experience.

Nice save. That would have really thrown a lot of my analysis off.
 
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