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  1. #1
    abcdenfp Abcdenfp's Avatar
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    Default Thor - end game - SPOILERS included

    Last night I watched Avengers End game. I loved it, there were alot of stereotypical scenes like the "girl power" moment that for the most part I agree with the general feedback that it felt contrived, however i will take it because i believe women need to see women supporting other women in any fashion/context (as a generation we tend to learn things through cinematography ie through Disney we saw a damsel in distressed for long enough and believed in this prince charming shit.. so if this is how we get out of this mode of thinking I will take it)

    I have seen a lot of backlash on Thors weight game, and there are so many comments about it being a fat joke that went on for too long etc.

    I LOVE what Chris Hemsworth was trying to accomplish, we were able to watch a 'god' become mortal/flawed/imperfect and a basic mess in the most unbalanced, comical way. He was endearing to me simply because he KNEW he was a mess but he COULDNT "snap out of it/Magic out of it" or even get out of his own way and he wasn't managing any situation well at all. He really was in an emotional crisis but his friends didn't give up on him and he didn't give up on himself and he came out the other end realizing he had to find himself , not as people see him but as he IS.

    Sometimes we are all a mess and its ugly and unattractive to see, and maybe at the core of it that's what really bothered people. But I fucking loved it, I love seeing all of the parts not just the pretty bits.

    I truly think that is really what's is at the heart of the matter for most people in this "looks matter most" society, they don't want to see the unattractive bits (and everyone's interpretation on what is ugly is subjective) THAT is what offended them.

    I also understand the people who battle with negative reactions to weight again etc feeling offended by this interpretation. I get it , but in his own way he took a stab at this stereotype as well, you can love me as Thor sexy/ perfect body Thor but not as SAME Thor but overweight... makes no sense.


    Chris Hemsworth gets it in the FACE for being so sexy awesome human in this movie.


    That is all.
    blow a kiss to the universe and it is certain to wink at you in return.

  2. #2
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    I don't have a problem at all with the concept, I just found it really boring and/or tedious in how it was handled and the dialogue around it all.

    IOW, I have more of a problem with implementation, not concept.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft
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  3. #3
    abcdenfp Abcdenfp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totenkindly View Post
    I don't have a problem at all with the concept, I just found it really boring and/or tedious in how it was handled and the dialogue around it all.

    IOW, I have more of a problem with implementation, not concept.
    And I totally understand that, I think they had a lot of ground to cover with a lot of BIG characters and for the first time I felt that instead of bungling it up and rushing it and making a cliché of stereotypes (and there were some moments where they STILL did this) they managed to put together a tight story with some elements that people had to go back and think about. and I just would love if people looked under the surface of why Fat Thor made them so uncomfortable (not meaning you, meaning general public)


    I know why the community of self love that fights so hard for people to look at severely overweight people as actual PEOPLE are upset but I think they need to also look at the fact that we are even now able to have that conversation its a movement towards dialogue and I think that's important.
    blow a kiss to the universe and it is certain to wink at you in return.

  4. #4
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abcdenfp View Post
    And I totally understand that, I think they had a lot of ground to cover with a lot of BIG characters and for the first time I felt that instead of bungling it up and rushing it and making a cliché of stereotypes (and there were some moments where they STILL did this) they managed to put together a tight story with some elements that people had to go back and think about. and I just would love if people looked under the surface of why Fat Thor made them so uncomfortable (not meaning you, meaning general public)


    I know why the community of self love that fights so hard for people to look at severely overweight people as actual PEOPLE are upset but I think they need to also look at the fact that we are even now able to have that conversation its a movement towards dialogue and I think that's important.
    Yeah, I mean the experience is common enough. I struggle with my weight regularly, it's just very easy for me to gain weight and it can become a negative cycle. I had more time to think about Thor after the film and I think he was SO angry, had been through so much shit before that point, and then to feel like he screwed up and now couldn't fix it -- on SUCH a large scale -- his own people, and then half the universe... well, either he might kill himself, or he'd totally just abdicate responsibility for anything. And it resulted in him just not caring about anything and just losing himself in escapism, food, drink, whatever. It's actually something that happens, depending on someone's personality...

    (I've been watching "This is Us" for example, and Kevin's interesting because he's afraid of pain... or it's SO painful for him that he has to not think about painful experiences and/or avoid them because it messes him up. I get how he works, but I'm not like that -- I thrive off painful experience myself, I think, it teaches me and refines me, and part of me likes pain. So we're all different. But I know for me, when I'm tired or bored, I eat... I need the stimulation. But it's not good for my weight.)

    Anyway... I think it might have been a shock just because no one pictures Thor as fat. And they were going to this movie to see buff Thor in action. Instead they had emotionally vulnerable Thor who was really struggling. So it's not what they expected. But there could be other things going on in the audience as well, people sometimes have visceral responses to overweight folks.

    Here's an interesting thing and I don't remember the early Thor movies well -- but one of the Warriors Three at least in the comic was severely overweight. (Valstaag? I don't remember.) Not sure if he was in the films. If not, why not? But some people who are overweight are actually pretty psychologically healthy and are at home in their body. Valstaag or whoever it was always seemed happy with himself. Thor, I think, is currently not that happy -- it's more of a sign of him being off-kilter emotionally for all the reasons I mention above. But it doesn't mean he's a bad person, his weight is "just a thing" and isn't the most important thing about him. He really just needed to focus on getting his head and heart healthy again, and the rest will go in whatever direction it should go.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  5. #5
    abcdenfp Abcdenfp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totenkindly View Post
    Yeah, I mean the experience is common enough. I struggle with my weight regularly, it's just very easy for me to gain weight and it can become a negative cycle. I had more time to think about Thor after the film and I think he was SO angry, had been through so much shit before that point, and then to feel like he screwed up and now couldn't fix it -- on SUCH a large scale -- his own people, and then half the universe... well, either he might kill himself, or he'd totally just abdicate responsibility for anything. And it resulted in him just not caring about anything and just losing himself in escapism, food, drink, whatever. It's actually something that happens, depending on someone's personality...

    (I've been watching "This is Us" for example, and Kevin's interesting because he's afraid of pain... or it's SO painful for him that he has to not think about painful experiences and/or avoid them because it messes him up. I get how he works, but I'm not like that -- I thrive off painful experience myself, I think, it teaches me and refines me, and part of me likes pain. So we're all different. But I know for me, when I'm tired or bored, I eat... I need the stimulation. But it's not good for my weight.)

    Anyway... I think it might have been a shock just because no one pictures Thor as fat. And they were going to this movie to see buff Thor in action. Instead they had emotionally vulnerable Thor who was really struggling. So it's not what they expected. But there could be other things going on in the audience as well, people sometimes have visceral responses to overweight folks.

    Here's an interesting thing and I don't remember the early Thor movies well -- but one of the Warriors Three at least in the comic was severely overweight. (Valstaag? I don't remember.) Not sure if he was in the films. If not, why not? But some people who are overweight are actually pretty psychologically healthy and are at home in their body. Valstaag or whoever it was always seemed happy with himself. Thor, I think, is currently not that happy -- it's more of a sign of him being off-kilter emotionally for all the reasons I mention above. But it doesn't mean he's a bad person, his weight is "just a thing" and isn't the most important thing about him. He really just needed to focus on getting his head and heart healthy again, and the rest will go in whatever direction it should go.

    I was almost holding my breath for most of the movie thinking they have got something here, we are touching a nerve... please for the love of GOD! don't let him click his fingers and be buff again OR during the second part of the movie magically end scene and buff him out. I was so happy with his ending. How he looks does not define him and it shouldn't.

    I also totally agree with you on the analysis of he was either going to kill himself or do exactly what he did. That made him relatable to me as well, there is some shit you got to go through and live with there is no magical reset button and you cant "fix" everything.
    blow a kiss to the universe and it is certain to wink at you in return.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Venus Rose's Avatar
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    It was surprisingly kind of boring, specially given the hype :/
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  7. #7
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    I share a similar sentiment to @Venus Rose.

    Though I actually thought the action scenes were boring in a *waaaaarghghtotooomuchshitonscreeeeen* way, as opposed to the slow start or more character driven parts.

    With regards to Thor, him being overweight wasn't even a big deal for me, I hadn't noticed beyond the obvious jokes in the film and his surface appearance.
    But I think others may have deeper issues with that, for better or for worse & for sincere or sinister reasons. Personally I think they played it almost...not quite, but almost well enough between the humorous and tragic.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

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    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
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