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  1. #81
    Knows the best words asynartetic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    Joking, right?
    as long as it's an equal opportunity killer, I'm OK with that. Influenza and asteroids don't care about skin tone and ethnicity.
    The effect of life in society is to complicate and confuse our existence, making us forget who we really are by causing us to become obsessed with what we are not. -Chuang Tzu

  2. #82
    clever fool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    The caveman era had plenty of equality and if you look around the world, there is greatest equality in 3rd world hell-holes.
    Poverty is the natural state of man.
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  3. #83
    Lord Grumpus Tellenbach's Avatar
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    from Robert Heinlein:
    Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances that permit this norm to be exceeded - here and there, now and then - are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned and almost always opposed by all right thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of society, the people slip back into abject poverty. This is known as "bad luck".
    "70% of your tendency to gain weight is determined by your parentage. Obesity is overwhelmingly inherited." The Obesity Code

  4. #84
    Senior Member Yuu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ace_ View Post
    All I can say is that US citizens are living better than 80% of the planet.
    Sure, if you consider quality of life based entirely on how much STUFF one has-which, as a capitalist society we absolutley do.

    But we also insist on living lifestyles which we know are unhealthy and completely unnatural and it’s all just to make barely enoug( money to live on , if you call sitting in front of a screen as your one and only life passes you by “ living.”

  5. #85
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    What if equality issues could be solved outside of political action...



    "You know, with Hitler, the more I learn about that guy, the more I don't care for him."
    Norm MacDonald
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  6. #86
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    from Robert Heinlein:
    Sour grapes can be a nasty impulse.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  7. #87
    Digital ambition Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    This will be more a braking news than abstract ideological talk.


    In my country the eruption of the rebellion in the main nationalist/conservative party (Croatian CDU basically) came out to the surface. The entire section of the party in Lika region resigned from governing the region (Mayors included). Since they don't agree with the pro EU central. (Lika is basically like Montana or Bavaria, conservative people in the mountains. However they are pretty to the left in economy, since here tradition doesn't have too capitalistic roots) The accusations are basically that this administration is not working enough for it's people and that they will just deliver us to foreign big business and interest groups, especially since too many died for this country and current course is "inexcusable"). What as the argument is nothing new, it is just that people are starting to realize that nothing will change.


    In another region and unrelated to this there is the nationalist governor that wouldn't step under pressure from the central and accusations that he was beating his wife. What only adds further fuel to the fire.


    While further east in the ex war zone some the local authorities have declared that in the future local authorities will be paying all utility bills to all familes that have 3 or more children. Since demography, poverty and emigrations in these region are catastrophic.


    Also why this is significant is because this is the biggest party in the country that can trully be called "the establishment". However it is also the most pro-western party, especially now when pro EU wing took over. But this is also the party that won the war of independance and made this country. So the party has assimilated everything from very far right to people that are basically left center. Therefore if even here anti free trade logic is taking place then there wouldn't be anyone left to really defend it. Since for nationalists this is basically taking back their party and their country. Even coalitions between far right and populist left have started to happen since both have problems with "modern" western values.





    Our economy looks something like this at the moment.

    1. Large distribution networks of foreign corporations that are importing in mass (especially since those corporations are often bigger than our entire government when it comes to money), local companies that foreigners bought (often on fairly "controversial" way), foreign banks that own at least 85% of the banking market.


    2. Central government, local government, companies that were never privatized, companies that are under government protection due to their importance, (healthcare, education, security sector), companies that are placed under government in order to stabilize and protect them from free market, retirement system (since all retirements from the communism era went to the wind with system crash, double currency crash and war of independance), agriculture (that is basically being protected by the government).


    3. The remains of our economy: bars, plumbers, family businesses that somehow survived (mosty tourism), some medium size companies ... but not much is left.


    Therefore now we have awkward situation: since the sections 2 and 3 are in agreement that section 1 has to go, period. Since there are no real alternatives if those two sections want to have a future. This is exactly why left-right coalitions are openly possible since everybody knows that this situation isn't going to work for the nation. Especially since today you can just pack your bags and go into some more developed EU country that should give you much bigger income and fulfil your dream(s). However there is also the fact that many who did that ended up at the social bottom of those countries. What pisses of many since those are basically our young people and therefore the future of this nation, which big business basically exiled from their own country with mass imports and political pressures. So the whole thing is comming to point when the lines will be crossed and then we will have the mess that will probably be far more brutal than Brexit. Many tried to exterminate this nation through history and all of this is triggering our "collective defense protocols", which usually end with throwing the rules through the window.







    Also here is how the debate on healthcare looks like between Croatian average Joe and western corporatist.


    Corporatist: Socialized healthcare can't work ... ever.
    Joe: Are you sure about that ? I am having it for decades and look at me, I turned out fine.
    Corporatist: You are wrong, such system is a huge drainage on the economy without any benefits.
    Joe: Is that so ? What about the last war time when economy completely collapsed and this system keep my children alive when the bombs were falling, as well as in post war poverty that followed? What if history of this region repeats itself for 137th time !?
    Corporatist: But this isn't how this world works !?
    Joe : What brings us back to the "Are you sure about that ?" part.



    The fact is that people here for the most part don't want to introduce too much westernzation/corporatism, since that would be giving up on our own culture and as this example shows the changes should come with very questionable result. Especially since marketization would once again probably result with large foreign companies coming here and taking over everything. Various administrations have tried to liberalize this market but people just don't let them, even threats off open revolution have been made over this issue. For which I don't think they are empty threats since here there is basically no family that doesn't have at least one family member that isn't in constant need of such system. What basically means that you have to choose between world of big business and you/your family/your culture .... and we all know what the people will choose in that dilemma.

  8. #88
    Digital ambition Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Btw ...

    To continue ...
    I just watched the news:

    The driving schools market is getting unregulated and the prices will go up. Reactions are negative.


    Plus the main left party is even in bigger problems than main conservative party, since they basically gave up on their base in pretty much every way. So now relatively civil Anarcho-communist party "The living wall" is taking their place as the second party. In some regions they are already over them in the polls. The thing about living wall movement is that they aren't politicians, they are uniting people against the banks in order to fight them, they prevent people/families being thrown out of their homes over debts ... etc. What people are buying since people are tired of poverty, foreign elites and foreign ideology.


    So if something isn't done to mild this there will surely be some "paradigm shifts", for which this region is known for. Corporatists think they have it under control but they are overlooking the fact that law enforcement in this country is generally made out of veterans who were bleeding for this country back in the war of independace and the concesus is that "this isn't the country for which they were fighting". This is exactly why there is the rebellion in the main conservative party as well. Plus the law enforcement themselves are generally so low that they also require "help" of the new far left. As a matter of fact the war of independace was possible exactly because those same law enforcement people decided to go against the foreign central communist government that was rated as "unfair".



    This country isn't US and some people are obviously overlooking this.

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