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  1. #51
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    What evidence? How could unskilled immigration possibly benefit the host country?
    There are jobs that require cheap, unskilled labor?
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  2. #52
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    There are jobs that require unskilled labor, not that require it to be cheap. Cheap labor only benefits the investor class.
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  3. #53
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    There are jobs that require unskilled labor, not that require it to be cheap. Cheap labor only benefits the investor class.
    Downward pressure on wages isn't always bad. It can help tamp down price inflation.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  4. #54
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    There are jobs that require unskilled labor, not that require it to be cheap. Cheap labor only benefits the investor class.
    If the hourly price of labor is a variable that is dependent on the level of skill of the labor (and the demand for such said skill in the market at the time of labor consumption) then the price of:

    unskilled hourly labor < average skilled hourly labor < highly skilled hourly labor

    Could you please provide a (legal) example of where unskilled labor is paid a higher than "cheap" rate in the modern market economy?

    I thought that the price of hourly labor is dependent on the level of skill of the laborer. In most societies skills such as being a medical doctor, accountant, or lawyer are highly skilled as compared to the hourly price of short order chefs, waiters, or store clerks, and also have relatively high barriers to entry with regard to educational requirements, professional certifications, and number of hours of apprentice/resident experience...

    Thoughts, Mr. Aleksei? I'm sincerely interested, and not being a smart ass.

    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Downward pressure on wages isn't always bad. It can help tamp down price inflation.
    +1.
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  5. #55
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    I define "native," somewhat loosely, as an ethnic group which has inhabited a given place long enough to legitimately call it home, to the exclusion of any ancestral homelands. White and black Americans fit the bill quite nicely.
    "Legitimate"..."ethnic group"?

    I just caught this, so I'm guessing you wouldn't take the opinions of Asian Americans or Latino Americans seriously when it comes to questions of American society, culture, or laws, since collectively as "ethnic groups" they haven't been here long enough?

    I'm curious because your username is Aleksei, what is your own family background?
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  6. #56
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    I'm a Puerto Rican living in Puerto Rico, and a Puerto Rican nationalist.
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  7. #57
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Downward pressure on wages isn't always bad. It can help tamp down price inflation.
    Keynesian bullshit. Price inflation is a result of a rise in the aggregate supply of money, beyond the growth of goods and services within a given time period. If wages decline but the money supply rises, prises will rise regardless because somebody's receiving that money, and thus somebody's using it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    If the hourly price of labor is a variable that is dependent on the level of skill of the labor (and the demand for such said skill in the market at the time of labor consumption) then the price of:

    unskilled hourly labor < average skilled hourly labor < highly skilled hourly labor

    Could you please provide a (legal) example of where unskilled labor is paid a higher than "cheap" rate in the modern market economy?

    I thought that the price of hourly labor is dependent on the level of skill of the laborer. In most societies skills such as being a medical doctor, accountant, or lawyer are highly skilled as compared to the hourly price of short order chefs, waiters, or store clerks, and also have relatively high barriers to entry with regard to educational requirements, professional certifications, and number of hours of apprentice/resident experience...

    Thoughts, Mr. Aleksei? I'm sincerely interested, and not being a smart ass.
    Well, obviously because of the fungibility of unskilled labor it has lower value than skilled labor, but nevertheless it can be made more valuable, by restricting the available supply of unskilled laborers. One way to do this is to restrict the inflow of unskilled immigrants into the country. The US actually has a median unskilled wage rate much lower than that of neighboring Canada or most Western European countries, despite having a higher GDP per capita, as well as a significantly broader pool of unskilled labor; which is a major contributing factor in the income inequality gap between the US and Western Europe.
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  8. #58
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    There are jobs that require unskilled labor, not that require it to be cheap. Cheap labor only benefits the investor class.
    ...and consumers.

    So cheap farm labor, for example, actually benefits only the segment of the investment class who eat.

    I'd say that's a fairly big segment of the population.

    That said, I'm for legal immigration, and lowering the bar on how to immigrate legally. And when that's been done, require all the illegal immigrants to go through the legal process or boot their asses out of the country until they do so.

  9. #59
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    ...and consumers.
    1) Not if production is sufficiently capital-intensive.
    2) Not if production is geared towards export while consumer goods are imported.
    3) Not if said consumers are recipients of the cheaper wages, and their wage cuts are less than consumption savings (which they always are -- real estate sucks down 30-40% of everyone's income, utilities take up another 10%, etc).

    Your point debunked.
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  10. #60
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    Your point debunked.
    ...in the cases where your three "if"s are valid, maybe...

    Here in North Carolina, illegals are primarily farm labor. Some work construction and landscaping, particularly during the off-season.

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