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  1. #71
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Apr 2007



    I can dance like the devil himself, but I'm sure that's because of the gayness.
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  2. #72
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007


    Yes, it's true, Mexico's government does have problems and have Calderon has a lot of detractors within Mexico. They call him 'FeCal'. Yes, It means the same thing in Spanish as in English. ^_^

    When I was in Mexico City DF in December, there was an ongoing protest/camp out in downtown because the government privatized/sold the electric utility and fired the majority of the workers, no pension, no heads up, just locked them out one day. Thousands, or was it tens of thousands? of people lost their livelihoods.

    There is a big difference between rich and poor in Mexico, there is definitely a wealthy elite on par with well-heeled uptown hipsters in the states.

    BTW, Mexico City is facing a pending water shortage. As in there will be no water. At all.

    That's just Mexico City DF though.

    So yeah, I suspect Calderon is explicitly speaking to protect the rights of 'legal' immigrants, condemn racism against Mexicans in the United States, and stem any "bad press" his country might be getting.

    But, I'm also pretty sure, that Calderon is well aware of the 'illegal immigrant' problem in the US and he really doesn't want anything to curb it. He has nothing to lose but much to gain from Mexicans to continue entering and earning money in the country, legal or not, documented or not.

    So, I can see why Marm would be angry in the OP.

    But, I think just because there is a sense of unearned and undeserved entitlement from FeCal, doesn't mean that racism does NOT exist against anyone considered 'Mexican'.

    There may be some realities that are cited as a case for Arizona's new crazy ass legislation. Tiny Kernels of Truth. That get distorted and incorrectly cited as evidence or need for some draconian measure. Taking the kernel of truth, veiling through half-truths, and turning it into a campaign against 'all the _______' - that's where racism, ageism, homophobia, etc. etc. come in.

    Kernel of Truth: Biological women bear babies.
    Sexism: All women want to and will have babies and therefore do not want to work and should not work because it takes away from their role as mother. They are not as committed nor biologically suited to a career as men. Therefore, women should not be allowed to work and when they do, it will always be under the supervision of men and not in any jobs reserved for men, which is most of them. Etc. Etc. Etc.
    Reality: Regardless of whether any of that is true ^^ women are competition for men in the workplace and society and men will protect their status tooth and nail.

    Back to the OP - from personal experience and observation, the fuss around 'illegal immigration' really applies to all immigrants. Xenophobes can't tell the difference between "legal" or "illegal" immigrants nor do they care. That's why they're xenophobes.

    I think, Marm, that's why you may interpret people using 'the racism card'. They are not arguing about the kernel of truth, they are arguing about everything that happens after that.

    PS I haven't really ever been annoyed by anything another country says or comments on about American policy or whatnot. The closest thing to it was when Obama visited Australia while he was running his campaign for the Democratic ticket and someone...not the Prime Minister but someone in his Cabinet was interviewed CNN (really presumptuously IMHO) lecturing on what the next US president's priorities should be and how America should decide on their votes. My reaction was...who the heck are you in the global scene to be levelling those kind of directives to voters in the US? And seriously...Australia??? No offense to the Aussies on the forum, but since when has Australia been a power player and key policy/trading ally of the US? It was a little, again, presumptuous IMHO of whoever that Aussie politician was, but perhaps that's why Obama was courting a lesser used global ally to start building global credentials and US momentum for the race.

    However, when the then premier of China supposedly called George Bush Jr an "imbecile" or something like that, learning he had been "elected" president...I didn't mind. I had to agree. Apparently lots of world leaders talked mad ish about George Bush Jr when they learned he had been "elected" to the presidency.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux


  3. #73


    I live in AZ. I recently saw a John McCain campaign ad that featured some cowboy talking about how McCain was going to "defend our borders", with this weird climactic music in the background... It was hilarious. I can't believe you can pander to people like that and still get away with it.

    The way I see it, it's a good thing that we're getting immigration, because it's a sign that our nation is prospering. Before we had this immigration "problem", Mexico had an immigration "problem" with people swarming in from South America. So yeah, it's natural that they would come knocking on our doors next. But many people here (mostly conservatives) think that illegal Mexican immigration is a plague on our nation, even though a huge chunk of our culture is Mexican. Some even think that legal Mexican immigration is a threat.

    This issue isn't stigmatized because of the law. It's stigmatized because of the De Facto consequences of immigration in general. Some people think that crime rates will increase because of the flood of Mexicans who occupy Arizona. Or perhaps the economy will combust in the wrong direction because of the flux of Mexican workers and consumers.

    There's also a law that states that children who were brought here illegally should be deported even though they were under the supervision and custody of their parents. But, technically, the custodial law is only applicable in Mexico. There was a Mexican guy from my old school who was deported even though he was experiencing ailments, so they shipped him back to Mexico and he died once he got back. The hospitals here rejected him. It's unjust. This kid had a high GPA and no criminal record, except for immigrating illegally, which wasn't even under his control.

  4. #74
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008


    Come on. lol You know that kind of crap does appeal to enough people in this state. Can you remember when John Mccain was progressive? It feels like forever ago.

  5. #75


    Quote Originally Posted by 01011010 View Post
    Come on. lol You know that kind of crap does appeal to enough people in this state. Can you remember when John Mccain was progressive? It feels like forever ago.
    I miss that John McCain... before he became a sellout...

    That's the first time I've ever thought about John McCain and Metallica in the same sentence. Freaky.

    But yeah you're right.

  6. #76
    Supreme High Commander Andy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009


    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    Whatever always smiles inappropriately. I think she's just trying to keep things friendly.
    I read it as a cynical it-all-about-money-what-did-you-expect smile.

  7. #77


    I got no problem with Mexicans in particular, or Latin Americans in general. I would appreciate that if you're going to come to my country and bitch about my country's policies as though we owe you something, you should be a documented legal immigrant please.

    I also think the legal immigration process should be miles simpler and easier, but that's a separate discussion.

  8. #78
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Oct 2008


    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Are you trying to say white people can't dance? Because I can get down!
    Shorty got low... low... low... low
    Listen to me, baby, you got to understand, you're old enough to learn the makings of a man.

  9. #79
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009


    There seems to be a correlation between unemployment rates of illegal aliens and the thickness of my wallet. By taking a simple psychology or sociology class you will be exposed to maslow's hierarchy of needs. There is a reason that the working class seems to be feverishly against illegal immigration and it's decriminalization.

    I disagree with Tater's assertion that illegal immigration is a sign that the US is prospering, although I'm not a conservative. The US may seem to be prospering when compared to Mexico or any one of the poor Central American countries but there is a large segment of our population that is suffering due to a combination of illegal immigration and a construction recession. It may not be possible for the government to help get us out of the recession, but illegal immigration is a problem that the government can help with.

    -About 23% of all job losses during this recession were construction jobs.

    -There are about 9 million construction worker in the US.

    -Approx. 400,000 illegal immigrants are construction workers. (22% of all construction workers)
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”

  10. #80
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007


    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise
    Can Someone Help Me Understand Why The President of Mexico Feels This Way?
    Mostly this:

    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    From what I've heard on that viewpoint held by many Mexican politicians, a lot of the desire to keep the border open for workers to come to the US to work is because most Mexicans who come to the US and work send A LOT of money home
    I think the law is more about drawing attention to the issue than actually helping the immigration problem, in which case it's working.

    Quote Originally Posted by musttry View Post
    BTW. I think the war zone is due to a reorganisation of distribution that will probably lead to a more efficient system. I think once the war is over, things will be smoothe and we will get our drugs.
    Maybe temporarily. The U.S. has no idea how to fight a drug war. As soon as stabilization is brought by a singular power over the market, that person becomes a "big catch" and law enforcement/politicians start creaming their panties over the thought of catching them, never mind the consequences. That goes for international and domestic policy.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

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