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The West’s (not Kanye) lack of chivalry and guts.

Yuurei

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Probably all part of a plan to get conservatives riled up and screaming about how women should not be in the military.

BTW, “ The West” dies have it’s genered issues and the OP’s perspective is a prime example.
 

Coriolis

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Being berated by drill instructors is not supposed to be pleasant. Ideally, they shouldn't go easy on recruits and trainees just because of gender. If someone can't handle drill instructors and military standards, then they shouldn't be enlisted in the first place. I certainly wouldn't join.
Yes, DI's shouldn't go easy on women. They shouldn't insult them for being women - there are plenty of other things to include in the usual diatribes - but it should be gender neutral. I have been on the receiving end of this, and it is just something you go through to reach a goal. There is something to be said for not letting it get to you. That is a great skill/mindset to have in life.

Thankfully the sentiments on this forum aren’t the mainstream:
Bully army corporal reduces female recruit to tears in harrowing training video

This monster is being rightfully court martialed for doing his job.
Men have been reduced to tears by DI's, too. In fact men have been reduced to tears at boot camp because they felt so badly for their fellow (male) recruits who were having a hard time taking it. It isn't all about gender.

because chivalry and ladies in pointy hats and knights in shining armor jousting and shit! :yes:
I would prefer to see chilvary extended to everyone, outside of training scenarios like these, of course. The world could use alot more courtesy and respect.
 
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Men have been reduced to tears by DI's, too. In fact men have been reduced to tears at boot camp because they felt so badly for their fellow (male) recruits who were having a hard time taking it. It isn't all about gender.

On-topic: Out of the grave, a man is resurrected (Sup, Lazarus). Rather, Out of the ashes, a phoenix is born (if you prefer). We're in agreement although, I'm proud to say my company must've been full of stronger men since none of us broke to the point of tears, and boot camp was arguably harder back then (early 2000s). Nay, this is about a second-rate DI (maybe DI's just sound funny with a British accent?) video taping a day in the office the moment a young lady broke (which didn't take much).

The ire of conservative "no wimmins in da infantry" clique is about the fact that it didn't take much to break her, and whether that is true across the board and female recruits are being easily weeded out wasting the governments time and money, or handled with kid gloves in order to pass them through the training whether by failings being overlooked or standards of simulated psychological/physiological abuses are being lowered. It is absolutely a gendered issue.

Off-topic: How often does the world ever conform to how you reason it should be?
 

Coriolis

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On-topic: Out of the grave, a man is resurrected (Sup, Lazarus). Rather, Out of the ashes, a phoenix is born (if you prefer). We're in agreement although, I'm proud to say my company must've been full of stronger men since none of us broke to the point of tears, and boot camp was arguably harder back then (early 2000s). Nay, this is about a second-rate DI (maybe DI's just sound funny with a British accent?) video taping a day in the office the moment a young lady broke (which didn't take much).

The ire of conservative "no wimmins in da infantry" clique is about the fact that it didn't take much to break her, and whether that is true across the board and female recruits are being easily weeded out wasting the governments time and money, or handled with kid gloves in order to pass them through the training whether by failings being overlooked or standards of simulated psychological/physiological abuses are being lowered. It is absolutely a gendered issue.

Off-topic: How often does the world ever conform to how you reason it should be?
Increasingly well. It is surprising what you can get when you actually ask for it, or how willing people can be sometimes to rise to expectations when they are made known. (This has been well demonstrated in education, for example.)

I suppose women who enter the military may have some catching up to do in handling their emotions more in the way the military expects. Boys are still much more likely than girls to be raised this way, which has its downsides as well. It wouldn't be the first time the military serves a remedial education function. For years they had to teach basic reading and math skills to recruits whose K-12 education had been inadequate. Apparently they considered it worth the investment to secure the service of these troops.

FWIW, the only person I ever saw in tears in my unit was a guy who eventually decided he wasn't cut out for the military, and should go into ministry instead. It wasn't the DI's who got to him, it was the teasing and criticism from his flight mates because he really was sort of a whiny wimp who wouldn't try. The instructors did cut him some slack, but even that didn't help.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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One elephant in the room, difference in sexes when it come to crying.

Yes, it's been established either sex can and does cry. What we're leaving out is who cries more and why, also how we approach/view crying as a sign of weakness, which may be an unhealthy way of looking at a healthy and normal part of our biology.

I'm not sure a female recruit crying more than a male counterpart is in itself a sign of greater weakness or inability to cope. More information is required.

For instance, a recent article made the rounds about a male scientist complaining about female students crying more, but he was likely viewing it through his own bias, as a sign of weakness, when really it's a form of emotional coping, and why they were crying more may not be due to greater weakness, may just be their way of coping with pressures of university vs how male students deal with the same pressures.

Also, women have shorter and shallower tear ducts (on average), so tears pour out more, whereas male tears will build up in the larger, deeper ducts before spilling out. In those cases, men have the advantage of "getting a handle" on them before the waterworks become so obvious, thus appearing to cry less and appearing to have a greater emotional resilience. That same advantage becomes a disadvantage, depending on the scenario and circumstances, likewise with women's crying. Something to consider and I wouldn't write off a female soldier solely based on tears, not without having more information and context.

Studies have also suggested higher testosterone levels inhibit crying.
 
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Increasingly well. It is surprising what you can get when you actually ask for it, or how willing people can be sometimes to rise to expectations when they are made known. (This has been well demonstrated in education, for example.)

I suppose women who enter the military may have some catching up to do in handling their emotions more in the way the military expects. Boys are still much more likely than girls to be raised this way, which has its downsides as well. It wouldn't be the first time the military serves a remedial education function. For years they had to teach basic reading and math skills to recruits whose K-12 education had been inadequate. Apparently they considered it worth the investment to secure the service of these troops.

FWIW, the only person I ever saw in tears in my unit was a guy who eventually decided he wasn't cut out for the military, and should go into ministry instead. It wasn't the DI's who got to him, it was the teasing and criticism from his flight mates because he really was sort of a whiny wimp who wouldn't try. The instructors did cut him some slack, but even that didn't help.

Gotcha. To me, this video showed a standard "SOI" sort of exercise that all soldiers must pass no matter if you go on to be a grunt or a POG. Her MOS could well be in an admin position. Recruiters conveniently "forgot" mentioning this portion of her military career as they are prone to do.
 

Yuurei

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After being able to watch the video; pls. This was like dealing with my parents on a daily basis. I was not very old when I learned to just stare at them, completely blank-faced until my Father was more afraid of me than I was of him. It’s no doubt of why of show so little expression now.
 

Bush

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Short answer: Because dudes don't cry.
Yes, they totally do. To the extent that they don't, comparatively -- some of it is biological, but a lot of it is social conditioning. You know, they're not "supposed to."

Even if they didn't cry, they sure as hell could very well feel disappointed or defeated. I don't know why crying is the metric, then.

But...

Long answer: And dudes who would cry, are smart enough to avoid the heat.
...I don't know what this means.

Then there's this (presumably) "useful idiot" who with her head filled with equalism, went into what looks like a standard combat exercise, a D.I. lacking in intensity making a girl cry on (an illegal) camera for the whole world to see. Doesn't look good for anyone. Someone's gotta go down. It'll be the CPL in this vid.
I can agree with the problems with it being recorded in the first place.
 
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Yes, they totally do. To the extent that they don't, comparatively -- some of it is biological, but a lot of it is social conditioning. You know, they're not "supposed to."

Maybe. Maybe not, because:

Studies have also suggested higher testosterone levels inhibit crying.

I'd like to see those studies. Probably a combination of both. The biological aspect could have inspired the social conditioning, and not the other way around.

Could be the case that men these days do have lower testosterone (which is also supported by studies) which explains the push for crying men.

:shrug:

FYI: My facetiousness in that post didn't register with you.
 

Bush

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Maybe. Maybe not, because:

Let me bold the other clause in that statement.
some of it is biological, but a lot of it is social conditioning.


Could be the case that men these days have lower testosterone (which is also supported by studies) which explains the push for crying men.
Which would make the case for special treatment for women even flimsier.
 
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Let me bold the other clause in that statement.

Right. We're disagreeing on the position of these two bolded words:

some of it is biological, but a lot of it is social conditioning.

This isn't immediately obvious to me:
Which would make the case for special treatment for women even flimsier.

Could you explain your point for the rest of us special needs kids?

In this video: A Marine recruit passes out during a hump after having drank too much Elmer's glue the night before.
 
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