European Indigenous Spirituality

[sLiPpY]

Thought it might be interesting to share a glimpse of what non-Abrahamic European spirituality might have looked like. The bloot presented seems reasonably authentic to around 800 CE. Although the video is labeled Viking...there are a lot of misconceptions about that term. Viking doesn't describe a people, it doesn't describe an individual...going "Vikingr!" was something you do, not something you are. Also the symbolism of a horned Viking helmet is complete and utter bunk, more realistically suited for an Opera stage or a comic book.

During this era, many had already abandoned the old custom...aka Forn Sed. Which simply means "our ways". There wasn't an actual name for the beliefs/practices. Which have a heck of a lot more in common with Veda vs. Abrahamic beliefs/perceptions of a god concept. Which is why the Christian Trinity, bares no resemblance to Judaic monotheism, or ideas as to what god is. By this point in history, Europeans were largely either agnostic or participating in tradition as the modern Church continues to serve a social function for weddings and funerals, often with scant attendance in-between, least for Scandinavia.

There wasn't a Pantheon of the Roman conception. Albeit that erroneous cultural appropriation continues to this day.

 

[Typh0n]

Have you heard of Stephen Flowers? I find his works fascinating, he specializes in the subject of Indo-European religions and he is particularly interested in the Left-Hand Path.

He's mainly known for his work in the Germanic Runes, but he also studied Mazdaism, and Hermetic magic (synthesis of various cultural currents: Gnostic, Egyptian, Iranian, Greek, Jewish, Christian etc) at the time of the Roman Empire.

The fact he specializes in Indo-European religion I'm guessing should appeal to you.

I should add that he writes from the perspective of not just a scholar of religion, but also a magician who puts into practice the systems he studies for magical use.

 

[sLiPpY]

Have you heard of Stephen Flowers? I find his works fascinating, he specializes in the subject of Indo-European religions and he is particularly interested in the Left-Hand Path.

He's mainly known for his work in the Germanic Runes, but he also studied Mazdaism, and Hermetic magic (synthesis of various cultural currents: Gnostic, Egyptian, Iranian, Greek, Jewish, Christian etc) at the time of the Roman Empire.

The fact he specializes in Indo-European religion I'm guessing should appeal to you.

I should add that he writes from the perspective of not just a scholar of religion, but also a magician who puts into practice the systems he studies for magical use.

Yes, I am aware of Flowers, but do not consider him to be an viable authority on the topic of Indo-European pre-Christian spirituality. Much of his work I see as a tainted dis-service to those genuinely seeking to comprehend and explore the ancestral topic. However, tip my hat as he is a viable authority of the desert demon's LHP.

Having studied the anthropology and archeology in-depth, my own conclusion is that Runic Magic is not an authentic historical context. Similar to Sun Signs, having played NO ROLE of importance in historical Astrology. Until someone decided it might make for interesting fare, to place next to the comics in newspapers, here in the good ole' US of A about seventy years ago.

I generally agree with what the writer of the following blogpost has to say on the topic: Runes of divination and magic? * Misconceptions and Misunderstandings * World-Tree Project

 

[Lark]

I'm really glad Christendom did its bit to wipe all that out.

 

[Typh0n]

I'm really glad Christendom did its bit to wipe all that out.

Booooooo

 

[Lark]

Booooooo

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[sLiPpY]

I'm really glad Christendom did its bit to wipe all that out.

Wipe all of what out? It's not like the brick and mortar Church isn't basically institutionalized paganism.

 

[Betty Blue]

How far do you want to go back? Lots going on before the vikings

 

[Lark]

Wipe all of what out? It's not like the brick and mortar Church isn't basically institutionalized paganism.

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How far do you want to go back? Lots going on before the vikings

Yeah but the viking era fits in with the badly understood history which forms the basis of a lot of the Klan mythology of the anglo-saxons and all.

 

[Betty Blue]

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Yeah but the viking era fits in with the badly understood history which forms the basis of a lot of the Klan mythology of the anglo-saxons and all.

Well there really is a lot to learn about previous times too. And many more misconceptions. Just wondering why you picked a particular time... maybe just because it interests you?... so why? thats what i'm asking

 

[ceecee]

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Yeah but the viking era fits in with the badly understood history which forms the basis of a lot of the Klan mythology of the anglo-saxons and all.

As did the Nazi's, as do people touting a genetic superiority of any kind and neo-Pagans, although my personal favorite is Asatru. It's too bad so many of these beliefs have been commandeered by the very worst of humanity. The rest are wannabe Vikings, usually with absolutely zero Norse in them and no real knowledge of Odinism. I don't believe the KKK promote anything other than Protestant Christianity. They certainly don't identify with pagans, Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, they don't advertise themselves as having a basis in mythology. They formed to maintain the antebellum racial order. White superiority. That's it.

 

[Lark]

As did the Nazi's, as do people touting a genetic superiority of any kind and neo-Pagans, although my personal favorite is Asatru. It's too bad so many of these beliefs have been commandeered by the very worst of humanity. The rest are wannabe Vikings, usually with absolutely zero Norse in them and no real knowledge of Odinism. I don't believe the KKK promote anything other than Protestant Christianity. They certainly don't identify with pagans, Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, they don't advertise themselves as having a basis in mythology. They formed to maintain the antebellum racial order. White superiority. That's it.

As I understand it they are big into the WASP superiority, white anglo-saxon protestants, the anglo and the saxon refers to the settling of england, for the most part, by vikings, or at least the so called "north men", ie Norse Men.

Anyway, as I saw its a sort or form of mythos, even if its invented or imagined by that particular movement itself, I know that some of the neo-nazis and fascists are big into their runic alphabet, the guy who was the author of the Turner Diaries, Hunter, Serpents Tail (I think that was the title of the last of the three but I dont remember) apparently decorated his building with them. I think that Bill White, when his whole utopian anarchist party took the sharp right turn was a fan too, if I remember right.

A lot of the paganism is retconning the past by moderns anyway, to a certain extent I think this happens with all history, the present imagines the past and with each one all it really achieves is a better picture of itself, what I think anyway.

I'm a fan of certain ideas about tradition, traditionalism and history but truthfully it all suffers from problems, at least as much as innovation and progressive thinking.

 

[sLiPpY]

How far do you want to go back? Lots going on before the vikings

As far back as you'd like to take us! One really can't comprehend the Vikingr' period, without considering Troy, the Phoneticians, the Danube, Tyre, etc. etc.

 

[ceecee]

As I understand it they are big into the WASP superiority, white anglo-saxon protestants, the anglo and the saxon refers to the settling of england, for the most part, by vikings, or at least the so called "north men", ie Norse Men.

The Saxons were Germanic tribes, not Viking, The Saxons ruled England, generally Egbert gets the nod for uniting the kingdoms until Duke William showed up in 1066. But the Normans were not Viking by that point and to my knowledge had no connection to the Danish kings of England either.

 

[sLiPpY]

As I understand it they are big into the WASP superiority, white anglo-saxon protestants, the anglo and the saxon refers to the settling of england, for the most part, by vikings, or at least the so called "north men", ie Norse Men.

Anyway, as I saw its a sort or form of mythos, even if its invented or imagined by that particular movement itself, I know that some of the neo-nazis and fascists are big into their runic alphabet, the guy who was the author of the Turner Diaries, Hunter, Serpents Tail (I think that was the title of the last of the three but I dont remember) apparently decorated his building with them. I think that Bill White, when his whole utopian anarchist party took the sharp right turn was a fan too, if I remember right.

A lot of the paganism is retconning the past by moderns anyway, to a certain extent I think this happens with all history, the present imagines the past and with each one all it really achieves is a better picture of itself, what I think anyway.

I'm a fan of certain ideas about tradition, traditionalism and history but truthfully it all suffers from problems, at least as much as innovation and progressive thinking.

Seems this past year, the types your speaking of I've come to view as "butt-hurt" in not having been spoon-fed the traditions of their lineage. Ironically, I see the same central issues amongst the SJW and Antifa folks. All "butt-hurt" over concocted illusions being spoon fed by others who have no clue what they're talking about.

All caught up in the "dream."

 

[sLiPpY]

The Saxons were Germanic tribes, not Viking, The Saxons ruled England, generally Egbert gets the nod for uniting the kingdoms until Duke William showed up in 1066. But the Normans were not Viking by that point and to my knowledge had no connection to the Danish kings of England either.

Yes, the Saxons were Germanic, but not really...it's akin to saying I'm Welsh, or Irish, or American and gosh knows Viking was an activity not a people. Vikingr in a lot of ways resembles Colonialism. What was happening? Group of folks figured out a successful strategy to increase populations and strengths, that "hit the wall" of what the local environment...innovation of that age had to offer. So the mindset of eldest, inheritance...wife carrying on and owning in the husbands absence or death, until the eldest...took on the lands. Led to movement, seeking fortunes outside of the home land. Process, that rinsed and repeated itself up unto this very day in the good ole' USA.

So we have the allegedly Germanic Franks, moving down into Normandie. I say "alleged" in that they were "people of the Wolf." Originally, of Thrace that came across the lands to settle vs. up the Danube as with the tribe of Dan, aka Danes, aka Vikings. Eventually, converging in Normandie, inter-marrying and described as Normans. When it's more accurate to say there was no difference, they all sprung out of the same space. Hell, I'm up to my armpits in Normans to this very day. But, we're also much rarer than almost any other given alleged "minority."

 

[Digital Lion]

It's too bad so many of these beliefs have been commandeered by the very worst of humanity.

Agreed. And though they may certainly co-opt, they can commandeer nothing unless they are passively allowed to, which is why they mustn't be allowed to, and fortunately, they are being challenged, in various ways, with more overtly inclusive narratives and directives. Inarguably, there has been a degree of ostensible taint, but the matter is far from settled:

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/11/asatru-heathenry-racism/543864/

The rest are wannabe Vikings, usually with absolutely zero Norse in them and no real knowledge of Odinism.

Indeed. Irony is usually lost on emotionally castrated, imbecilic troglodytes. Misappropriating facets of another culture on the basis of it signifying some delusional notion of a purely "white" heritage meant to unify, all the while, 1.) said culture existed at a time when there was no definitive consensus and conception of how we now define the sociological construct known as race, and 2.) the peoples belonging to said culture routinely fought, murdered and subjugated others who were just as "blonde and blue-eyed" as they were, but fell under a different clan, tribe, ethnicity or religion, therefore invalidating this (whether asserted or implied) make believe notion of phenotype and ethnicity being intrinsically and metaphysically tied to one's spirituality/belief system in the form of some sort of ethnicity spanning, "KUM BA YA," cohesive masking tape. The Anglo-Saxons and the Danish Vikings hated and murdered each other relentlessly and they all essentially came from the same place and the same stock of people with similar indigenous religious beliefs, but only separated by a divergent few hundred years. Simply "looking alike" or coming from a similar place meant little to nothing to them as pertains their tempestuous, blood stained relationship and so I don't see why some singular "heritage" should hold any ancestral or historical gravitas today among disparate groups of phenotypical "white" people in the context of who has true ownership over Norse spirituality. Put succinctly, "whiteness" and "Europeanness" alone don't cut it.

Also, these aforementioned troglodytes, in clinging to their oft projected ideas about how ancient Scandinavians, and in particular, the Vikings believed and lived their lives, somehow neglect that just as there were Vikings who held fast to their belief systems wherever they landed, there were also those who embraced other cultures and belief systems, freely intermingling and joining with those who neither looked like them nor believed as they did. Oftentimes, they were both raiders and merchants to far reaching parts of the earth, and therefore not inherently closed off to difference. The Vikings who maintained their indigenous belief systems were no greater a Viking than those who did not.

I'm all for promoting the many forms of indigenous spirituality, in and of themselves, as worthy alternatives to the major world religions (particularly the shit stirring Abrahamic ones), but binding them to "heritage" and "blood and soil" as some sort of measure of racial/ethnic purity, just seems...stupid, and moreover, is counter-historical in many instances. Ultimately, IMO, religion/spirituality is nothing but a way, a conduit by which one may choose to orient him or her self in the world; I believe that one's place of origin should not bar or exclude anyone from participation in any practice by which they find spiritual resonance, and those who do have origins in the lands where said belief systems are rooted, don't possess greater ownership than those who do not. Belief is free, or at least, it should be.

I'm a multiracial (25% of which stems from a EU passport carrying ethnic Swede btw), ethnically ambiguous "mudblood" to the bone marrow, and I dare some ignorant, backwoods, inbred MFer with penis envy to question Mjolnir hanging proudly around my neck because of that fact.

And in contributing to the thread:

 

[biohazard]

Wipe all of what out? It's not like the brick and mortar Church isn't basically institutionalized paganism.

Very true. The whole concept of the Virgin Mary having a baby where three Kings meet "the son" is a tale that originated with pagans who worshipped Tammuz. I learned a lot reading much of Joseph Campbell. And thanks a lot to the damn Romans for messing with pagan traditions... ugh.

 

[Lark]

Seems this past year, the types your speaking of I've come to view as "butt-hurt" in not having been spoon-fed the traditions of their lineage. Ironically, I see the same central issues amongst the SJW and Antifa folks. All "butt-hurt" over concocted illusions being spoon fed by others who have no clue what they're talking about.

All caught up in the "dream."

Whereas you can feel superior to all these people as you have not had their experience?

A pretty revealing post.