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How do you deal with getting proselytized to at your place of employment?

SurrealisticSlumbers

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I've been ambushed by evangelical Christian types a few times now -- at work, where I can't just walk away or order them to leave, as it's not my property. It's a museum. The Mennonites and Orthodox Jews don't bug me. It's just these folks. How do you guys deal with it??? :mad:
 

Zangetshumody

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That's a tough one, I know what I might do/say, but also, for me that would greatly vary: depending on the tact being employed against me. Your particular views on religion, are in essence, very relevant, if the people engaging you are interested in a real and genuine exchange... although usually these sorts of so-called Christians, don't care about being convincing on an intellectual level, so much as they are just desperate to prove the efficacy of their gang-mentality, and the power of their brands' advertising campaign...

I don't know what your personal views are, but I would suggest that you communicate something along the lines of your reluctance to have conversations involving your important personal beliefs, at your place of work: or something along the lines of delineating a public/private life divide, analogous to the church/state divide.

Otherwise if your not afraid of using some of your privately held views to shield yourself from further, unwanted advances, you could suggest that your religious views are already settled, and offer some account of them, and perhaps offer up some sort of rhetorical question that makes their style of "faith" unpalatable to you, perhaps focusing on their feeling-based force of reasoning for their cause (an agree to disagree sort of tactic, because their beliefs are shrouded in unconvincing sentiments, that your just unable to swallow).

There are more variations of this sort of mixture, depending on how much more of your personal views you might want to publicly air in the context of ending these lines of conversation.
You could even profess agnosticism, and cite their kind of "faith" to be undeserving for some stated reason, that they cannot easily overcome— at least, without them having to sound like someone you might want to pursue in a deeper exchange (because they possess some particular knowledge your interested in, functioning as the cost of your invitation for such discussions).

In my experience, real openness, with clearly defined obstacles, is the better deterrent, that feels easier to maintain on the level of personal integrity.

____
this is totally off topic, but I've recently been thinking on how to describe a good way to have an intellectual exchange..

instead of both participants trying to chair a discussion jointly, or wrestling for that tone of narration between the two of them: the best style of discussion: I would describe as taking turns to chair the discussion. So then each person gets a turn to chair the discussion, and draw the other through some sort of descriptive or illustrative gambit, for setting up their substantiating claims, or showcasing an issue of contention... the other party would make themselves subject to a level of participation, forcing themselves to answer the questions posed to them (if needed), or having some level of conceptual assent, in furtherance of the chaired discussion being checked up on during the exchange etc.

Of course, to save time, they could premise their participatory responses, with the respondent 'excepting' to the question's form or basis (i.e. discrediting or refuting the kind of substance being elicited by the prescribed participation)... Excepting can therefore be helpful to both parties causes, as it can be helpful for illustrating points which are to be made later on, perhaps even when the other side is given a turn to chair the discussion, but 'excepting' can even be helpful to the presiding chair, affording them the opportunity to clear up any potential, or even minor conceptual refutation, that might otherwise hinder the reception of the presentation that's being chaired. (So then both parties might even engage in a more equal, meta-exchange, even while only one of them is chairing the discussion— of course, the meta-exchange aspect, may be abandoned by one or both parties, each of their own accord, since exceptions may honorably take the form of broad sweeping negations based on divergent principles not yet in full view of the discussion, although without naming or at least alluding to the content of an 'exception', (or illustrating the insinuated kind of efficacy required to maintain such a reservation),— being followed up on, or interrogated about— would seem crassly intellectually-dishonest.

The above framework of discussion, does not immunize the possibility of having a disingenuous interlocutor, but this setup should work well enough to show an audience which side has more thoroughly workable rigor to his position or contention, at least if the one of them is capable of using the meta-exchange to complain well enough of sophistry (if one of the speakers is resorting to such low, an art).
 
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Coriolis

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I've been ambushed by evangelical Christian types a few times now -- at work, where I can't just walk away or order them to leave, as it's not my property. It's a museum. The Mennonites and Orthodox Jews don't bug me. It's just these folks. How do you guys deal with it??? :mad:
Much of this depends on the policies and expectations in your workplace. In mine, for example, any sort of religious imposition is not allowed, though it is OK for employees to discuss religion informally and voluntarily at lunch, etc. The circumstances of your job may require that you nod and be polite and nonconfrontational in such situations. Or, you may have the latitude to be more forthright about your wishes not to engage in such a discussion at work. I suggest you ask your supervisor for suggestions. Tell him/her that this has happened a few times, you are not comfortable with how these folks approach you, but you don't want to cause an issue or be disrespectful while representing your museum. If you don't feel you can approach your supervisor about this, then I would stick with telling these evangelical types that you appreciate their concern/interest in you/willingness to share/etc. but you don't discuss religion at work. Period. And stick to it. Anything else can easily escalate into an argument, or suck you in to going around in circles with them in a frustrating way, which may become a distraction to whatever else you are trying to do at work.
 

Yuurei

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Why can you not tell them to leave you alone? The building my be private property but you aren't.

I used to just tell them " I'm at work right now, I don't time for this."
 

SurrealisticSlumbers

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Why can you not tell them to leave you alone? The building my be private property but you aren't.

I used to just tell them " I'm at work right now, I don't time for this."

That is an excellent question. In my latest encounter, I tried to do just that. I was polite about it, because they'd paid admission and I wasn't trying to be rude to a paying visitor who would just turn around and write a nasty review on TripAdvisor. It's actually almost comical the way things unfolded.

This preacher-man comes in with his wife, pays admission, and then I inform them that if they have any questions about anything, just to let me know and I'd do my best to answer them. So the guy goes: "Yes, I have a question." *I nod, waiting.* "What's the way to the Kingdom of Heaven?" Now, he said this with a grin on his face, so I sort of laughed, thinking it was a joke. Then, I realized he was still standing there waiting for a response... Oh shit, he's actually serious. "I'll let you think about that" he said as he walked towards the gallery. Of course, I've dealt with my fair share of kooks, religious or otherwise, so I just kind of rolled my eyes. Then when he inevitably came back into the lobby with his wife, he was at it again. When he re-asked the same question as before, I just told him I couldn't answer questions like that. Naturally, I still got an earful (while his wife was in the restroom - he seemed to pipe down when she came out). I suppose I should be glad he didn't try to put his hands on me in prayer, like one couple did just two summers ago.

I don't tell my boss when stuff like this happens because I feel it's inconsequential, though undoubtedly annoying in the moment. Thing is, it's such a small museum that I'm the only one who works there, so am totally alone on most days. Puts me in a vulnerable position. We have a board of directors who all volunteer, and that's it...My boss (board president) is an atheist and also a Democrat, and I remember on one occasion he became hostile (verbally) towards this old white dude who came in and insulted Obama. LOL. I'm a big girl and can handle this stuff without losing my cool. A big part of it is that it hits a little too close to home. I spent my high school years in an extremely fundamentalist environment where we were taught in science class that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, and that people with tattoos were "not right with the Lord." A guy from Answers in Genesis (the same people who put on the Creation Museum) even came to the school and told us that dinosaurs still exist in remote parts of Earth... :dry:
 

Coriolis

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This preacher-man comes in with his wife, pays admission, and then I inform them that if they have any questions about anything, just to let me know and I'd do my best to answer them. So the guy goes: "Yes, I have a question." *I nod, waiting.* "What's the way to the Kingdom of Heaven?" Now, he said this with a grin on his face, so I sort of laughed, thinking it was a joke. Then, I realized he was still standing there waiting for a response... Oh shit, he's actually serious. "I'll let you think about that" he said as he walked towards the gallery. Of course, I've dealt with my fair share of kooks, religious or otherwise, so I just kind of rolled my eyes. Then when he inevitably came back into the lobby with his wife, he was at it again. When he re-asked the same question as before, I just told him I couldn't answer questions like that. Naturally, I still got an earful (while his wife was in the restroom - he seemed to pipe down when she came out). I suppose I should be glad he didn't try to put his hands on me in prayer, like one couple did just two summers ago.

I don't tell my boss when stuff like this happens because I feel it's inconsequential, though undoubtedly annoying in the moment. Thing is, it's such a small museum that I'm the only one who works there, so am totally alone on most days. Puts me in a vulnerable position. We have a board of directors who all volunteer, and that's it...My boss (board president) is an atheist and also a Democrat, and I remember on one occasion he became hostile (verbally) towards this old white dude who came in and insulted Obama. LOL. I'm a big girl and can handle this stuff without losing my cool.:dry:
It sounds like your boss would be sympathetic to any reasonable approach you might take. I would focus then on trying to short-circuit such a conversation as quickly as possible. Taking people literally can help. For instance, if someone asked me in this context "what's the way to the kingdom of heaven" I would say, "I'm afraid I can't help you there" and steer him back to the subject of the museum. When he returned and pressed you on it and started up his spiel, I would firmly cut him off with something like, "I can see that this topic is important to you, but I don't discuss religion at work/with people I don't know/[whatever noncommittal reason you have]". Be firm, stick to it, if necessary turn away and occupy yourself with something that looks like work (check computer, count pamphlets in display, etc.) Any parting shots of "you should be more mindful of your soul", etc. or even "I will pray for you" should be met simply with "have a nice day".

Bottom line: you cannot give these folks so much as an inch. It is a slippery slope. Don't say anything about what you believe, or they believe. Just say no, and keep saying it.
 

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The problem with telling them to go away is that it is poor customer service. The museum may rely on support from patrons; whether or not you may believe that their offense is warranted, lost revenue is lost revenue. All employees have a fiduciary duty to ensure that their employer does not lose money, and any revenue losses experienced by your employer can potentially impact the museum's payroll.

If the proselytizers aren't physically keeping you from performing your duties, then the only problem is that you are offended, which is something that you have the power to fix.

However, if the museum does not charge an admission fee, which means that the proselytizers have access to you free of charge, then you should definitely feel free to tell them to leave. If the museum is public property, then maybe your employer can be persuaded to designate a free speech space on the property where they have to stay if they want to proselytize.
 

ChocolateMoose123

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I've been ambushed by evangelical Christian types a few times now -- at work, where I can't just walk away or order them to leave, as it's not my property. It's a museum. The Mennonites and Orthodox Jews don't bug me. It's just these folks. How do you guys deal with it??? :mad:

When I was in serving and bartending, this happens often. To make the matter worse, I couldn't just tell them to leave, as my money was tied into not offending them. It kind of taught me to work around uncomfortable conversations and play with turning it around. (Religious conversation was NOT the worst type of conversations to be stuck in...try hearing about someone's sexual proclivities when they think you must agree that it's an interesting story and not gross...)

Anyway, I found just saying. "I'm already a believer" (even if I didn't share their particular faith) shut them down right away. Because they want to convert so if you're already "converted" ....voila. No more conversation. Most just went, "oh (surprise) okay" and then I would ask (quickly) a follow up question that would take it way off the subject "Are you from here?" etc.

Part of customer service is working with conversations that are unpleasant and figuring out a way to make it pleasant FOR YOU while still making THEM feel welcome.

If you don't want to go that route, I would just politely excuse myself and try to avoid them. Or just say, "I appreciate your desire to share your beliefs with me however, I do not share those beliefs and I have decided this after much thought. I am not interested in answering any more questions on that topic. I can, however, answer any questions you have about this museum."
 

Lord Lavender

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Troll them to death with devils advocate questions like what if God is x or what if we could see x as y not z and so on.
 

Ursa

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Part of customer service is working with conversations that are unpleasant and figuring out a way to make it pleasant FOR YOU while still making THEM feel welcome.

This is dead-center. It's also why I think that everyone should have to work at least three years in a customer service position. You don't know what it means to have people skills until you are mandated to be as nice as possible to others, smile no matter what happens, not tell anyone they are incorrect even when they are and make them want to rave about how positive the experience was to others. I once had a boss chew me out because she could tell that she "couldn't hear my smile over the phone." But it works, and everyone should learn it.
 

Lark

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To be honest I think most people who seek to win converts to their thinking, whatever that may be, are usually overcompensating for their private doubts, if you can its a better idea to see if you can understand them and be of some help to them than dismiss them.

Then again that's not easy, its not something everyone can be expected to do, I'm not even sure it should be an expected to do.

I dont think talking about murdering people because they are a bit of nuisance to you is that funny to be honest, maybe those sort of jokes were a feature in the build up to the holocaust in Germany.

- - - Updated - - -

Troll them to death with devils advocate questions like what if God is x or what if we could see x as y not z and so on.

Aint no body got time for that.
 

StrawberryBoots

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To be honest I think most people who seek to win converts to their thinking, whatever that may be, are usually overcompensating for their private doubts, if you can its a better idea to see if you can understand them and be of some help to them than dismiss them.

Then again that's not easy, its not something everyone can be expected to do, I'm not even sure it should be an expected to do.

I dont think talking about murdering people because they are a bit of nuisance to you is that funny to be honest, maybe those sort of jokes were a feature in the build up to the holocaust in Germany.

- - - Updated - - -



Aint no body got time for that.

Why so cynical? This is a case of mind over matter. It's not unusual for friendly humans to talk to each other about all sorts of topics they're passionate about when they're out and about. The man discussed in the OP is a preacher, so naturally he's going to talk about God. The happy preacher may feel the Holy Spirit and enjoys sharing his beliefs with people. As long as the message isn't hellfire and brimstone, I don't see the problem with it. We don't have to agree with our fellow man to appreciate them. There's nothing wrong with being cordial and admiring the man's individuality.
 

Lark

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Why so cynical? This is a case of mind over matter. It's not unusual for friendly humans to talk to each other about all sorts of topics they're passionate about when they're out and about. The man discussed in the OP is a preacher, so naturally he's going to talk about God. The happy preacher may feel the Holy Spirit and enjoys sharing his beliefs with people. As long as the message isn't hellfire and brimstone, I don't see the problem with it. We don't have to agree with our fellow man to appreciate them. There's nothing wrong with being cordial and admiring the man's individuality.

Why do you attribute cynicism to me?
 

ceecee

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I've been ambushed by evangelical Christian types a few times now -- at work, where I can't just walk away or order them to leave, as it's not my property. It's a museum. The Mennonites and Orthodox Jews don't bug me. It's just these folks. How do you guys deal with it??? :mad:

This is tough but I see it like this - the second they cross over into unwanted proselytizing, make it clear you're not interested. Be polite, until it's time to not be polite. It makes no difference that it's a museum - if there is harassment, call the police.
 

StrawberryBoots

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This is tough but I see it like this - the second they cross over into unwanted proselytizing, make it clear you're not interested. Be polite, until it's time to not be polite. It makes no difference that it's a museum - if there is harassment, call the police.

Tough? Is unwanted proselytizing tough for TJs? I doubt it.
[MENTION=31569]SurrealisticSlumbers[/MENTION], This isn't tough. Don't waste your time crying wolf. Bring on the Mormons and the Jahova's Witness, I'm not afraid. I have your back.
 

SurrealisticSlumbers

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Tough? Is unwanted proselytizing tough for TJs? I doubt it.

[MENTION=31569]SurrealisticSlumbers[/MENTION], This isn't tough. Don't waste your time crying wolf. Bring on the Mormons and the Jahova's Witness, I'm not afraid. I have your back.

Haha, thanks. I know a couple cops in my area and if there was any real harassment or physical threat, I wouldn't be hesitant to pick up the phone... these people weren't a real threat, obviously. Just nuisances. Even though I'm an introvert, I try to make people feel welcome here. The town relies on tourism. Sadly, there's a small percentage of people who will take advantage of friendliness and hospitality.

One of you said "this doesn't happen in my country." Well, consider yourself fortunate, because the U.S. is a hotbed for these types of belief systems. And they feel emboldened and entitled to behave in this manner - we do have freedom of speech in this country, for better or for worse.

And to the guy above, yes, it's usually about fire and brimstone with these folks. Once bitten, twice shy.
 
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