What do we live or die FOR?

[Chrysanthe]

I live for the amount of effort and distress it would take me to die, or in Typological terms, I live because I'm a 9w1 and that's just how it's been, me drifting along the wind currents like a Jellyfish... er... a winged jellyfish. (wouldn't wanna be an actual jellyfish because water is mysterious and scary and makes me feel claustrophobic.)

There's nothing I'd die for with a strong sense of honor, because I don't attach myself to anything. But I could die for anyone given that they their life has more purpose and opportunity (to enjoy their own life and/or positively influence others' wellbeing) than my own.

 

[Hawthorne]

Good point [MENTION=22071]Hitoshi-San[/MENTION]! I know many who fit this bill also.

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Do you say "at present" to leave open the possibility [MENTION=23915]Sinclair[/MENTION]?

cant see the future.

 

[Mole]

Our Intelligence Service tells us there are a considerable number who are presently planning to die for Allah, and take many of us with them.

This is hard to believe in a secular society based on enjoying life.

It is hard for a life enhancing society to understand a culture of death.

But they tell us to our faces, we love death, as you love life.

 

[Galaxy Gazer]

1st [MENTION=26919]EliaBlack[/MENTION] I am sorry for the current feeling of absence. The way you describe it sounds crushing and I am sorry for the experience. It means much to me that I am not the only one having thoughts on the topic.

May I ask, do you mean then that you have found the earlier pursuits of dominant/submissive relationships and hierarchy to be ultimately lacking in providing purpose?

Aw thanks I'm glad someone understands. I'm not usually this mopey, but you know, even heartless creatures of hell have bad days.

I wouldn't say those relationships weren't lacking in purpose. They were great for the majority of the time I was in them. The problem is that one-sided admiration always turns into something bad. When you devote your life to someone, they eventually start to take you for granted. I know I'm getting way too personal here, but after the fourth time it happened, I knew I was doing something wrong. I'd rather have nothing to live for, than live for someone who doesn't value me at all.

I thought about getting into some religion or spirituality and I even thought about joining the SCA, but it's just not me. I'm not the type to join a system/organization that people spend their whole lives devoting themselves to. I need to be the most devoted

 

[ceecee]

Sounds balanced [MENTION=4050]ceecee[/MENTION]

Interesting how many people mention dying for their family!

When my youngest son was born, he was a preemie and they wanted to run some tests on him. I was walking down the hall slowly as I wasn't feeling great and I saw someone taking him out in his little bassinet. I was instantly there, grabbing my baby and I said - Who are you and were are you taking my child, you have exactly one second to answer me. They never told me anyone was taking him at that time and they never told me where he was going. Overreacting? Perhaps. You don't fuck with mama and babies in the animal world, why do people assume they are any different?

 

[Cloudpatrol]

I live for the amount of effort and distress it would take me to die, or in Typological terms, I live because I'm a 9w1 and that's just how it's been, me drifting along the wind currents like a Jellyfish... er... a winged jellyfish. (wouldn't wanna be an actual jellyfish because water is mysterious and scary and makes me feel claustrophobic.)

There's nothing I'd die for with a strong sense of honor, because I don't attach myself to anything. But I could die for anyone given that they their life has more purpose and opportunity (to enjoy their own life and/or positively influence others' wellbeing) than my own.

I can relate to what you said about water [MENTION=25366]Chrysanthe[/MENTION] even though I LOVE water and swimming. I recently was going to place ashes in the ocean and could not bring myself to do it. Even though I rationally do not believe the ashes are anything more than a physical representation of what the person once WAS, the murky depths seemed cold (impersonal) and cruel. I was surprised because I love the ocean, but it was a 'visceral' reaction.

I found the second part of what you wrote captivatingly intriguing.

 

[Cloudpatrol]

Aw thanks I'm glad someone understands. I'm not usually this mopey, but you know, even heartless creatures of hell have bad days.

I wouldn't say those relationships weren't lacking in purpose. They were great for the majority of the time I was in them. The problem is that one-sided admiration always turns into something bad. When you devote your life to someone, they eventually start to take you for granted. I know I'm getting way too personal here, but after the fourth time it happened, I knew I was doing something wrong. I'd rather have nothing to live for, than live for someone who doesn't value me at all.

I thought about getting into some religion or spirituality and I even thought about joining the SCA, but it's just not me. I'm not the type to join a system/organization that people spend their whole lives devoting themselves to. I need to be the most devoted

Kudos for coming to the realizations and for valuing yourself. It's true, we all need to be allowed 'mopey' days!

I had to google what the SCA is It sounds like you have self-knowledge. With that alone, you are more equipped than many...

 

[Cloudpatrol]

When my youngest son was born, he was a preemie and they wanted to run some tests on him. I was walking down the hall slowly as I wasn't feeling great and I saw someone taking him out in his little bassinet. I was instantly there, grabbing my baby and I said - Who are you and were are you taking my child, you have exactly one second to answer me. They never told me anyone was taking him at that time and they never told me where he was going. Overreacting? Perhaps. You don't fuck with mama and babies in the animal world, why do people assume they are any different?

Smashing point [MENTION=4050]ceecee[/MENTION] Mama bears (human ) are fiercely beautiful creatures and that is integral to our nature. I suppose it is why we collectively respond strongly when that natural affection and protectiveness are missing in cases of crimes committed against children by parents.

 

[Cloudpatrol]

Our Intelligence Service tells us there are a considerable number who are presently planning to die for Allah, and take many of us with them.

This is hard to believe in a secular society based on enjoying life.

It is hard for a life enhancing society to understand a culture of death.

But they tell us to our faces, we love death, as you love life.

It is always most difficult to understand the things most opposite to us [MENTION=3325]Mole[/MENTION]. It was difficult for people to comprehend Kamikaze pilots in World War II and neither of the cultural influences we refer to are the first to introduce the idea of dying for a "cause" or even as you allude to - killing for one.

 

[OptoGypsy]

The slaves lives to live, for primitive reasons, reproduce and sustain your genes. The person that has truly experienced life lives by the rebellious motif of why should I live transitioning themselves from the position of a slave into a master rather by the romanticism movement, the rebellion of the Karamazov or revolution through the vulgar means of history. Greek Mythology is the greatest source to becoming self aware and in my opinion the message of Christ is what sustains my existence. People may find it elsewhere such as the sciences.

The best route may be to EAT YOUR HEART, it is just another unnecessary organ and I've heard that it is great with tea, the brain is also a sizable meal.

 

[Cloudpatrol]

The slaves lives to live, for primitive reasons, reproduce and sustain your genes. The person that has truly experienced life lives by the rebellious motif of why should I live transitioning themselves from the position of a slave into a master rather by the romanticism movement, the rebellion of the Karamazov or revolution through the vulgar means of history. Greek Mythology is the greatest source to becoming self aware and in my opinion the message of Christ is what sustains my existence. People may find it elsewhere such as the sciences.

The best route may be to EAT YOUR HEART, it is just another unnecessary organ and I've heard that it is great with tea, the brain is also a sizable meal.

I am absorbing your message [MENTION=20474]OptoGypsy[/MENTION]. Do you enjoy Aesop's tales? I had always heard brain just tastes offal.

 

[OptoGypsy]

I am absorbing your message [MENTION=20474]OptoGypsy[/MENTION]. Do you enjoy Aesop's tales? I had always heard brain just tastes offal.

I read the fables as a child. Different people have different taste buds although I heard that impoverished children are delicious in a a suffering economy... Hannibal Lector seems to like it although he is a cheat since he has yet to gain the scrotum to eat his own...

 

[Cellmold]

Still looking.

Maybe that is a reason in itself.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

I don't think I could say what I would die for unless put under circumstances bad enough I had to make that choice.

I think if anyone is at that point, it is fairly easy to determine as it's at a point of desperation. Things go from gray to black and white quickly at that point.

What I live for? Everything. Laughing. Friends. Fun. Beauty. Wonder. All those moments.

 

[Mole]

It is always most difficult to understand the things most opposite to us [MENTION=3325]Mole[/MENTION]. It was difficult for people to comprehend Kamikaze pilots in World War II and neither of the cultural influences we refer to are the first to introduce the idea of dying for a "cause" or even as you allude to - killing for one.

The striking thing is the cognitive dissonance between those who love life and those who form a death cult.

Cognitive dissonance is difficult to understand and even difficult to approach, because cognitive dissonance is emotionally painful, so everything tells us to avoid cognitive dissonance.

But learning is based on cognitive dissonance, so to pursue our education beyond school, we need to become familiar with cognitive dissonance.

We have the opportunity here to explore the cognitive dissonance between astrology and astronomy, between mbti and psychometrics. But be warned: it will be painful.

 

[Lark]

Relationships.

In a vague abstract why or if I had to take a punt at labelling it with some ideological reference I'd have to say Christian humanism as I understand it or socialism, in the main I just hate evil.

 

[1487610420]

the good stuff

 

[Grand Admiral Crunch]

We don't always know what we live or die for. In a sense, through my transformation, I have already died. It was my choice, but I did not understand it, much like Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden.

 

[Kullervo]

The slaves lives to live, for primitive reasons, reproduce and sustain your genes. The person that has truly experienced life lives by the rebellious motif of why should I live transitioning themselves from the position of a slave into a master rather by the romanticism movement, the rebellion of the Karamazov or revolution through the vulgar means of history. Greek Mythology is the greatest source to becoming self aware and in my opinion the message of Christ is what sustains my existence. People may find it elsewhere such as the sciences.

The best route may be to EAT YOUR HEART, it is just another unnecessary organ and I've heard that it is great with tea, the brain is also a sizable meal.

To think that I could've turned out a wiser man if I'd just read the Bible and a bit more poetry! Life can be so simple sometimes.

Many of the "masters" you speak of have unwittingly entered a different form of servitude: a contempt for one's most basic instincts and needs. Old eunuchs like to forget that if we don't reproduce, we die out.

 

[OptoGypsy]

To think that I could've turned out a wiser man if I'd just read the Bible and a bit more poetry! Life can be so simple sometimes.

Many of the "masters" you speak of have unwittingly entered a different form of servitude: a contempt for one's most basic instincts and needs. Old eunuchs like to forget that if we don't reproduce, we die out.

The eunuchs are especially not masters they are slaves to religiosity in the same way as the Sanhedrin of the NT, yet their existence is important in small numbers for several communities, it is important to remember the scene of the wedding at Cana

To quote myself from other threads of the time I also posted that response...

" that is the type that is stupid enough to believe in change through reformation or revolution without realizing that we live in an eternal cycle under the cosmos. They're idiots under the illusion and self deception of freedom. I too am a fool as I'm a slave that is conscious of his power and chains there is two different ways to view this you are either the slave to a God/Satan relationship or to the Cosmos. Murder is cool, especially if you do it yourself. If it helps I prefer the God/Devil combo because it makes blasphemy/heresy more personal, I love being an ego in an imaginary reality created by my mind. Prometheus > Sisyphus and most definitely greater than Dionysian with his Nietzsche whose work makes the Unabomber look like an intelligent logician. In all seriousness it's because it is the most rational system portrayed in all of its glory by its Russian thinkers"

"Rebellion and revolution lead to murder and the cycle once again continues with the collapse and the birth of the new regime, just ask SPARTACUS or the Russians, etc. Freedom is an illusion and anyone that thinks otherwise is self deceptive or mad. MASS SUICIDE SADES STYLE THE ONE THAT SURVIVES IS THE UNIQUE AND FREE!!! "