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Prophecy In Christianity: Related to Ni?

Usehername

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I remember reading way back when I was first devouring the internet of everything related to MBTI that NJ (Ni) is the "pastor trait" and that the prophets were all Ni dominant or secondary.

Sometimes I really feel like I know stuff. And I've observed I'm right far more than most (if not all) of my Christian friends when they voice things. But then again, I have so many theories, ideas, and "movies" playing in my head 24/7 perhaps it's just that I had more possible things to claim that I "already knew".

Any links related to the subject (or just modern day prophesying in general, I know it's controversial if it even exists in the Christian community) are much appreciated.
 

targobelle

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I really don't think that God looks at your MBTI and decides whether or not you can know things. I don't think it works that way. No not at all. I am Ne dominant and well I have been given a word or 2 of truth in the past. God looks for who is open who is receptive and who is the best person to give the message. MBTI I don't think really plays into this. Especially if you consider that many people develop differnt MBTI traits as they age.
 

SolitaryWalker

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I remember reading way back when I was first devouring the internet of everything related to MBTI that NJ (Ni) is the "pastor trait" and that the prophets were all Ni dominant or secondary.

Sometimes I really feel like I know stuff. And I've observed I'm right far more than most (if not all) of my Christian friends when they voice things. But then again, I have so many theories, ideas, and "movies" playing in my head 24/7 perhaps it's just that I had more possible things to claim that I "already knew".

Any links related to the subject (or just modern day prophesying in general, I know it's controversial if it even exists in the Christian community) are much appreciated.

Introverted Intuition is the function most likely of all to accurately predict the future because it is most closely in tune with the abstract perceptions. It can lead us to unconsciously discern patterns in the environment we observe and by virtue of this endow us with notions of how they may unravel in the future.

Almost all prophets operated on Introverted Intuition, many were dominant Introverted Intuitors.

Incidentally, we have the following,

Jesus (INFJ)
Muhammad(ENTJ)
Buddha(INFJ)


Contemporary prophets were also dominant introverted Intuitiors. Dostoevksy(INFJ), Nietzsche (INTJ), Lenin (ENFJ), Napoleon (ENTJ), Jean-Paul-Sartre(INTJ).

It is with the perceiving functions we access our environment directly, for this reason Introverted Intuitors are best at speculating about what our environment may be like. And Extroverted Intuitors best at applying their visions to the external environment. Representatives of the latter could be characterized by the following: Leo Tolstoy (ENFP), Bill Clinton (ENFP), Bertrand Russell(ENTP), de Voltaire (ENTP), Denis Diderot (ENTP), Machiavelli (ENTP), and David Hume (ENTP).
 

Usehername

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I really don't think that God looks at your MBTI and decides whether or not you can know things. I don't think it works that way. No not at all. I am Ne dominant and well I have been given a word or 2 of truth in the past. God looks for who is open who is receptive and who is the best person to give the message. MBTI I don't think really plays into this. Especially if you consider that many people develop differnt MBTI traits as they age.

I didn't explain my 1st post as well as I should have. I definitely have personally experienced all sorts of MBTI types voice things God has told them. Even lots of S types.
I was wondering if it was related to how Ni functions, is all. That could mean that a lot of Ni dominant Christians never "hear" from God this way, and also Ni-barely-used people could be prophets. I was just looking for a correlation between Ni and prophecy b/c I read about it somewhere. More of a correlation in the sense of how it comes to be known.

The stuff I wonder if it's prophecy about for me, is really long-term statistically improbable things that have started to come true. I have more than a few of those. More like I watched a story unfold in my head and it's bugging me b/c it looks like it has the potential to come true, regardless of how improbable it is.
Some of it already has. But it's like 1/100 chance x 1/100 chance... I'm not very far along with things yet. (Some are age/life-stage related.) So I can't see how this pans out for a while.
 

SolitaryWalker

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I really don't think that God looks at your MBTI and decides whether or not you can know things. I don't think it works that way. No not at all. I am Ne dominant and well I have been given a word or 2 of truth in the past. God looks for who is open who is receptive and who is the best person to give the message. MBTI I don't think really plays into this. Especially if you consider that many people develop differnt MBTI traits as they age.

Is God a person?
 

Totenkindly

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Moses came off to me as an ESTJ in some ways (he's definitely a T, not an F), if I had to consider him. And he's considered one of the greatest "prophets" -- although I think in function and behavior he was much different than the ones we normally think of as prophets, like Elijah or Isaiah or John the Baptist.

I didn't explain my 1st post as well as I should have. I definitely have personally experienced all sorts of MBTI types voice things God has told them. Even lots of S types.
I was wondering if it was related to how Ni functions, is all. That could mean that a lot of Ni dominant Christians never "hear" from God this way, and also Ni-barely-used people could be prophets. I was just looking for a correlation between Ni and prophecy b/c I read about it somewhere. More of a correlation in the sense of how it comes to be known.

I agree with that. I see Ni style people (like John Lennon, for example) expressing themselves similar to the old-style prophets, even if it's not the Christian God they refer to. It seems to me to simply be the way that things are received and how they're expressed, not whether God is really speaking to them or not, that has that sort of mystical flavor.

Is God a person?

Would you like to send him a Christmas card?
 

Nocapszy

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I always figured these prophets got a hold of some bad mushrooms, or mescaline or some kind of hallucinogen. Either that or they had cancer or any number of other medical explanations for their 'experiencing' god. Hallucinations seems the most likely fit. I don't know about it being Ni, though I've heard it on more than one occasion being compared with hallucinogens.

Perhaps god intends us to hallucinate so that we can see 'him' or it -- whatever god is. Remember the difference between delusion and hallucination. I've chosen my words carefully.
 

wildcat

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I remember reading way back when I was first devouring the internet of everything related to MBTI that NJ (Ni) is the "pastor trait" and that the prophets were all Ni dominant or secondary.

Sometimes I really feel like I know stuff. And I've observed I'm right far more than most (if not all) of my Christian friends when they voice things. But then again, I have so many theories, ideas, and "movies" playing in my head 24/7 perhaps it's just that I had more possible things to claim that I "already knew".

Any links related to the subject (or just modern day prophesying in general, I know it's controversial if it even exists in the Christian community) are much appreciated.
Fairy tales are for conception only.
 

Totenkindly

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I always figured these prophets got a hold of some bad mushrooms, or mescaline or some kind of hallucinogen. Either that or they had cancer or any number of other medical explanations for their 'experiencing' god. Hallucinations seems the most likely fit. I don't know about it being Ni, though I've heard it on more than one occasion being compared with hallucinogens.

It sounds to me as if you are considering "prophecy" to be "visions of God" or some sort of "experience." In general, the prophetic gift is not considered to be that; it's more of an inner conviction about what is happening, coupled with the expression of the conviction. It was a judgment leveled upon Israel, and if they continued in the wrong path, here was what would happen to them... and if they changed their ways, then a different outcome was offered. So in many ways the prophets did not seem "mystical" as much as precautionary.

For example, Jeremiah was not constantly undergoing crazy experiences. He was perceiving the nation of Israel as having a moral failing and he was performing painful/long-term object lessons with his life in order to get across the severity of what Israel was doing and where it would end up. The behavior seems more like that of a suffering performance artist (who pulls back the veil over people's eyes by the shock of his message) than any actual hallucinogenic perception of reality.

And some of the others fell into the same category. The only relevant experiences your remarks seem to address are the visions (such as when Paul talks about himself being caught up in the "seventh heaven" or something similar).
 

Carebear

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And some of the others fell into the same category. The only relevant experiences your remarks seem to address are the visions (such as when Paul talks about himself being caught up in the "seventh heaven" or something similar).

And some of the visions (like Revelation) seem more like metaphor etc than actually visions as such, which would have been understood by the target audience.
 

Totenkindly

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And some of the visions (like Revelation) seem more like metaphor etc than actually visions as such, which would have been understood by the target audience.

No, Revelation was definitely a drug trip. ;)
 

Carebear

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No, Revelation was definitely a drug trip. ;)

LOL!

(I was referring to the "covert criticism of the Roman Empire w. the number of the beast being Nero/Caligula/Domitian"-interpretation, but even if that's correct I still see how it would have been impossible without drugs.)
 

Totenkindly

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(I was referring to the "covert criticism of the Roman Empire w. the number of the beast being Nero/Caligula/Domitian"-interpretation, but even if that's correct I still see how it would have been impossible without drugs.)

I'm not even sure what to make of it. From what I just read recently, it fits a lot of apocalyptic literature of the day and age, where Jesus suddenly returns as an avenger and conquerer.

I need to do more reading. It's interesting to look at Christian scripture as an evolving document, and how the surrounding culture at the time impacted what was written and incorporated.
 

Carebear

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I'm not even sure what to make of it. From what I just read recently, it fits a lot of apocalyptic literature of the day and age, where Jesus suddenly returns as an avenger and conquerer.

Yes, that'd fit the "criticism against Roman empire" interpretation rather well, I think. The Palm Sunday story seems to describe the same expectations of Jesus.

I need to do more reading. It's interesting to look at Christian scripture as an evolving document, and how the surrounding culture at the time impacted what was written and incorporated.


Yes! I love that approach, and am a bit ashamed I haven't come around to reading as much on it as I planned. If my goal is to objectively investigate Christianity from the outside, I really should read much more on the subject. (And I know several historians and Christian scholars have done a lot in this field, so I really have no good excuses.) If you come across any good books on the subject I'd love to know.
 

Totenkindly

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Yes! I love that approach, and am a bit ashamed I haven't come around to reading as much on it as I planned. If my goal is to objectively investigate Christianity from the outside, I really should read much more on the subject. (And I know several historians and Christian scholars have done a lot in this field, so I really have no good excuses.) If you come across any good books on the subject I'd love to know.

Well, I just finished "The Birth of Satan" -- an excellent book, because the author took great pains to specify what they could and could not say. (I.e., "We're not saying this is WHAT happened, but this is how it could be perceived and what might be probable."

They reviewed the evolution of YHWH, Satan, hell, and heaven from the OT to the NT. Christians tend to view the entire Bible as one cohesive book, but it can also be viewed as it evolved historically, and you can see changes in the concepts of these things, as influenced by culture, if you read the Bible chronologically and look for the pattern. It removes some of the inconsistencies that Christians have to dance around today.

(For example, if God is omnipotent and in control of everything, how do we justify the occurrence of bad things? It must be God's fault. The only reasoning we can come up with is, "Well, it must all be for a good reason," but that still leaves God with "allowing evil" and being ultimately responsible for it. So we then blame Satan for those things.)

Sorry, tangent. My bad. I will stop now.
 

Usehername

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Well, I just finished "The Birth of Satan" -- an excellent book, because the author took great pains to specify what they could and could not say. (I.e., "We're not saying this is WHAT happened, but this is how it could be perceived and what might be probable."

They reviewed the evolution of YHWH, Satan, hell, and heaven from the OT to the NT. Christians tend to view the entire Bible as one cohesive book, but it can also be viewed as it evolved historically, and you can see changes in the concepts of these things, as influenced by culture, if you read the Bible chronologically and look for the pattern. It removes some of the inconsistencies that Christians have to dance around today.

(For example, if God is omnipotent and in control of everything, how do we justify the occurrence of bad things? It must be God's fault. The only reasoning we can come up with is, "Well, it must all be for a good reason," but that still leaves God with "allowing evil" and being ultimately responsible for it. So we then blame Satan for those things.)

Sorry, tangent. My bad. I will stop now.

No, please keep the tangents up. Especially book recommendations. I really like how, for instance, Chomsky is able to so succinctly put down on paper, "this is what we know for sure, this is what people are assuming because of x, y, and z, and this is our best guess based off of this evidence. but it could also be a, b, c.".

It's hard to find that style of information in Christian books. I'm no theologist. I want someone else to do the work for me so I can springboard off into my own direction :)
 

Carebear

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Well, I just finished "The Birth of Satan" -- an excellent book, because the author took great pains to specify what they could and could not say. (I.e., "We're not saying this is WHAT happened, but this is how it could be perceived and what might be probable."

They reviewed the evolution of YHWH, Satan, hell, and heaven from the OT to the NT. Christians tend to view the entire Bible as one cohesive book, but it can also be viewed as it evolved historically, and you can see changes in the concepts of these things, as influenced by culture, if you read the Bible chronologically and look for the pattern. It removes some of the inconsistencies that Christians have to dance around today.

(For example, if God is omnipotent and in control of everything, how do we justify the occurrence of bad things? It must be God's fault. The only reasoning we can come up with is, "Well, it must all be for a good reason," but that still leaves God with "allowing evil" and being ultimately responsible for it. So we then blame Satan for those things.)

Sorry, tangent. My bad. I will stop now.

I agree with Usehername. Tangents != Fluff. Tangents = Potential for evolution.

I will definitely look for TheBoS. It's exactly that kind of approach I'm looking for. Having studied history, I've come to see how history itself is evolving and constantly has to be reviewed, because history never only describes, but also has an agenda and interprets according to the current world view.
If we approach the Bible as a collection of historical sources instead of "God's Inerrant Words To Mankind", it no longer matters how many inconsistencies and contradictions they contain, because it's only to be expected that different historians/traditions would have differed on exactly what happened. Everything we know about e.g. antiquity is based on far more inconsistent sources than the ones we find in the Bible. The important thing is trying to figure out why they wrote what they wrote, which biases they held, what can be verified by contemporary sources and so on.

Usehername said:
I didn't explain my 1st post as well as I should have. I definitely have personally experienced all sorts of MBTI types voice things God has told them. Even lots of S types.

Same here. Especially lots of S types. XSTJ's, ESFJs and quite a few ESXPs, but I've heard most types voice messages from God. It's impressive how God always seems to tell people what they'd prefer to hear, and I've for instance never ever heard him tell an XSTJ not to worry (Matt 6:25-34) or not to judge (Luke 6:37->). So needless to say take the messages from God with a grain of salt.

Usehername said:
I was wondering if it was related to how Ni functions, is all. That could mean that a lot of Ni dominant Christians never "hear" from God this way, and also Ni-barely-used people could be prophets. I was just looking for a correlation between Ni and prophecy b/c I read about it somewhere. More of a correlation in the sense of how it comes to be known.

The way Ni works could easily be experienced as God suddenly making it all clear. Ni seems to be working subconsciously to a large extent and only throws the final answers to the conscious mind (and not the pages upon pages of calculation). Near future prophecies could therefore easily have been results of an active Ni.

Usehername said:
The stuff I wonder if it's prophecy about for me, is really long-term statistically improbable things that have started to come true. I have more than a few of those. More like I watched a story unfold in my head and it's bugging me b/c it looks like it has the potential to come true, regardless of how improbable it is.
Some of it already has. But it's like 1/100 chance x 1/100 chance... I'm not very far along with things yet. (Some are age/life-stage related.) So I can't see how this pans out for a while.

Confirmation bias, strong Ni, the immense amounts of improbable things out there that makes it rather probable that quite a few improbable things will happen to most people, self fulfilling prophecies, God... there are countless explanations if it does indeed happen.
 
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