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MBTI type and belief in god

compulsiverambler

New member
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
446
Enneagram
5w6
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
INFP here. I'm an atheist, but I'm not happy about it.

I think different types will have different reasons for convincing themselves to believe or for not dwelling on certain questions. Extraverted types may like the social element of theistic (or non-theistic, but that's not the topic) religion, NF types may like the assurance that the universe is ultimately a fair place, Js may like the sense of structure and some level of predetermination and certainty or security that most god beliefs entail. (Oh look, those were the first things that came to mind and they just happened to total ENFJ, statistically the most commonly theistic type. :)) There probably are correlations but there are reasons for believing or not believing in gods that have nothing to do with MB type, as well.
 

LEGERdeMAIN

New member
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Messages
2,516
Are NT's usually atheist?
Are NF's usually theists?
Are there any NT's who believe in god?
Are there any NF's who don't believe in god?
I have zero spirituality. Nil. Nada.

I'm not a theist and, as far as I know, I'm an NF. I'm a model agnostic and have been since middle school, before that, I didn't know what I was nor did I care.

I have all kinds of "oneness" with things and people, but I'm not spiritual either.
 

Not_Me

New member
Joined
Jan 16, 2008
Messages
1,641
MBTI Type
INTj
Metaphysically speaking, there's no way to prove the validity of one religion over another. In that sense, my assertion that I am the true religion is as valid as the claims from Buddha, Jesus or The Federal Reserve. Prove me wrong.:)
 

Speed Gavroche

Whisky Old & Women Young
Joined
Oct 20, 2008
Messages
5,152
MBTI Type
EsTP
Enneagram
6w7
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp

ISTP: Select something hardcore, preferably where you get to smite the enemies of God. Extremist Fundamentalist Islam is currently a popular choice
:devil::devil::devil:

That's very accurate, I've always feel fun to integrate Al-Qaida, like some others ESTP too, just because terrorism is fun. A few years ago, I was a borderline extremist fundamentalit muslim, and I know a few ISTPs who're like that.

ESTP: You are hellbound anyway, so don't bother. Just sleep in.

Very accurate too. I remember that I've had a short period of religious integrism when I was 16, and my ESTP best friend have tell to me "Speed, yesterday night I was fucking a chick, I was stand up and she had her face pressed against the ground, screaming "oh yeah, keep to fuck me, fuck me!", THAT is a man, Speed, a man who will go to the Hell, but a man though".

And it was the end of my religous period. :D

Actually, young males xSTPs muslims tend to appreciate especialy the virilious side of that religion. They want to have fun in the present moment (fun including sex, drug, alcohol, and even pig), but believe seriously they'll follow a more strict behavior growing older.


INTJ: Objectivism. Ayn Rand is your gal.

Definitively accurate, every hardcore objectivist I know are INTJ.

By the way, I'm an ISTP and yes, I believe in God.
 

AutumnReverie

New member
Joined
May 6, 2009
Messages
327
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
6w5
Are NT's usually atheist?
Are NF's usually theists?
Are there any NT's who believe in god?
Are there any NF's who don't believe in god?
I know you didn't ask about SJs but...just in case you want to know:

I'm an ISTJ and I'm a Catholic. :)
 

Triglav

Permabanned
Joined
Sep 26, 2009
Messages
79
MBTI Type
INTP
I'm an INTP and a fairly dogmatic and militant atheist. There is absolutely no chance that God exists, because the existance of God is not just an improbability, it is an impossibility. Of course, you can't really be sure of anything, including God, just like you can't be sure that gravity isn't real and magical invisible elves aren't moving matter around, but for all intents and purposes, we assume that gravity exists because the burden of proof should lie on the negative. God is a negative, because it's less likely that God exists than that he does, so it's logical to assume that he does not exist period.

Note that when I talk about God I talk about the generic old white man sitting in the sky hurling thunder at people who masturbate, the possiblity of the deistic God very much exists, but it still more likely that there is no God, only man and nature. I'm very impatient with the average church goer. I'm much more open to arguments for a deistic God than vapid, generic, stories of how "He" has a plan for all of us and all that nonsense, so the reason I'm a militant and dogmatic atheist is I believe religion, organized religion in particular, has done a great deal of harm to the human race and should be ended.
 

Cimarron

IRL is not real
Joined
Aug 21, 2008
Messages
3,417
MBTI Type
ISTJ
Enneagram
5w6
Instinctual Variant
sp/so
For me, my religious beliefs have to be tied to philosophy and "meaning" of life; they are an exploration in those areas. There's not really distinction between religion, spirituality, and philosophy to me.
 

StrappingYoungLad

New member
Joined
Aug 11, 2009
Messages
199
MBTI Type
ISFP
Enneagram
9w8
I believe in future gods. Emerging entities scattered around the universe that grow in strength and eventually reaching states in which their manifestations are perceived as god-like powers. :happy:
 

mockingbird

New member
Joined
Aug 31, 2009
Messages
249
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
9w1
I believe in God. I'm a Christian. I really can't prove my beliefs to anyone through a logical arguement. God is something that one can only prove to oneself. For me, my faith is a gift. That's the best way that I can describe it. I can not give that gift to anyone through a rational arguement. I will just continue to stay true to my faith and grow in the love of Christ. Doing this has continued to make me a stronger and more compassionate person, and I think this is the best arguement for my beliefs. I think it was St Francis who once said, "Go out into all the world and preach the gospel, and if necessary, use words."
 

Prototype

THREADKILLER
Joined
Apr 17, 2008
Messages
855
MBTI Type
Why?
I believe in something, and eventually we will figure out what it is, and what it isn't!
 

Raspo

New member
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Messages
2
I find it hard as an ENFP to look at this amazing universe we live in and NOT draw some type of grand pattern from it. I think some of the most fascinating things being studied right now in Quantum Physics and Consciousness point to some extremely eye-opening religious implications.



Henry Stapp, quantum physicist:
"Scientists other than quantum physicists often fail to comprehend the
enormity of the conceptual change wrought by quantum theory in our basic
conception of the nature of matter...The shift is from a local, reductionistic,
deterministic conception of nature in which consciousness has no logical
place, and can do nothing but passively watch a preprogrammed course of
events, to a nonlocal, nonreductionistic, nondeterministic, concept of nature in
which there is a perfectly natural place for consciousness, a place that allows
each conscious event, conditioned, but not bound, by any known law of
nature
, to grasp a possible large-scale metastable pattern of neuronal activity
in the brain, and convert its status from 'possible' to 'actual'."



Paul Davies and John Gribbon, physicists :
"Quantum physics undermines materialism because it reveals that matter has far less
'substance' than we might believe.
"

"Thus the rigid determinism of Newton's clockwork Universe evaporates, to be
replaced by a world in which the future is open..."

"Today, on the brink of the twenty-first century, we can see that Ryle was right to
dismiss the notion of the ghost in the machine--not because there is no ghost, but
because there is no machine."



Jonathan Shear, philosopher:
"Thus the modern scientific worldview, regarding the universe as material in
nature and unfolding like a machine according to precise, mathematically
articulatable laws gained ascendancy and became the context of much of our
Western intellectual discourse. Nevertheless, the largely forgotten early puzzle
about the role of the mathematics in the physical sciences remained and has
continued to draw the attention of influential physicists. For mathematics
appears to be paradigmatically non-physical. Its objects are characteristically
universal in nature, in sharp contrast to the complete particularity of all
physical entities and empirical observations; it is discovered within the realm
of thought
, not in the physical world; and the truth of its theorems are almost
always evaluated completely mentally, rather than by objective scientific
investigation. Thus as physics becomes progressively more mathematized, its
objects often seem puzzlingly to become more mental than physical
."



John Gribbon, physicist:
"Take the Copenhagen Interpretation literally, and it tells you that an electron wave
collapses to make a point on a detector screen because the entire Universe is looking
at it. This is strange enough; but some cosmologists (among them Stephen Hawking)
worry that it implies that there must actually be something 'outside the Universe' to
look at the Universe as a whole and collapse its overall wave function"



Colin McGinn, philosopher:
"If consciousness is not constitutionally spatial, then how could it have had its
origin in the spatial world? ...The only ingredients in the pot when
consciousness was cooking were particles and fields laid out in space, yet
something radically non-spatial got produced
...We seem compelled to
conclude that something essentially non-spatial emerged from something
purely spatial--that the non-spatial is somehow a construction out of the
spatial. And this looks more like magic than a predictable unfolding of natural
law."




To me, it is clear that consciousness is a fundamental property in this universe and points to an intelligent being/mind outside of the mix responsible for it all. I also believe that there will always be more than enough reason to doubt for those that want/chose to.

Ironically, that strengthens my faith all the more, the fact that there is no single evidential set of proof of God's existence even after ALL THESE YEARS of thought/actions of truly brilliant people to prove one way or the other. In the end, it continues to come down to the open-heart and faith that distinguishes one from the other.

Is it so surprising? After all, Jesus spoke in parables, not just to reveal, but to conceal. I find it totally fitting that Nature does the same.

Faith, to me, is something all together supra-rational.

Raspo
 

tibby

New member
Joined
Nov 22, 2008
Messages
682
MBTI Type
fool
I've seriously no idea. While being highly sceptic... there's also a fuzzier, spiritual, seeking side. The two just kind of... collide. Some days I'm all about "there's a meaning beyond our comprehension" and others am all "just a random coincidence", nothing more to it, period. Most often both at the same time. One thing for sho: am going to be seeking till the day I die, from as many angles as possible, but doubt I'll ever get a definite resolution that would satisfy me, a sort of clear and holistic view that I could be comfortable with.

I guess that makes me agnostic? I wouldn't really be happy with that, though. But for now that's probably the case...
 

Shimmy

New member
Joined
Jun 9, 2009
Messages
1,867
MBTI Type
SEXY

Lol, I skip through the entire NT believe system posted on that site, but currently I'm primarily atheist yes. And I will be until someone at least proposes a sensible god, instead of a 'forgiving', 'angry', 'omnipresent', 'infallible', 'generally human quality' god. It makes no sense that there's a bearded guy up in the sky who controls everything. It also makes no sense that 'nature' has 'mystical powers' that control everything, like wicca proclaims. I'm a bit round up recently by my debate with Peguy in his darwinism vs. intelligent design thread, but it has surely strengthened my already existing believe, that if there is such a thing as a god, we cannot, by definition, define him (In human terms). If we could, he wouldn't be a god, he'd be a law of physics. And I think an organised religion based on a law of physics would be unnecessary, because laws of physics are there, regardless of whether you define them.
 

Moiety

New member
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
5,996
MBTI Type
ISFJ
To me, it is clear that consciousness is a fundamental property in this universe and points to an intelligent being/mind outside of the mix responsible for it all. I also believe that there will always be more than enough reason to doubt for those that want/chose to.

Something separates us from monkeys (well...a lot of things). "Meaning" is a human construct. Why must there be an outside force behind it.

Just look at NF vs ST. The same event will be interpreted differently by people of each temperament. Just because the NFs derive meaning from it doesn't mean the STs will share their opinion.


It's just like Ne paranoia. Just because an NP freaks out and start addressing meaning to things, doesn't mean that he/she is right nor does it mean there is some entity conferring meaning to things. Since the "meaning" in things is all a matter of perception. Sometimes faulty perception.


There is always room for doubt, for sure. But like anything that is unknown to mankind there doesn't have to be a mystical explanation for it. Thunder...oh my, are the gods angry at us? Oh... but now we know that :

"Thunder is the sound made by lightning. Depending on the nature of the lightning and distance of the listener, it can range from a sharp, loud crack to a long, low rumble (brontide). The sudden increase in pressure and temperature from lightning produces rapid expansion of the air surrounding and within a bolt of lightning. In turn, this expansion of air creates a sonic shock wave which produces the sound of thunder."

What does that tells us about the unknown? Or the origin of thunder?
 

BlueScreen

Fail 2.0
Joined
Nov 8, 2008
Messages
2,668
MBTI Type
YMCA
I'm not sure that as an ENFP I can fully believe or not believe in a non-provable construct. I can act like I do, but on a deeper level it will always be in one of those open states where I have reasons to believe either way. Much like aliens, though I believe there is more of a realistic case for them than God.
 
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