Death of conscioousness

[yenom]

I often cointemplate death. what happens after your consciousness experience death? Theortically time is infinite. So when you experience death does time becomes 0? There is also another place in the universe where time is theortically 0. That is in the sigularity and inside a black hole. So is death same as being stuck inside a black hole?

Even when everything ceased to exist, time still exist. So how can time ever be 0?

 

[antireconciler]

Doesn't it kind of repel you? Thinking about death is like hitting your head on something rubbery.

Try this: in order to experience death, you'd have to experience it as an event, but an event is only an event because it has causes and effects. But death can have no causes, for consciousness, because nothing can appear to oneself after death. If you are dead, you are not experiencing anything, because death is the end of consciousness. So death appears as an effect, but one that does not have a reflection in causing anything, and in that sense, it is similar to a black hole, but even a black hole is not, you know, just an ABSOLUTE ending. It's a phenomena with causes and effects. Even a black hole will eventually dissipate.

So you can't experience death as an event because you can't, in a sense, BE on both sides of it. There is simply nothing on the other side. But if that is true, then "death" is not something that can "happen" to you. It cannot be an event for you, so it kind of follows that YOU, as consciousness have no possibility of death happening to you.

So you hear people ask, "what happens when I die?" and you watch carefully, and each and every time, someone will be thinking of themselves as conscious after death. You have to tell them to just back it up a step because, you know, what they've done is they've taken death and made it into something else, namely, something they fear, such as loss of agency. People can fear loss of agency, but no one can actually fear death because death can't happen to anyone. You as a manifested finite existence will perish, yes, because all things in this world come into being and go under giving rise to new forms, sure, but that doesn't mean death can happen to you. It's not there for anyone to contemplate as a kind of barrier or limitation or event because all these things require something to be on the other side of them, but in this case, there is NOTHING on the other side.

As for time still existing when everything ceased to exist, most people will tell you that there is no time without change (and no change if nothing exists). That kind of makes sense to me. Why do you think there is time without change? I mean, it kind of stems from the old "identity of indiscernibles", which is also a common intuition. I mean, if there is no way of distinguishing one time from another time ... aren't they one and the same time?

 

[Feops]

I often cointemplate death. what happens after your consciousness experience death? Theortically time is infinite. So when you experience death does time becomes 0? There is also another place in the universe where time is theortically 0. That is in the sigularity and inside a black hole. So is death same as being stuck inside a black hole?

Even when everything ceased to exist, time still exist. So how can time ever be 0?

The only logical conclusion I've ever come to about consciousness after death is that it will be very much like consciousness before one is born. In both cases it is (or was) in a state of non-existance. Time becomes irrelevent. Things that don't exist don't experience time. I didn't experience time before I was born. A singularity does exist and any theoretical warping of time it accomplishes is a function of time-space.

 

[nanook]

one of the not so fancy near death reports i stumbled upon, lately.

 

[yenom]

Doesn't it kind of repel you? Thinking about death is like hitting your head on something rubbery.

Try this: in order to experience death, you'd have to experience it as an event, but an event is only an event because it has causes and effects. But death can have no causes, for consciousness, because nothing can appear to oneself after death. If you are dead, you are not experiencing anything, because death is the end of consciousness. So death appears as an effect, but one that does not have a reflection in causing anything, and in that sense, it is similar to a black hole, but even a black hole is not, you know, just an ABSOLUTE ending. It's a phenomena with causes and effects. Even a black hole will eventually dissipate.

So you can't experience death as an event because you can't, in a sense, BE on both sides of it. There is simply nothing on the other side. But if that is true, then "death" is not something that can "happen" to you. It cannot be an event for you, so it kind of follows that YOU, as consciousness have no possibility of death happening to you.

So you hear people ask, "what happens when I die?" and you watch carefully, and each and every time, someone will be thinking of themselves as conscious after death. You have to tell them to just back it up a step because, you know, what they've done is they've taken death and made it into something else, namely, something they fear, such as loss of agency. People can fear loss of agency, but no one can actually fear death because death can't happen to anyone. You as a manifested finite existence will perish, yes, because all things in this world come into being and go under giving rise to new forms, sure, but that doesn't mean death can happen to you. It's not there for anyone to contemplate as a kind of barrier or limitation or event because all these things require something to be on the other side of them, but in this case, there is NOTHING on the other side.

As for time still existing when everything ceased to exist, most people will tell you that there is no time without change (and no change if nothing exists). That kind of makes sense to me. Why do you think there is time without change? I mean, it kind of stems from the old "identity of indiscernibles", which is also a common intuition. I mean, if there is no way of distinguishing one time from another time ... aren't they one and the same time?

I can't imagine a reality where time and infinity ceased to exist.
I was watching my grandma die on last friday, and I was really wondering whats going on inside her head as she is approaching death....

As for time is impossible without change, I am not certain. Time is still there even when everything ceased vanish. I doubt time will cease to exist even when all matter vanish in the universe. Just as time and infinity can never be 0, time can never be 0 as long as our brain is functional. When we die, time itself will become 0. I cannot imagine what existance will be like by then.

 

[wildcat]

I often cointemplate death. what happens after your consciousness experience death? Theortically time is infinite. So when you experience death does time becomes 0? There is also another place in the universe where time is theortically 0. That is in the sigularity and inside a black hole. So is death same as being stuck inside a black hole?

Even when everything ceased to exist, time still exist. So how can time ever be 0?

Day follows night, night day.
Everything is finite.

Where there is no end, there is no beginning.
Where there is no decline, there is no growth.

Define singularity.
Define consciousness.
You find a relationship?

 

[erm]

I wouldn't be surprised if consciousness is 'reborn', so to speak, as detailed here: The Pros and Cons of Eternity

If I had to bet money, I would say that after death, whatever 'happens' is probably impossible to imagine.

Overall I don't think any of us have a clue about the nature of consciousness or what'll happen to it.

 

[yenom]

singularity is where space and time reached 0 curvatire.

Time and infinity will always exist as long as the brain is functional. The question is does it still exist after we die?

 

[wildcat]

singularity is where space and time reached 0 curvatire.

Time and infinity will always exist as long as the brain is functional. The question is does it still exist after we die?

The answer is no.
I am sorry.

Rest now.
See your priest tomorrow.
Time heals all the wounds.

 

[Fluffywolf]

To many people see time as an object or a measurable idea. But it's not.

Time is just a made up tool for us humans to comprehend movement. and Date events and such.

As far as singularities go. I don't see it as time that stops inside of it. But rather that movement slows down and stops. Thinking and our brain is based on electrical surges, and therefor movement. If 'time' would stop, we would stop. Our consciousness would stop.

Death is pretty much the same. Movement stops, consciousness stops.

Time is irrelevant. (Some INTP irony for ya there. )


Near death experiences or so called 'death experiences' are just limited conscious observations because the commands our brains give are suddenly limited or dampened for that duration of time. And by trying to reach out, our consciousness goes into a dream like state in which we try to hold on, or perhaps let go. Depending on the person in question ofcourse. But the fact is, we don't have the command to just shut down our brain consciously. Therefor the transitions are 'cloudy'.

 

[nanook]

from what i know: when personal movement stops, (personal) time freezes, which creates the impression of reunion with a known infinity, as if you were still at that very same crossroad where you had been before you lost yourself in relative reality. as if - in all that time - you did not move a millimeter (did not develop a bit) - yet there is the idea of movement and the intention to succeed. the intention is almost involuntary and create a resistance as if the Niagara falls are pressing on me. this perspective on almost-infinity is the scariest place i know. it's also the closest thing to a home, or a mother. but it's just a partial and relative perspective anyway.

 

[Feops]

To many people see time as an object or a measurable idea. But it's not.

This is an odd assertion. How is time not measurable? I have a clock right in front of me that will keep pace with millions of other clocks. It's certainly consistant and has value.

 

[Fluffywolf]

A clock measures itself. Not time.

 

[Fluffywolf]

I've had some accidents and near accidents in which everything seemed to slow down. You mean that?

I believe that's because of the sudden dominance of perception as well as adrenaline.

 

[nanook]

You mean that?

i am referring to a drug induced dissociative experience. dissociative=gradually removing from reality, not physical reality, but the idea of both reality and human identity. (ego remains, when all concrete knowledge about the world or believe in the world is long gone. so, ego is not synonym to identity.) in experience this freeze is very different from a car crash (i had some of those), but in principle it might not be entirely different. there is a nature in time, a character, a feeling, that which is commonly called holiness, and both experiences are full of it, but in the car crash situation you don't notice it that clearly. but once you know this quality from somewhere else, you recognize it in retrospect in the car crash. (i mean me. English is funny with the "you")

 

[Blackmail!]

singularity is where space and time reached 0 curvatire.

Time and infinity will always exist as long as the brain is functional. The question is does it still exist after we die?

Did time existed before you were born?

 

[nanook]

for some reason i can see/feel the holy taste of time in trees and houses, but when i am at home and look at my computer, i can't.

i tend to see human time and objective time (the eternal "now") as being different, yet of the same nature, as objective time is subjective to Spirit, and so is human time. but human time is still entirely different. before birth and in between the everyday little-deaths (it's like slices, like when you watch out of a train window and trees or a fence is nearby), there is a time, that is somehow/somewere in between the two extremes.

 

[antireconciler]

I can't imagine a reality where time and infinity ceased to exist.

Exactly. No one can. Time, in some form, is a necessary condition for consciousness.

Near death experiences or so called 'death experiences' are just limited conscious observations because the commands our brains give are suddenly limited or dampened for that duration of time. And by trying to reach out, our consciousness goes into a dream like state in which we try to hold on, or perhaps let go. Depending on the person in question ofcourse. But the fact is, we don't have the command to just shut down our brain consciously. Therefor the transitions are 'cloudy'.

This sounds accurate. Only activity can be conscious. Since death isn't, it can't be. NDE has a way of rapidly rewiring things because the mind becomes very much forced to the natural conclusions of some contradictions in our thinking which may lie only dormant or implicit for a long time. It raises consciousness because matters of life and death are the very consituents of consciousness. So it shouldn't be a surprise if NDE focuses consciousness.

 

[Eric B]

I wouldn't be surprised if consciousness is 'reborn', so to speak, as detailed here: The Pros and Cons of Eternity

If I had to bet money, I would say that after death, whatever 'happens' is probably impossible to imagine.

Overall I don't think any of us have a clue about the nature of consciousness or what'll happen to it.

Interesting.
Basically a temporal version of what a Scientific American article suggested a few years ago. Assuming space is infinite, they said that the further you go out, you run out of every possible configuration of matter, so stuff can only then start repeating. Some things just like we see them, but also every other possibility. This site here is saying the same thing happens in endless time, using the quantum uncertainty principle.
Then, others speak of parallel alternative universes, which split off at each event where one possibility was chose over another. (I would actually make that a third continuum in addition to space and time. call it "chance", perhaps).

Here is an essay I did on defining space and time, and conclusions made about stuff like time travel. BDMNQR Essays (just I draw heavily on string theory as taught by Brian Greene, which does say space and time themselves are determined by strings, and hence, "between" the strings (Planck length), the concept of space and time break down in favor of some sort of "commutative geometry matrices".

 

[Feops]

A clock measures itself. Not time.

Semantics. You original assertion was that time couldn't be measured. Sure time isn't a material thing. Why does it need to be? The passage of time makes a material impact on what we do and we have tools that mechanically track this passage with precision.