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What are the qualities of a bad person?

proteanmix

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I'm thinking about when people say "Jane does XYZ bad things, but she's really a good person," and wondering if there is a general reluctance to ascribe the label of being a "bad" person to people.

I think to myself, it's statistically impossible for there not to be bad people in the world, and I'm not just talking about the macro level of bad person (i.e. Hitler). Is there a such thing as a bad person at the micro level, or is the person just misunderstood? It's easy to say someone who kills another person in cold blood is bad but what about someone who consistently shows callous disregard to others, misanthropic, is morally destitute, but holds these attitudes to themselves so there isn't anything concrete to pin the bad person label?

Should the quality of being a bad person only be applied to someone who would clinically fall into that category, i.e. a sociopath?

What would you say the inner qualities of a bad person are and how do they manifest themselves outwardly? Are the qualities of a "bad" person, simply the opposite of those of a "good" person? I'm leaving the definition of bad open to interpretation.
 

prplchknz

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I guess I bad person would be a sociopath, but I don't know, because I'm sure some bleeding hearts would so "Oh Jim,yeah, he's a sociopath,but he really isn't a bad person"
 

Kalach

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"Bad" is a moral judgment. Two levels, maybe:

1. "What he did to others."
2. "What he has the potential to do."

Both can be used to say, "He's a bad man." A level 2 judgment of "bad" is more serious, and where it exists it would confirm a level 1 judgment of "bad".

But... Level 2 judgments are tough calls if one believes in redemption. A level 2 judgment of "good" traditionally mitigates a level 1 judgment of "bad".

Or does it? If the potential for remorse (and perhaps acts of recompense) exist, is the man "bad"?

There can and/or should be a balance between level 1 and 2 judgments?


I was thinking about it today because one of the MBTI test questions is (something like) "You support Justice more than Mercy--yes or no?"

I plumped for Justice because Mercy doesn't solve a problem, it allows problems to reappear, but that doesn't mean I subscribe to the right to call someone a "bad man." I believe the principle of each person's right to be independent and free from constraint is sufficiently valuable that it must be protected (which sounds like I'd support just punishment) but I also hold that once a thing is done, it's done, and if the thing done didn't harm the long term interests of the person, then Mercy can be shown. (But the only person with the right to offer Mercy is the aggrieved party, and if they are aggrieved and likely to hold that grief, then they are not unharmed... So, if you think about it, the overarching theme there is Justice.)


In summary:

If there can be Good Men, then there can be Bad Men.

But to judge which of us is Bad...


You're gonna need some Ti thinking on this. I'll tend naturally to speak of pragmatics, and don't quite know just yet how to deal with the absolutes needed for this one.



I am so being INTJ about this--always allowing for the possibility of something good or useful even in a heap of ashes... I'm fudging the idea of absolutes as if I were a bleeding heart.
 

Lexicon

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I guess I bad person would be a sociopath, but I don't know, because I'm sure some bleeding hearts would so "Oh Jim,yeah, he's a sociopath,but he really isn't a bad person"

Yeah..
I tend to look at diagnoses for Antisocial Personality Disorder as the science behind what causes some people to have the propensity to commit less-than-good deeds moreso than others ("good" & "bad" defined to me as adaptive & maladaptive)... the diagnosis just explains it.. doesn't condone it in the least... nor should it..
 

Anja

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I don't like to use the words "good" an "bad" when I'm talking about people.

But after thinking about this for a couple of minutes I think I would describe a "bad" person as someone who consistently puts their own needs and interests ahead of anyone or anything else.
 

Lexicon

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I don't like to use the words "good" an "bad" when I'm talking about people.

But after thinking about this for a couple of minutes I think I would describe a "bad" person as someone who consistently puts their own needs and interests ahead of anyone or anything else.

What's bad about always putting your own needs before others? Mind you, I don't mean, consistently at the cost of others...
I figure you can't take care of anyone else sufficently anyway without taking care of yourself first... though I can't bring myself to put that theory into practice consistently.. just kinda playing the devil's advocate here.
 

Anja

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Yes, I agree with you, Lexicon. You can't do much good in the world if you don't take care of yourself.

Your answer, as you seem to have already noticed, is in your question. "Consistently at the cost of others."

Edit: I suppose I could have added your italicized words, but it seemed implied to me. "Consistently" by itself wouldn't be good, I think. I'm thinking of mother/child relationships in this sense. But I think there could be other situations where the safety of others was concerned.
 

heart

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I guess I bad person would be a sociopath, but I don't know, because I'm sure some bleeding hearts would so "Oh Jim,yeah, he's a sociopath,but he really isn't a bad person"

There's no hope for people with such bleeding hearts, they are part of the reason evil flourishes.

Yes, lack of empathy, when desire for power takes the place of desire for love, that's what I would say makes the difference. The little Hitlers of the world, estimated as 1 in 30. Socialized psychopaths are the more intelligent ones who learn how to work within the law to get their power kicks, they hurt people throughout their lives and get away with it. And there's always, always, always people ready to defend them, give them "second chance" because so many people cannot handle the concept of evil in others.

Then there's also corrupt judgment and people who don't balance their T-F use. To veer too far in either direction T or F I think leaves a person lopsided in their judgment and open to create havoc for others.
 

Kiddo

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A bad person is someone who treats others as if they are less worthy of respect.

A good share of moral propositions cover this...

"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

"Love they neighbor as thyself."
 

Lexicon

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Yes, I agree with you, Lexicon. You can't do much good in the world if you don't take care of yourself.

Your answer, as you seem to have already noticed, is in your question. "Consistently at the cost of others."


Yeah.. narcissists are jerkfaces. :thumbdown:
I've tried in RL to explain the idea of psychological egoism with regard to altruism... but then I'm told I'm a bad person to think that way, by the more sentimental folks.. Sigh.
 

BerberElla

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There's no hope for people with such bleeding hearts, they are part of the reason evil flourishes.

Yes, lack of empathy, when desire for power takes the place of desire for love, that's what I would say makes the difference. The little Hitlers of the world, estimated as 1 in 30. Socialized psychopaths are the more intelligent ones who learn how to work within the law to get their power kicks, they hurt people throughout their lives and get away with it. And there's always, always, always people ready to defend them, give them "second chance" because so many people cannot handle the concept of evil in others.

Then there's also corrupt judgment and people who don't balance their T-F use. To veer too far in either direction T or F I think leaves a person lopsided in their judgment and open to create havoc for others.

You can be soft and still make the right judgement when confronted with evil.

For myself I see someone as being bad, when they do a bad thing to someone else and don;t even feel remorse over it.
 

AOA

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It's in the eyes.

... you'll know a sociopath, or any two-bit 'degenerate' by his/her eyes.
 

heart

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You can be soft and still make the right judgement when confronted with evil...

I meant bleeding hearts who want to excuse evil. I know people like this. Being too soft means being too soft, not being balanced between being able to make judgments when needed and to give leniancy.
 

BerberElla

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I meant bleeding hearts who want to excuse evil. I know people like this. Being too soft means being too soft, not being balanced between being able to make judgments when needed and to give leniancy.

I know, I was totally agreeing with you there. :yes:
 

heart

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I know, I was totally agreeing with you there. :yes:

I was afraid I hadn't made myself clear. :D

I seriously have known people like this who seemed to have a pathological compulsion to excuse or turn a blind eye to evil in the world.
 

AOA

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I meant bleeding hearts who want to excuse evil. I know people like this. Being too soft means being too soft, not being balanced between being able to make judgments when needed and to give leniancy.

Agreed.
 

BerberElla

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I was afraid I hadn't made myself clear. :D

I just re-read my reply lol it was I who didn't make my agreement clear. :blush:

I just meant those bleeding hearts take the whole concept of being too soft to a whole other level. I'm soft, sometimes too soft, but I can make the right judgement under the right circumstances and it constantly amazes me when people try to excuse such behaviour.
 

Lexicon

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Yes, I agree with you, Lexicon. You can't do much good in the world if you don't take care of yourself.

Your answer, as you seem to have already noticed, is in your question. "Consistently at the cost of others."

Edit: I suppose I could have added your italicized words, but it seemed implied to me. "Consistently" by itself wouldn't be good, I think. I'm thinking of mother/child relationships in this sense. But I think there could be other situations where the safety of others was concerned.


Yeah I figured it was implied... and I totally agree; if you're a parent or have otherwise agreed to hold accountability for a life beyond your own.. you can't really cry out "every man for himself!" in a crisis, etc, and not expect to be deemed "bad."
 

Kiddo

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I seriously have known people like this who seemed to have a pathological compulsion to excuse or turn a blind eye to evil in the world.

I guess I'm one of those people. I really don't believe in evil. Just selfishness and bad choices.
 

Totenkindly

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There seems to be at least two levels of people who get labeled as bad.

One level is badness where the person actively wants to hurt others, take advantage of them, very anti-social in nature. I do not run across those often. I see them more as "pure evil," they actively intend to hurt others.

More common is badness where the person is responding with ill-suited or ineffecient behaviors that are causing distress to themselves or others not because they're trying to be jerks but because it's the best solution they have at the moment... and if their eyes are opened and they see a "better" solution, they would take it. People at only operate at their maximum developed potential at the time, and cannot long-term be more than they are.

I think a lot of people in the second category get stuck in the first category by people who don't understand their motivations or that they're trying. Still, even if a dog can't help but run around and bite people because it was beaten as a puppy doesn't mean that we shouldn't inhibit the dog's behavior in some way.

(Good topic.)
 
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