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The bible's legitimacy

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People may follow, well probably because the bible cover topics that is not covered by science like Sins, angel, heaven, hell. What I know about science is that they cover only what is observable by the five senses while probably no scientist have ever visited hell or heaven that they can't tell it scientifically. They may think that they find some answer to their question in it. The other day I was informed that my ex brokerage co associate judged that the Old testament that he referred to as the Torah (Exodus, Deuteronomy, Leviticus, Numbers, Genesis) resembles the Koran, which was interesting. Back then, I didn't give him any agree or disagree comment since I have never read that but since we can read it online now here, I can begin my study without even purchasing the hardcopy.
Legitimacy or may be validity is a scholarly question. A scholar that is in position to answer it at the very minimum has studied the book so that they know the content and have answer to the question: how to check it.
 
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Totenkindly

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Yes, there's overlap between the Koran, Torah, and early OT books. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are referred to collectively as the Abrahamic religions.
 

Polaris

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Things like the Garden of Eden and Noah's Ark are obviously not historically accurate unless the Devil is doing an extremely good job of obscuring the truth. Such stories have some allegorical truth, however, one might argue, but then so do most other stories, provided you read them in a way that brings their allegorical truth to light... As far as spiritual truth goes, I think that the Bble is, frankly, rather shallow in most respects. I don't see any real insight into the human condition or metaphysics anywhere in there, just a bunch of stories and commandments. I think that is actually part of what makes the religion it espouses so widely appealing; it doesn't call for much mental effort. Morally, the Bible is a mixed bag. I like a lot of the things Jesus stood for, but very little of the Old Testament strikes me as ethically sound... If there is one part of the Bible that I could accept, it would be the broad details of the story of Jesus. I do believe there is a God, and I consider it possible that he could have adopted a human form as Jesus. And I find Christian imagery very compelling, far more so than the imagery of any other religion. But there things that don't quite fit. For example, Jesus presents himself as the offspring not so much of a generic God as the Old Testament God; and the Old Testament God was a very nasty fellow who probably never existed. That's just one example; there are some other, less important things that don't quite line up for me either... So, in brief, I reject a large portion of the Bible but remain somewhat agnostic about its main feature, which is Jesus Christ.
 
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Ron Wyatt, an Archaeologist has found the artifact for Noah's ark. According to Him, for the people who believe in God, this finding will be the confirmation of their faith [on not only biblical but also Koranic story].
 
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I think Joe Zias can only attack Wyatt qualification , that is not really relevant to the artifact that Wyatt has found. Wyatt may not be a recognized archeologist since he had no formal educational qualification in the field (It is informed that he was a nurse), that may have made other archaeologist unwilling to recognize him, but finding an artifact in an excavation cite is one of archaeological work known to me that Wyatt had endeavored with a significant achievement. Wyatt, however, unfortunately may have not been able to investigate the real issue :is what he has found really an Ark referred to Noah or just something else like natural phenomena. If other argue what Wyatt has found is a mere natural phenomena, they must also explain their basis. Btw, It was found in 1985, I wonder whether there are another archaeologists who have expressed their interest in it, probably to finish what Wyatt has started.
My personal opinion is that despite unclarity, may be due to long period of time, the shape of the artifact ,still resembles a huge boat but it seems somehow like it's been turned upside down. The bottom seems to be on the top. What can explain a boat on a top of a mountain plausibly is perhaps only water in an extremely large volume, like a deluge in a biblical and koranic story or a Tsunami.
For a comparison, A tsunami hit Aceh, Indonesia in 2004. That tidal wave could make An electricity power generator with Diesel Engine ship relocated from off shore to be stranded at a place in the middle of Banda Aceh. Now it has become a monument of the disastrous event. Skeptic shouldn't be able to honestly say This one is not a ship. Since it perhaps just happened 16 years ago, the ship shape is still noticeable that common people should be able to confidently say that that is indeed a ship;not something else. We don't need an expert opinion to tell what that is, unlike the artifact that Wyatt has found. Here is the video if you are interested in.
 
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Kephalos

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Since different books in the Bible were written at different times and then they were collected, there's a temporal asymmetry because the authors of the earlier books had no idea what future religious writings might contain, but the writers of later books could read the older books and make references and allusions to them.
 

Mind Maverick

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I’m not questioning about the existence of god. I can’t prove that god doesn’t exists, so I must account for a possibility of his existence, even if I think the probability is extremely small. Nor do I want to insult anyone. If I did, or will, I’m sorry, it isn’t my objective. I have never read the bible neither.
Thanks for making this thread. I was about to, but I think you introduced the subject in a more tactful way than I would've, so it's probably better that you did.

What I am wondering is about the bible itself. Why do people usually follow it blindly? I’ve seen its danger with many more scientific topics like vaccines, 5G and so on. Why do you believe and trust a book that as been written around two thousands years ago? I know it teaches you about love, respect and kindness. But why is it necessary god’s word? I've read that the old testament is more brutal. If the popes have been the cause for numerous hateful crimes throughout history, why do you still trust the Vatican?
Aside from people often being sheeple anyways, the Bible encourages this. People place so much emphasis on faith because the Bible does, and they're afraid their beliefs will be shaken. They're basically taught to see said shaken beliefs as attacks from an enemy force, threats to their safety--a safety that's eternal and irreversible. Salvation hinges upon faith.

I’m not questioning small churches neither, I believe they are helpful for locals.
I can't say that I 100% agree with this. I think there are pros and cons. I personally believe that the Bible (and its churches) breed deception. I think the good that does come out of it is really more about the fact that something is motivating people to do things that are helpful to the locals, including things like food banks and charity. It sort of proves what people are capable of when they're sufficiently motivated, if you ask me. Sadly though, this is often (not always) just greed being weaponized against itself, which is actually kind of clever, but at the end of the day it's just greed disguised as generosity, which is also rather toxic because it's damaging to trust. The incentive is pretty much gaining heavenly things rather than earthly ones though. The idea is that giving on earth = gaining in heaven, and since heaven is eternal...well...yeah.

As I see it, the bible has been written by smart people trying to improve the world they are living in. They made barbaric men stay civilized by making them fear hell. They kept them loyal by telling them about the evil that will destroy the world and how only the faithful will be saved.

So, what is your opinion about the bible? Do you think it is god’s word, or at least god’s opinion? Or are you on the other extreme, believing that it is not different from Mein Kampf or the little red book? What do you think?
I think the Bible is a human construct, but I also think we can't say for certain what the intentions behind conceptualizing it were. I think the most we can do is speculate, theorize, generate possibilities.
 

Mind Maverick

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People are always looking for confirmation of their faith. The Bible basically implies there's not evidence by saying that people have to have faith to believe though. If there was evidence out there, that would no longer be true...so funny enough, to find solid evidence is to prove the Bible wrong at least in one area, which would make it more questionable.
 

Lark

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I sort of think that being attached to a single book, or even a series of books, can be a real fault of some religious devotees, of any sort of thinking really, it suggests something dead as opposed to something living I think.

I think that living traditions, which might comprise rituals, in the Confucian rather than conjuring sense, are more important than singular texts or accounts. Although I do think that exegesis or interrogating texts for meanings which remain relevant can be useful but secondary to some sort of tradition and practice. Always. Religions should be about what you do as opposed to what you think and it was a serious blind alley that religion took in the western world when it took that turn.
 

Coriolis

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People are always looking for confirmation of their faith. The Bible basically implies there's not evidence by saying that people have to have faith to believe though. If there was evidence out there, that would no longer be true...so funny enough, to find solid evidence is to prove the Bible wrong at least in one area, which would make it more questionable.
Faith is not subject to proof. In fact, almost by definition, faith it acceptance of something in the absence of proof. When people speak of disproving something in the Bible, they are generally attacking it on a historical or scientific basis. Neither is necessary for faith. We don't ask, for instance, whether Aesop's Fables are true. Most people understand that the truth conveyed by the story of the tortoise and the hare requires neither that their famous footrace actually took place, nor that such animals had the ability to organize and converse about it.
 

Lord Lavender

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I see the Bible as a bunch of fables kind of like Aesop's fables. I don't think everything in the Bible is historically accurate but it has value as a book of guidance and personal growth. Oooooh I was wondering they should cross the Bible with some other mythologies I think all mythologies have value to use it just happens Christianity survived other mythologies. It would be a fun bit of work and I think it would have some good moral lessons like maybe tolerance fro other groups like God letting go of the idea he is the only one true god and that Loki has as much right to exist as he does. Anyways to answer the thread title I don't think the Bible has political or moral legimately no book does but it deserves respect as a human cultural standing.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I like the song B.I.B.L.E. (Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth), but it doesn't really fit with the flow of the album and feels more like a tacked on bonus track.
 

Mind Maverick

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Faith is not subject to proof. In fact, almost by definition, faith is acceptance of something in the absence of proof. When people speak of disproving something in the Bible, they are generally attacking it on a historical or scientific basis. Neither is necessary for faith. We don't ask, for instance, whether Aesop's Fables are true. Most people understand that the truth conveyed by the story of the tortoise and the hare requires neither that their famous footrace actually took place, nor that such animals had the ability to organize and converse about it.
That was sort of my point, it's acceptance in the absence of proof...so if there was proof, how would they be believing out of faith?
 

Mind Maverick

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I'm a strong believer in the Problem of Evil trilemma. I've thoroughly studied the Bible and used to be Christian. I was born into a family of nothing but Christians (my brother and I are the only exceptions), thus being exposed to these things all my life until I was 27. When I was 24/25 I took to a Christianity that was somewhat different than what I was raised on, and that was when I read it daily and started digging deeper into it. The church I was with challenged the traditional beliefs, pointing out how certain popular concepts did not actually exist in the Bible. For example, people talk about the 3 kings who took gifts to baby Jesus, but that isn't in the Bible at all. I was against the traditional beliefs that most of my family followed, as I thought it was hypocritical and there was a lot of self-delusion taking place, so this appealed to me. The problem I encountered during my studies was ultimately part of what caused me to walk away from it; I couldn't help but to perceive the Biblical God as evil. There are many, many reasons for this. Some examples were direct, such as ordering babies to be put to death in the Old Testament simply because they were born to the Palestines. If Christians or Jews did this in today's times we'd call them terrorists - and this is the same God who said don't murder, yet He ordered the Jews to murder babies. I therefore couldn't help but to see this God as a hypocrite or a God with double standards, not to mention it made no sense that He would order the Jews to do something He had simultaneously commanded them not to do. Others were matters of logical reasoning that tie back into the philosophical Problem of Evil linked above - basically, I was arriving to the same conclusion as them on my own, except I was accepting He was 'all knowing' and 'all powerful,' thus I kept seeing Him as 'not all good.'
 

Mole

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Any book gets its authority from the author. And the author of the Bible is ultimately the Author of the Universe. Unfortunately the book is dead, and it's author is dead.

The death of the book has given rise to the net.

The Bible was once the infallible word of God, but today is merely a status symbol, waved by the President in front of the White House.
 

Red Memories

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Any book gets its authority from the author. And the author of the Bible is ultimately the Author of the Universe. Unfortunately the book is dead, and it's author is dead.

The death of the book has given rise to the net.

The Bible was once the infallible word of God, but today is merely a status symbol, waved by the President in front of the White House.

I suppose if you feel that way, but Christians still do exist, and we still think it means a lot more than that jackass using it as a prop.
 

Mole

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I suppose if you feel that way, but Christians still do exist, and we still think it means a lot more than that jackass using it as a prop.

In 1440 the printing press gave us the vernacular Bible, and today the book is the content of the net.

So we say poetically, the book is dead, the author is dead, and the Author of the Universe is dead, and the literate individual is dead, while electronic tribes, like typology central, proliferate.
 
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