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Science and Personality Typing Meet

Lib

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Nov 3, 2017
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577
Speaking of you trolling... ;)
The poor quality of this discussion from your part is enough of an evidence who is trolling. May be someone has to pay attention to your repulsive behavior before trying to track dupes - there are plenty of concrete proofs for the former.
 

1487610420

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6,431
Speaking of you trolling... ;)

 

Maou

Mythos
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Jun 20, 2018
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INTP
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Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
You become a completely different person, of course

Does this mean alcoholics have no souls? Since they constantly nuke their bacteria? :shock:
 

Cellmold

Wake, See, Sing, Dance
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Messages
6,266
Very interesting.

Although I lack the capacity to really understand this, I would assume that matching the bacteria to usefully applicable amounts will take a lot of time and effort. That is the engaging part of discovery, though.

The PDF is (unsurprisingly) very involved, if I get a month free I'll take a good look at it. The Big 5 is getting more cemented as a personality theory with decent scientific backing; the slow-building picture is a long way off however, since there are many different factors that could be used to account for personality.

I'm still wondering if empiricism (as proponents of the enlightenment have been pushing for decades) can replace the more nebulous explanations & heuristics that are more typically relied upon to explain behaviour. I don't mean in the sense that these types of scientific discovery are more or less valid (it's common knowledge that what we consume can effect behaviour) but more so if people can adopt an understanding that more closely resembles this kind of information.

Maybe I should say 'bridge the gap' instead of replace??

I'm not sure I fleshed my thoughts out here properly, I'll come back to this later.
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
11,655
Very interesting.

Although I lack the capacity to really understand this, I would assume that matching the bacteria to usefully applicable amounts will take a lot of time and effort. That is the engaging part of discovery, though.

The PDF is (unsurprisingly) very involved, if I get a month free I'll take a good look at it. The Big 5 is getting more cemented as a personality theory with decent scientific backing; the slow-building picture is a long way off however, since there are many different factors that could be used to account for personality.

I'm still wondering if empiricism (as proponents of the enlightenment have been pushing for decades) can replace the more nebulous explanations & heuristics that are more typically relied upon to explain behaviour. I don't mean in the sense that these types of scientific discovery are more or less valid (it's common knowledge that what we consume can effect behaviour) but more so if people can adopt an understanding that more closely resembles this kind of information.

Maybe I should say 'bridge the gap' instead of replace??

I'm not sure I fleshed my thoughts out here properly, I'll come back to this later.
As a starting point, gut bacteria can influence the mind through the immune system connection.
 

Lib

Permabanned
Joined
Nov 3, 2017
Messages
577
Very interesting.

Although I lack the capacity to really understand this, I would assume that matching the bacteria to usefully applicable amounts will take a lot of time and effort. That is the engaging part of discovery, though.

The PDF is (unsurprisingly) very involved, if I get a month free I'll take a good look at it. The Big 5 is getting more cemented as a personality theory with decent scientific backing; the slow-building picture is a long way off however, since there are many different factors that could be used to account for personality.

I'm still wondering if empiricism (as proponents of the enlightenment have been pushing for decades) can replace the more nebulous explanations & heuristics that are more typically relied upon to explain behaviour. I don't mean in the sense that these types of scientific discovery are more or less valid (it's common knowledge that what we consume can effect behaviour) but more so if people can adopt an understanding that more closely resembles this kind of information.

Maybe I should say 'bridge the gap' instead of replace??

I'm not sure I fleshed my thoughts out here properly, I'll come back to this later.
For one thing, the state of microflora depends on the internal body environment, where the pH, chemical content and even temperature differ in different people. Microflora changes composition and metabolite production and secretion in response to environmental change. Of course, it influences the individual's psychological condition by producing B vits (and some other useful stuff for that matter), which ensure the proper neuronal function, but this doesn't define you as a person, only makes you more mentally healthy. Distinction must be made between a system in its entirety (which manifests itself as an usual combination of observed traits) and how it reacts to different factors. I only try to explain why it's very unlikely that microflora controls behavior so much to be able to define one's personality. It's more likely that human personality control its composition, for example, with the frequency of production of stomach acid, which is related to the way one manages stress.
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
Messages
11,655
Microbiota Transfer Therapy alters gut ecosystem and improves gastrointestinal and autism symptoms: an open-label study | Microbiome | Full Text

Microbiota Transfer Therapy alters gut ecosystem and improves gastrointestinal and autism symptoms: an open-label study

Abstract

Background
Autism spectrum disorders (ASD) are complex neurobiological disorders that impair social interactions and communication and lead to restricted, repetitive, and stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests, and activities. The causes of these disorders remain poorly understood, but gut microbiota, the 1013 bacteria in the human intestines, have been implicated because children with ASD often suffer gastrointestinal (GI) problems that correlate with ASD severity. Several previous studies have reported abnormal gut bacteria in children with ASD. The gut microbiome-ASD connection has been tested in a mouse model of ASD, where the microbiome was mechanistically linked to abnormal metabolites and behavior. Similarly, a study of children with ASD found that oral non-absorbable antibiotic treatment improved GI and ASD symptoms, albeit temporarily. Here, a small open-label clinical trial evaluated the impact of Microbiota Transfer Therapy (MTT) on gut microbiota composition and GI and ASD symptoms of 18 ASD-diagnosed children.

Results
MTT involved a 2-week antibiotic treatment, a bowel cleanse, and then an extended fecal microbiota transplant (FMT) using a high initial dose followed by daily and lower maintenance doses for 7–8 weeks. The Gastrointestinal Symptom Rating Scale revealed an approximately 80% reduction of GI symptoms at the end of treatment, including significant improvements in symptoms of constipation, diarrhea, indigestion, and abdominal pain. Improvements persisted 8 weeks after treatment. Similarly, clinical assessments showed that behavioral ASD symptoms improved significantly and remained improved 8 weeks after treatment ended. Bacterial and phagedeep sequencing analyses revealed successful partial engraftment of donor microbiota and beneficial changes in the gut environment. Specifically, overall bacterial diversity and the abundance of Bifidobacterium, Prevotella, and Desulfovibrio among other taxa increased following MTT, and these changes persisted after treatment stopped (followed for 8 weeks).

Conclusions

This exploratory, extended-duration treatment protocol thus appears to be a promising approach to alter the gut microbiome and virome and improve GI and behavioral symptoms of ASD. Improvements in GI symptoms, ASD symptoms, and the microbiome all persisted for at least 8 weeks after treatment ended, suggesting a long-term impact.
 

Lib

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Nov 3, 2017
Messages
577
As I said, it improves the quality of neuronal function, doesn't necessarily change the personality. If we assume that certain traits from the Big 5 are a sign of disorder or impairments, then such causation could imply. Otherwise, that's highly unlikely. That's why people compare healthy with unhealthy types. Also, everybody develops their personality to a different extend.
 

rav3n

.
Joined
Aug 6, 2010
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11,655
Neuroticism and Common Mental Disorders: Meaning and Utility of a Complex Relationship

Abstract

Neuroticism's prospective association with common mental disorders (CMDs) has fueled the assumption that neuroticism is an independent etiologically informative risk factor. This vulnerability model postulates that neuroticism sets in motion processes that lead to CMDs. However, four other models seek to explain the association, including the spectrum model (manifestations of the same process), common cause model (shared determinants), state and scar models (CMD episode adds temporary / permanent neuroticism). To examine their validity we reviewed literature on confounding, operational overlap, stability and change, determinants, and treatment effects. None of the models is able to account for (virtually) all findings. The state and scar model cannot explain the prospective association. The spectrum model has some relevance, especially for internalizing disorders. Common causes are most important but the vulnerability model cannot be excluded although confounding of the prospective association by baseline symptoms and psychiatric history is substantial. In fact, some of the findings, such as interactions with stress and the small decay of neuroticism's effect over time, are consistent with the vulnerability model. We describe research designs that discriminate the remaining models and plea for deconstruction of neuroticism. Neuroticism is etiologically not informative yet but useful as an efficient marker of non-specified general risk.
 

Yuurei

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I shall pass this onto my husband and then have him summarize. We both find it interesting but I don't have the patience to read it all.
 

hurl3y4456

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Aug 31, 2018
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298
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Neurotransmitter output is interconnected with gut flora...In fact, the onset of Bipolar Disorder is due to a disturbance in the microbiota. Without proper regulation of gut flora, our digestive system would become inefficient, leading to hormone imbalances (promoting mood swings/Neurotic-ism), diminished motivation + well being (hence reduction in Conscientiousness + Extroversion/sociability + Openness to Experience + Agreeableness), Therefore, the positive aspects of the Big Five traits would be flipped. Note the although energy levels are directly proportional to Openness to Experience, the decline in mental health/emotion associated with an imbalance in gut flora can cause one to try new drugs/substances to temporarily amplify dopamine/serotonin/gaba as a coping mechanism (the underline emphasizes that openness to positive experience (+ energy) would likely be reduced and replaced with negative experiences (- energy)).
 

Lib

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Nov 3, 2017
Messages
577
Neurotransmitter output is interconnected with gut flora...In fact, the onset of Bipolar Disorder is due to a disturbance in the microbiota. Without proper regulation of gut flora, our digestive system would become inefficient, leading to hormone imbalances (promoting mood swings/Neurotic-ism), diminished motivation + well being (hence reduction in Conscientiousness + Extroversion/sociability + Openness to Experience + Agreeableness), Therefore, the positive aspects of the Big Five traits would be flipped. Note the although energy levels are directly proportional to Openness to Experience, the decline in mental health/emotion associated with an imbalance in gut flora can cause one to try new drugs/substances to temporarily amplify dopamine/serotonin/gaba as a coping mechanism (the underline emphasizes that openness to positive experience (+ energy) would likely be reduced and replaced with negative experiences (- energy)).
Neuroticism is not necessarily a negative or unhealthy trait. Gut microflora as an important part of the digestive system influences the overall well-being including mental health, but personality is much more complex than that. Epigenetics explains why having two different conditions in different people could lead to the same behavior. Because personality is also memory and knowledge apart from also being genetically favored, and this is physiologically explained by neuronal connections.
 
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hurl3y4456

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Joined
Aug 31, 2018
Messages
298
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SINE
Neuroticism is not necessarily a negative or unhealthy trait. Gut microflora as an important part of the digestive system influences the overall well-being including mental health, but personality is much more complex than that.

Yes, I agree that neuroticism is not necessarily negative, however, if there is some form of imbalance within the body (gut Dysbiosis--> hormonal issues),it may amplify to the extreme, which will result in negative consequences. Some aspects of neurotic behavior is needed for survival...for instance, anxiety/fear could be a reaction in response to anticipating a negative outcome, which prepares one to act accordingly to prevent it. A healthy dosage of neuroticism will increase the likelihood that one will avoid certain circumstances according to their perception of the outcome, which is positive.

Also, I agree that personality is dictated by various factors aside from the gut connection and is complex down to its core (personality can be analogous to an onion and its layers). It may cause one to become depressed or more prone to anger, but the personality stays intact (the form of the onion stays the same yet a few layers may be altered slightly).

Epigenetics explains why having two different conditions in different people could lead to a different behavior. Because personality is also memory and knowledge apart from also being genetically favored, and this is physiologically explained by neuronal connections.

Yes, our genetic makeup will gravitate us toward a certain environmental stimulus depending on the situation, which helps promote/develop our identity over time. The memories and knowledge are a basis for our personality to be outwardly expressed.
 

Lib

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Messages
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Yes, I agree that neuroticism is not necessarily negative, however, if there is some form of imbalance within the body (gut Dysbiosis--> hormonal issues),it may amplify to the extreme, which will result in negative consequences. Some aspects of neurotic behavior is needed for survival...for instance, anxiety/fear could be a reaction in response to anticipating a negative outcome, which prepares one to act accordingly to prevent it. A healthy dosage of neuroticism will increase the likelihood that one will avoid certain circumstances according to their perception of the outcome, which is positive.
Also, neuroticism could translate to perfectionism, performance improvement.
 
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