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[Other/Multiple Temperaments] Intelligence – Intuitives vs Sensors

Bush

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Logical way of thinkig usually destroys social and emotive intelegence. It is natural. ;)

You could be right. But true smarts and wisdom is a synthesis of all of the above, not treating them as opposing constraints but as part of the same overall capability to navigate our world.
 

Bush

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I was going to post this:

This isn't meant to be kumbaya, or a statement that everyone is equal in every capacity ever.

My beef with correlative stats on, say, type and IQ -- folks who are well-versed in this Jung stuff claim that the official tests are bogus, but folks in studies are measured based upon types given to them by those tests. Depending on how bogus those tests are, the stats might be absolutely meaningless. Even then, though, those studies are probably the best we've got -- we can come up with theoreticals and try to apply them to the real world, but we'll probably end up falling short.

but it turns out that I'd already posted it a year ago. Almost to the day.

Hey, at least I'm consistent. ...?
 

GavinElster

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The definition of what constitutes "intuitive" vs "sensor" is itself something we can juggle. A lot of physical scientists would be Keirsey Ns -- they're interested in the unknown, discovery, and aren't conventional, they're intellectual, and so on.

However, many of them would be classified as relatively practical-minded by philosophers, mystics, and so on; speculation is entertained, but what they mean by "possibilities/unknown" is they are curious for new data, new empirical studies. They're not speculative in the sense of an uber-speculative theoretical physicist or philosopher or mystic, i.e. they're too practical to speculate on the "ultimate nature of everything."
Also, that they build theories is explained sufficiently by T, it doesn't really get to N. Technically if we take things to an extreme, anything besides S -- i.e. F, T, N operates on a 'higher plane'. ST science can be a mix of tangible and theorizing. It build theories, but it's not what you'd call very speculative theorizing. It's logical theorizing based mostly on data.

They're still Keirsey Ns, but I think one can reasonably call them sensation types in a more functions-theoretic perspective. The way I frame this isn't too dissimilar to Jung's idea, which seemed to identify natural scientist with a sensation focus, and Ni types with mystics, artists, cranks/prophets, and so on. I just tend to slightly refine his interpretation and include many kinds of philosophical reasoning here, because as much as he might want to place this in T himself, I think the oft-made distinction between the technical and the conceptual/philosophical underscores a T/N difference.
 

EcK

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Yeah there's no such thing as 'practical intelligence' or 'kinestetic intelligence' etc. those are just bullshit misnamers to make ppl feel better.(they're actually skills or talents etc.)

On average intuitives seem to be more intelligent than sensors. However of course statistics don't apply to individuals but only denote trends.
 

Ashtart

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Yeah there's no such thing as 'practical intelligence' or 'kinestetic intelligence' etc. those are just bullshit misnamers to make ppl feel better.(they're actually skills or talents etc.)

On average intuitives seem to be more intelligent than sensors. However of course statistics don't apply to individuals but only denote trends.

What you define as "intelligence" then?
 

EcK

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What you define as "intelligence" then?

G.

As the guys who defined it are the same ppl who pretty much created the basis for how we know a claim is true or not in the fields of psychology etc. And the same methodologies were applied in defining G. ie: the things we can define as intelligence rather than skills, talents etc. rejecting G is basically rejecting the whole of the discipline. FYI.

People who say otherwise generally just don't know what they're talking about. And uninformed opinions are basically worthless in a conversation relative to a technical field.
 

Smilephantomhive

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This is the dumbest debate ever. Ns who say they're more intelligent just want to feel better when they haven't accomplished anything.
 

Poki

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Yeah but, there are probably more Sensors out there running the world and actually getting things done. Don't discount practical intelligence.

Also, do you know for sure that all those "inventors, scholars, and philosophers" are actually Intuitives, or are you just assuming they're Intuitives because they're inventors, scholars, and philosophers?

Isnt an inventors motto...when it doesnt work its not failure, but a lesson on what doesnt work. So if philosophers, inventors, etc. Were based on success, dont we have more failures, then anything else. So "intuitives" motto is we arent quite as good as others...but if we keep trying we can accomplish anything.

Intelligence...the knowledge that the biggest group of intelligent people are intelligent people. Everyone else is just trying be intelligent by fitting into a group...osmosis of knowledge FTW
 

Poki

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Why do people care about iq so much?

Because grass is always greener when you put on green glasses filtering out all the other awesome colors of the world.
 

Poki

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Yeah there's no such thing as 'practical intelligence' or 'kinestetic intelligence' etc. those are just bullshit misnamers to make ppl feel better.(they're actually skills or talents etc.)

On average intuitives seem to be more intelligent than sensors. However of course statistics don't apply to individuals but only denote trends.

Practical intelligence...is actually being intelligent enough to apply knowledge as opposed to pure mental masturbation. I know alot of people who claim "intelligence", that lack the intelligence to apply knowledge.
 

Ashtart

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G.

As the guys who defined it are the same ppl who pretty much created the basis for how we know a claim is true or not in the fields of psychology etc. And the same methodologies were applied in defining G. ie: the things we can define as intelligence rather than skills, talents etc. rejecting G is basically rejecting the whole of the discipline. FYI.

People who say otherwise generally just don't know what they're talking about. And uninformed opinions are basically worthless in a conversation relative to a technical field.

I apologize but I don't know what "G" stands for.
 

Poki

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Beware of those who minimize intelligence scope as a way to increase how much of the box they fill.
 

Poki

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in·tel·li·gence
inˈteləjəns/Submit
noun
1.
the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills.
"an eminent man of great intelligence"
synonyms: intellectual capacity, mental capacity, intellect, mind, brain(s), IQ, brainpower, judgment, reasoning, understanding, comprehension; More
2.
the collection of information of military or political value.
"the chief of military intelligence"
 

Ashtart

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in·tel·li·gence
inˈteləjəns/Submit
noun
1.
the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills.
"an eminent man of great intelligence"
synonyms: intellectual capacity, mental capacity, intellect, mind, brain(s), IQ, brainpower, judgment, reasoning, understanding, comprehension; More
2.
the collection of information of military or political value.
"the chief of military intelligence"

Wait, what? Doesn't it mean that it stands for nerds who are good with computers and physics?! I'm shocked.
 

EcK

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Practical intelligence...is actually being intelligent enough to apply knowledge as opposed to pure mental masturbation. I know alot of people who claim "intelligence", that lack the intelligence to apply knowledge.

I'm happy for you.
 

Poki

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Do you care to clarify for me what "G" stands for?

The g factor (also known as general intelligence, general mental ability or general intelligence factor) is a construct developed in psychometric investigations of cognitive abilities and human intelligence. It is a variable that summarizes positive correlations among different cognitive tasks, reflecting the fact that an individual's performance on one type of cognitive task tends to be comparable to that person's performance on other kinds of cognitive tasks. The g factor typically accounts for 40 to 50 percent of the between-individual performance differences on a given cognitive test, and composite scores ("IQ scores") based on many tests are frequently regarded as estimates of individuals' standing on the g factor.[1] The terms IQ, general intelligence, general cognitive ability, general mental ability, or simply intelligence are often used interchangeably to refer to this common core shared by cognitive tests.[2] The g factor targets a particular measure of general intelligence.

Here you go
 
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