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  1. #111
    Quetzalcoatl Norexan's Avatar
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    If Te is not teachable then nobody will know what to do and where is their place in structure of system.
    Te brings logic to world. Ti explore the new logic (right/wrong).

    <---- deep, inside (subjective = to me)
    Ti - right/wrong - literally it is logic
    Fi - good/evil - literally it is emotions

    -------> shallow, outside (objective = to world)
    Te -> bring what is right -> efficient
    Fe -> bring what is good -> ethical



    Te - clear, argumentative, teacheble , facts
    Ti - deep, idea, prons/cons, teoretical

    Se - brutal, orient to see, headstrong, bold
    Si - polite, orient to seen , persistent, serious

    Ne - funny, brainstorming, creative, explorative
    Ni - cynical, sarcastic, metaphorical, esoteric

    Fi - emotions, expresionictic, ideals, values
    Fe - altruistic, popularity, success, principle


    Inferior = weakness = sensitiveness
    inf Fi - sensitive to own emotions, cannot hold rage, easily irritable (temperamental, believe they always do right things)
    inf Fe - sensitive to other emotions, "whatever" state of mind (cool and analytical, believe in logical system which cannot implement to REAL world )
    Life Path 4. True Neutral 8 1 6 3 7 5 Teexcellent>Niexcellent>Figood>Tigood>>>>Siaverage>Fe unused
    The most sacred of the duties of a government [is] to do equal and impartial justice to all its citizens." --Thomas Jefferson
    ===Logical Crusader===

    Dail [or Daer] ú-[o] chyn [or fyn/thyn] [?] Ú-danno i failad a thi; an úben tannatha le failad.

  2. #112
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norexan View Post
    <---- deep, inside (subjective = to me)
    Ti - right/wrong - literally it is logic
    Fi - good/evil - literally it is emotions
    I often use the term emotions for Fi as well, but I don't think it's a satisfactory term, because there is more to Fi than emotions, and more to emotions than Fi. In other words, Fi only relates to some aspects of emotion.

    To explain an aspect of what Fi does, I'll contrast it with Ti.
    Ti looks at something and divides it into its parts, analytically. Or, it may choose between 2 or more selections.
    Fi on the other hand brings parts together, or matches things up, or finds a balance where 2 things can co-exist.

    So, they do the direct opposite of each other in a way.

    The way Fi relates to emotions is because as Fi goes on its way, it is "pinging" the environment off of an internal register whereby there is a note of whether the things are in accord or out of accord with that register. The way that register is experienced is such that it is somewhat suitable to call it an emotional register, but only a certain kind of emotion.

    An example of Ti and Fi (I think this is accurate):
    Say the task is to choose an item of food
    Ti will look at the options, and then weigh up which is the most suitable in a detach way. It determines which option is the "best".
    Fi will look at an item of food, and ping it for whether it is "in harmony" with the person, i.e. whether its inclusion will lead to a more harmonious state. Maybe more than one item is felt as desirable, and other functions come in to help determine how to create a balanced item that is inclusive of them all.

    And actually, Ti can look at a single item too, with the option being a yes/no. So my explanation kinda falls apart/needs work. Ti is more detached/cool-headed though, whereas Fi is more heart-felt/warm.

    I would say perhaps that Fi has a tendency to try to include, and Ti has a tendency to try to exclude.

    That's why Ti is good with maths and science. It breaks something down into its parts, while excluding as much information as possible to give a concise model.
    Whereas Fi would generally be more useful for creating art, because the Fi determines how to bring disparate parts into the one picture, in accordance with the internal mindstate and beliefs.

    There's obviously way more to say on the relation between Fi and emotions but I haven't thought it through.

  3. #113
    Quetzalcoatl Norexan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legion View Post
    I often use the term emotions for Fi as well, but I don't think it's a satisfactory term, because there is more to Fi than emotions, and more to emotions than Fi. In other words, Fi only relates to some aspects of emotion.
    Fi is relating to emotions because emotions comes from the inside not from the outside! Emotions are exclusive internal. Person who prefer Fe over Fi mean that he/she values Extroverted Feeling Judging - mean how other emotions impact to you while person who prefer Introverted Feeling Judging - mean how my emotions impact to the world. That's why Fi is values and Fe is principle.

    People go with the group who share same principles but as individuals they have different values.
    So are you Fi or Fe is question are you think what is important to you or to others? Do you value self expression or your clan principles?

    According to Jung Fi is Emotions while Fe is EQ.

    Yes dom Fe because their warm nature are very popular, love shiny things and success but as consequence to be well with all people they all loose themselves. Also they hold a pride and pride is nonsense. They also tend to emotional manipulate you but I think it is adorable. Example you say you like sensitive girls and the girl who prefer Fe over Fi start to comment things how sensitive she is. Cute.

    Te on Fe:

    Life Path 4. True Neutral 8 1 6 3 7 5 Teexcellent>Niexcellent>Figood>Tigood>>>>Siaverage>Fe unused
    The most sacred of the duties of a government [is] to do equal and impartial justice to all its citizens." --Thomas Jefferson
    ===Logical Crusader===

    Dail [or Daer] ú-[o] chyn [or fyn/thyn] [?] Ú-danno i failad a thi; an úben tannatha le failad.

  4. #114
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    All judgment functions seem to have a function of maintaining order in the external environment.

    For Ti and Fi, it's about scanning and determining whether everything is "as it should be", in terms of maintaining all parts in balance.

    For Fe and Te, it's more about DOING something, so using what is around to engage in some active process. Te has a mechanical/technological focus, Fe has a social/expressive focus.
    Likes Yuu liked this post

  5. #115
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    Outlining the 4 function quadrants:


    Pe (extroverted perception): Perception - perceiving an object, whether in terms of its concrete qualities (sensed) or abstract qualities (understood)

    Pi (introverted perception): Apperception - the viewing of, or assimilating into, a body of facts or ideas


    Ji (introverted judgment): Schema - making reference to an internal framework within which information is organised, whether social or logical

    Je (extroverted judgment): Process - the monitoring of and engagement with processes which are occurring or could occur, whether social or mechanistic

  6. #116
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    Question, probably for P types:

    Would you say that extroverted perception consists solely of perceiving the object, or does it also include simple actions (for example, jumping in the air)?

    I feel like simple actions (as opposed to multi-step complex ones which would fall under Je/Process) would indeed be Pe, but I don't know how that falls under "perception".

    Any ideas etc. on the question would be much appreciated!


    edit: I just thought of one possibility: it may be that Pe perceives an impulse, and then rides the impulse out, so that actions are taking place, but there is no real "decision" as far as the primary process is concerned.

  7. #117
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legion View Post
    Je (extroverted judgment): Process - the monitoring of and engagement with processes which are occurring or could occur, whether social or mechanistic
    A better word than "process" may be "conduct". This has both a social and logistical definition.

    Je: Conduct - the manner in which activities are carried out, whether in a social or logistical context.
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  8. #118
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    When I noticed that some members typed themselves as INFJ, I was expecting a discussion in mythological stories thread by INFJ or ISTP, as I remember that my sister (ISTP) ask our parents to buy us greek mythology book when we were a kid and Jung (INFJ) and his followers are said likes to discuss myth.source
    I read in one of Jung's book (let me check which one) that he suggest for anyone who is curious to understand the soul to read myth. But I can hardly find such thread. . An example of popular Movies with mythological characters : Loki, Thor, Odin like The Avengers are is very popular so It should be a popular thread if opened. Another would be Hercules Disney, The Mask, Xena the Warrior Princess, Troy.
    Some myths that I have ever read or heard even though I did not finished reading are : The Greek myth: Hercules, Perseus, Appollo, Zeus, Hades, etc,Norse Myth: Odin, Loki, Thor, Indian Mahabharata myth : Kurusetra War, Pandava, Kurava.

  9. #119
    Remember, Humanity. Vendrah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legion View Post
    Question, probably for P types:

    Would you say that extroverted perception consists solely of perceiving the object, or does it also include simple actions (for example, jumping in the air)?

    I feel like simple actions (as opposed to multi-step complex ones which would fall under Je/Process) would indeed be Pe, but I don't know how that falls under "perception".

    Any ideas etc. on the question would be much appreciated!


    edit: I just thought of one possibility: it may be that Pe perceives an impulse, and then rides the impulse out, so that actions are taking place, but there is no real "decision" as far as the primary process is concerned.
    It seems that nobody answered you but I would have a difficult time answering that question.
    As I said some place else, cognitive functions arent used alone, I would say that only perceveing the object isnt that much of a use. Judgement functions does play a role.
    However, consider only in isolation, it should be more or less.

    More or less because Ne is similar to Big 5 "Openess to experience", and although these things arent the same, Openess to Experience got more stuff than just perceveing. But that would be extrapolation of Ne, perhaps.

    My big problem is that my Ne use is almost never really isolated. Wait, that isnt actually a problem. It always have other cognitive function doing some sort of triage - either Ti, Te or Fi.

  10. #120
    Remember, Humanity. Vendrah's Avatar
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    I come to realize that @Osiris is permabanned.
    The MODs are even banning Gods!
    Perhaps they already banned @Zeus and @Odin?
    Would the MODs and @highlander fight Olympus with Kratos?
    Or perhaps @kratos was banned already?

    That would be worthy a movie: TypoC MODs VS Gods!

    EDIT: I clicked the links in the marks, and its official: Kratos is already banned

    EDIT 2: Kratos message to TypoC mods:


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