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Sensor Support Group

Forever

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My secobd topic was dirt diverging from mbti and I think sensors are seen they way they are because of these hierachial structures, not the other way around.

From a theoretical standpoint yes, but would you go so far to say it is an irl issue?

I mean most people when I even mention MBTI they're like .. huh what?
 

Smilephantomhive

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From a theoretical standpoint yes, but would you go so far to say it is an irl issue?

I mean most people when I even mention MBTI they're like .. huh what?

Yeah no one cares about mbti in real life.
 

LucieCat

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I do want to make an added note I get that I can be seen as bad as saying everyone matters. It’s sound trollish, but it’s not bad. I understood the whole black lives matter, it was said because they in particular needed to be heard. Not shunned. Putting them back with everybody. Doesn’t help it. All my concern was is that unlike the things with feminism, racial minorities, Intuitives are the minority irl but the imposing power within MBTI communities. Now I’m gonna stop there. Irl there’s nothing inherently wrong with your average white male or female. But the minorities aren’t exactly getting their fair share of being heard. So in turn there is nothing inherently wrong with your average sensor male or female. I think what makes me sound confusing to people is that I talk to myself in my own posts that may sound like gee? Can’t forever learn that rude things aren’t accepted here. I think out loud and put contradicting points in my own posts although poorly labeled. It’s my way of balancing the argument within my own mind. (This isn’t an intuitive exclusive thing either) I want to say sorry for unintentionally hurting anyone’s feelings. And to make sure my post was in no way directed towards Yama. I can seem weird when hitting hard to an audience nobody may exactly understand. For this fictional analogy: Sensors = white heterosexual normative male/female Intuitives = anything but For a fictional analogy: If this even helps further it’s like saying the white male or female in America getting tired *online* for being under appreciated for being less than the minorities. But irl, they just have an equal playing field and perhaps even better than the minorities. But the minorities are bad either way. (This is not accurate in any way just an analogy) ^ I don't want that. That's why I'm saying everyone is valuable. And no making an "Intuitive Support Thread" is like saying "White People Matter" No, hell no. Fuck no. (to the methodology of it, not the actual status of it) I’m just trying to be reasonable. If that’s hard to understand or is still offensive. Well ok. Go fuck my self for not having it easy irl. But supposedly “easy” online.

I am not sure if race is a good analogy to use here. I understand the point you are trying to make. But there is not society-wide discrimination against people for a cognitive preference. People have never been enslaved for being sensors, and segregation against intuitives has not happened society wide either (I’m referring to my own country, but this could definitely apply elsewhere).
Although the methodology of saying something like “all lives matter” in response to “black lives matter” is, to my understanding, completely missing the point. As a movement, black lives matter is trying to call attention to a social issue that is oftentimes overlooked. It is not saying that non-black people are are less worthy. Are there people that probably think that? Sure, there are jerks in every race. But you can’t really apply that to a movement that is bringing attention to an actual serious social problem. I suppose I am getting off topic, but I have always found a good chunk of people’s reactions to black lives matter to be annoying and disrespectful.

Anyway, I think it is to say that anybody has it “easy” in life. There are so many different factors. Not all struggles are equally harsh, but they can impact us badly anyway. For example, you could have a white heterosexual male who was born to a middle class family. This person could suffer from a chronic illness or have a disability of some sort. While the first sentence makes it sound that they have an “easier” life, when you look deeper you realize that that might not be the case.

Thus, neither sensors nor intuitives can be said to “have it easier”. We’re only looking at one facet of a person’s entire life story.
 

Forever

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I am not sure if race is a good analogy to use here. I understand the point you are trying to make. But there is not society-wide discrimination against people for a cognitive preference. People have never been enslaved for being sensors, and segregation against intuitives has not happened society wide either (I’m referring to my own country, but this could definitely apply elsewhere).
Although the methodology of saying something like “all lives matter” in response to “black lives matter” is, to my understanding, completely missing the point. As a movement, black lives matter is trying to call attention to a social issue that is oftentimes overlooked. It is not saying that non-black people are are less worthy. Are there people that probably think that? Sure, there are jerks in every race. But you can’t really apply that to a movement that is bringing attention to an actual serious social problem. I suppose I am getting off topic, but I have always found a good chunk of people’s reactions to black lives matter to be annoying and disrespectful.

Anyway, I think it is to say that anybody has it “easy” in life. There are so many different factors. Not all struggles are equally harsh, but they can impact us badly anyway. For example, you could have a white heterosexual male who was born to a middle class family. This person could suffer from a chronic illness or have a disability of some sort. While the first sentence makes it sound that they have an “easier” life, when you look deeper you realize that that might not be the case.

Thus, neither sensors nor intuitives can be said to “have it easier”. We’re only looking at one facet of a person’s entire life story.

I understand. Due to respect to the OP, I will have to leave it at that, but feel free to take the discussion somewhere else with me :)
 

Jeffster

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If a website negatively effects your self esteem and hinders personal development, I suggest not using that website anymore. There’s lots of other sites that don’t do that.
 

Yama

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Y'all're missing the point lmfao
 

Peter Deadpan

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I took the hint and left pages ago.
Intuitives should have used their "magical powers" (insert dramatic air quotes and mocking expression) and done just the same.
 

GavinElster

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magpie said:
I also want to make it clear that sensors are not more stupid, less creative, less imaginative, less pattern oriented, or less conceptual than intuitives, and if you believe that intuitives are those things more than sensors, you are both wrong and part of the problem, no matter how you try to dress up your condescension and superiority complex.

Honestly, most of this issue is due to a large degree of imprecision on personality typology forums in separating different versions of the typologies. N in the MBTI test is not the same as N in Jung's work.

Actually, quite ironically, I get the sense being a sensation type was in some ways seen as a plus by Jung.... where the idea was a sensation-thinking type was the archetypal scientist, and introverted intuitives were if anything branded as cranks and prophets.
Jung's original diagnosis of himself was sensation/thinking....


What happens a lot on this site is that you see a ton of Ns (by the MBTI dichotomies) and they then try to find out who is "most N of the Ns" to try to brand everyone else as a sensor....which ends up being a bit of a splitting hairs contest, since they're all so dichotomies-N that the criterion for who is "really" N becomes overly subjective and arbitrary. Instead they ought to be asking what sort of N they are. Would they fit better a sensation type or an intuitive type in a functions-y framework (of which there are a few different interpretations at least).
In this worldview, it's more like one's curiosities are concentrated in certain ways, rather than it being about who is more curious/reflective/so on.

One of the problems is N on the MBTI seems to correlate with the Big 5's Open to Experience dimension, which basically IS about being more imaginative, reflective, curious, and so on...contrasted with traditional, down to earth, less reflective, more uncurious pragmatic, less eccentric folk. The stereotype being how Sherlock Holmes of BBC sees most of the people around him.

In reality, though, you'll find that genuine MBTI-S types (not the Jungian counterpart) really don't seem to see the whole N thing as great, and quite frankly I know a lot of STJ types who kind of scoff at the coffee shop intellectual reading eccentric authors and so on lifestyle and prefer someone pragmatic and who has a more worldly attitude and fits in well to society.

Instead of asking what the different types of Ns on the forums are, people ask IF someone is an N or not, and usually if they consistently test N, there's a pretty good chance they are -- many dichotomies S types actually, really don't prefer a lot of the stuff that's so apparently romanticized.
 

AdmiralAndGirlsDesu

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Aww, come on guys, to be fair, you guys run the show in the real world. You are much more equipped to deal with it than this INFP ever would.
 

magpie

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Aww, come on guys, to be fair, you guys run the show in the real world. You are much more equipped to deal with it than this INFP ever would.

Look, I'm sure your life is hard, but I do not run the show in the real world, trust me, and no one in the real world is giving me nice "sensor benefits." People's lives are hard for reasons other than type. There are multiple patterns that make up personality. Typology is only one of them and is actually one of the least significant ones. Meaning that what you assume is a sensor preference irl is actually a different preference not having to do with typology, and it's false to equate them in the way that you are. You also may discover over time frequenting this website that you are in fact mistyped, and think how silly and devastating that would be to realize you blamed all your problems on something that holds no substance, truth, or relevance to your situation.
 

/DG/

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Aww, come on guys, to be fair, you guys run the show in the real world. You are much more equipped to deal with it than this INFP ever would.

If a majority of the world is sensing types, but a majority of people don't run the world...then a majority of sensing types to not run the world.

:rly???:

But it would be nice to think that being a sensor could magically make me successful...
 

Yama

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I'm a sensor.

I work in a laboratory, and I'm GOOD at my job.

I wrote a sci fi / fantasy novel and have excellent / well above average writing skills, both creatively and academically.

I took multiple philosophy classes in college and aced all of them.

I was a supplemental instructor for First Order Logic my last semester of community college.

Being a sensor doesn't make me incapable of this stuff, nor does it mean I can't be good at this stuff.

Being a sensor just means that I have a PREFERENCE for sensing over intuition.

Just the same as intuitives have a PREFERENCE for intuition over sensing.

They're not incapable of "sensor things" and the ones who claim to be are just lazy and want validation for their laziness.
 

magpie

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I'm a sensor.

I work in a laboratory, and I'm GOOD at my job.

I wrote a sci fi / fantasy novel and have excellent / well above average writing skills, both creatively and academically.

I took multiple philosophy classes in college and aced all of them.

I was a supplemental instructor for First Order Logic my last semester of community college.

Being a sensor doesn't make me incapable of this stuff, nor does it mean I can't be good at this stuff.

Being a sensor just means that I have a PREFERENCE for sensing over intuition.

Just the same as intuitives have a PREFERENCE for intuition over sensing.

They're not incapable of "sensor things" and the ones who claim to be are just lazy and want validation for their laziness.

Preach.
 

Smilephantomhive

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I think this phenomenon isn't just about S vs N. It's about and us vs them mentality which is toxic 99% of the time.

I also think it's the thing where you think you are more complex than everyone else because you can't hear everyone else's thoughts, so you assume they don't have any. And that's why some Ns think they are deeper.

I think some people who you could call sensors in the real life crushed some Ns dreams, or made fun of Ns for not being good at certain things, or not being practical enough, and their job didn't allow them to be creative. But this is not an mbti problem.

I think there is a lot of aggressive label attaching in this generation. At first I defended it, but now I see why some people complained about it.

Anyway, I think problems that Ns have are human problems, not N problems.
 

Agent Washington

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Honestly, most of this issue is due to a large degree of imprecision on personality typology forums in separating different versions of the typologies. N in the MBTI test is not the same as N in Jung's work.

Actually, quite ironically, I get the sense being a sensation type was in some ways seen as a plus by Jung.... where the idea was a sensation-thinking type was the archetypal scientist, and introverted intuitives were if anything branded as cranks and prophets.
Jung's original diagnosis of himself was sensation/thinking....


What happens a lot on this site is that you see a ton of Ns (by the MBTI dichotomies) and they then try to find out who is "most N of the Ns" to try to brand everyone else as a sensor....which ends up being a bit of a splitting hairs contest, since they're all so dichotomies-N that the criterion for who is "really" N becomes overly subjective and arbitrary. Instead they ought to be asking what sort of N they are. Would they fit better a sensation type or an intuitive type in a functions-y framework (of which there are a few different interpretations at least).
In this worldview, it's more like one's curiosities are concentrated in certain ways, rather than it being about who is more curious/reflective/so on.

One of the problems is N on the MBTI seems to correlate with the Big 5's Open to Experience dimension, which basically IS about being more imaginative, reflective, curious, and so on...contrasted with traditional, down to earth, less reflective, more uncurious pragmatic, less eccentric folk. The stereotype being how Sherlock Holmes of BBC sees most of the people around him.

In reality, though, you'll find that genuine MBTI-S types (not the Jungian counterpart) really don't seem to see the whole N thing as great, and quite frankly I know a lot of STJ types who kind of scoff at the coffee shop intellectual reading eccentric authors and so on lifestyle and prefer someone pragmatic and who has a more worldly attitude and fits in well to society.

Instead of asking what the different types of Ns on the forums are, people ask IF someone is an N or not, and usually if they consistently test N, there's a pretty good chance they are -- many dichotomies S types actually, really don't prefer a lot of the stuff that's so apparently romanticized.

interesting post, i enjoyed
jung ist istj, 'scientist' archetype

that said functions wise i think it's kinda ...hmm... weird to base on interests. u cant have a full understanding of anything wo multiple disciplinary knowleges. eg. cognition is intrinsically bound up withh neurology, psychology, philosophy, sociology. a renaidssance ideal cannot fford to b s/n by dichotomyy in this definition.

that said i'm pretty sure many ntjs will scoff at those types, too. navelgazing and coleridging aint rocket science. ironically, an sp may even fit into that definition (possibly less "intellectual" and more coffee house artistic/musical by stereotype). this dichotomy functions nicht
 

Yama

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It's funny how some people seem to think sensors aren't even "allowed" to have a thread like this because "it's not as bad as it could be." Our experiences are valid, as are everyone else's, and our complaints are legitimate whether or not it could be worse. Spraining your ankle instead of breaking it still hurts, even though it "could be worse," and it still leaves behind an impact. I guess sensors just shouldn't have nice things.

Most people don't actively or consciously bash sensors. The problem is that it's so internalized, and so common, that most sensor bashing is constantly overlooked, and/or not even seen as bashing because it's so widely accepted. That doesn't mean it's not bashing, or that it's not harmful, or that we don't have to right to complain about it.

Sensors are allowed to criticize their critiquers whether or not those critiquers agree that they're ""oppressed"" (for lack of a better word) or not. Just because you think it could be worse, or used to be worse, or doesn't exist at all because you don't see it, doesn't mean there's no conversation to be had, or that there's no conversation worthy of being had.

If you don't agree, for any reason, then just shrug it off and move on to another thread. Let us fucking have nice things. If it helps sensors to vent about what they think is bias or discrimination, or how they think that bias and discrimination has affected their self esteem, then just let them do it. People bitch about how sensors supposedly ruin everything for the Mighty Intuitives and their lack of real world ability or some shit like that ALL THE TIME and sensors are so used to that shit that we leave it alone. So leave US alone for a change, smfh.
 

Yama

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Sensors shouldn't complain because it could be a lot worse. You shouldn't cry when you break a bone because you could be dead. Obviously the latter is more fatal and meaningful because typology is little more than a game, but it's essentially the same type of logic.
 

Yama

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Sensor bias isn't just something limited to this community, or ANY community. Sensor bias is hardwired into MBTI tests and descriptions. Every single one of them that I've ever seen applies traits such as intelligence and creativity with Ns, and state that sensors are basically robots that just mindlessly obey their superiors to complete tasks and only care about what's in front of their face and act as if they've never even so much as daydreamed. That's not what the difference between sensors and intuitives is about. It's just about how you process information. It has nothing to do with how smart you are or how creative you are. These tests and descriptions are fucking harmful and toxic and therefore spread poison to communities by newbies joining them with extremely stereotypical views of typology as a system who believe strictly what they've read from these wrong and biased descriptions, and assume sensors are just as soulless and devoid of life as tests and descriptions make them out to be.

No, forums like this are NOT more inclined towards intuitives than sensors. Half of the fucking "intuitives" who join them are sensors who mistyped as an N because they don't hate themselves or see themselves as lesser or robotic.
 
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