J vs P: Multi-faceted Discussion

[Yama]

Who cares if it makes sense? Lol. You can't just entertain a thought to have a discussion? Lol.

Not if the discussion is incorrect and/or unconstructive. My offense isn't towards you, but towards J/P as a dichotomy. I hate it so I hate seeing it be used because to me it's no different than spreading misinformation/stereotypes (mostly with introverts for aforementioned reasons). Have fun with it if you want. I've let out my rant so I'm good.

 

[Jeremy8419]

Not if the discussion is incorrect and/or unconstructive. My offense isn't towards you, but towards J/P as a dichotomy. I hate it so I hate seeing it be used because to me it's no different than spreading misinformation/stereotypes (mostly with introverts for aforementioned reasons). Have fun with it if you want. I've let out my rant so I'm good.

So, you just come into someone's thread, derail it, then leave before you even know the point? Well... Okay...

 

[Yama]

So, you just come into someone's thread, derail it, then leave before you even know the point? Well... Okay...

Oh, no, not derail. It's a thread about the J/P dichotomy and I gave my opinion on J/P, why I think it's broken, and how I can't accurately answer your OP because of it. That doesn't mean you're required to subscribe to my opinion, thus "have fun with it if you want."

 

[Jeremy8419]

Oh, no, not derail. It's a thread about the J/P dichotomy and I gave my opinion on J/P, why I think it's broken, and how I can't accurately answer your OP because of it. That doesn't mean you're required to subscribe to my opinion, thus "have fun with it if you want."

It's a derail. Trying to say it isn't by focusing on several words of the OP doesn't make it not a derail.

I already know the detailed answers for what you seek, but it seems you have a problem playing with others.

 

[Poki]

I am J at my own life, i am P with others life.

 

[Poki]

It's a derail. Trying to say it isn't by focusing on several words of the OP doesn't make it not a derail.

I already know the detailed answers for what you seek, but it seems you have a problem playing with others.

What it boils down to is your wording of OP sucks, its very loaded.

 

[Jeremy8419]

What it boils down to is your wording of OP sucks, its very loaded.

In a sense, but considering it loaded or unloaded is what it's actually loaded with.

 

[Jeremy8419]

I am J at my own life, i am P with others life.

I'm guessing you mean in concern with wants?

 

[Poki]

I'm guessing you mean in concern with wants?

Some examples.

I suck at remembering to pay bills so everything is auto pay.

I hate watching my account so i make sure my spending is way within my means.

I enjoy VERY low interest rates so i make sure my credit score is very high

I want to retire so i make sure i put money away automatically with every pay check.

I control my life so i am not controlled by life...lmao. i make sure things are low maintenance so i dont have to maintain them.

I control my life greatly, so life doesnt control it.

In regard to others, everyone has to decide what they want and do, so i am a passenger and i refuse to tell others right from wrong, should from should not. I understand my opinions are not truths.

Like the other post, i mentioned the wording sucks. Do as you will with it. I ak a passenger in that regards, i wont control. Your life is yours to learn to get the results you want.

This is different then those who go through life fighting themselves in regard to J/P.

 

[Norrsken]

The way I see it, the J/P is an inward thought system of what we believe of how we should live our lives. Perceiver types enjoy living life not know where its going, leaving things up to chance, whether its their career, relationships, or hobbies. They shy away from commitment, not because of being phobic against it or anything, but because they believe life is too complex to just stick to one thing forever and that sometimes, certain things has to end and that's okay. They have a "live and let live" mindset. In a way, life is an adventure for them, whether they are an extravert or an introvert, thinker or feeler, and so on.

Judging types believe in eternity, and they find comfort in the sameness of life. They are not boring people, but they just don't see the point of always being spontaneous and changing things when they're happy and comfortable with something or somebody. That doesn't mean that they'll change something if it is causing pain or stunting personal growth, but at the same time, for many things in life, if all is going well, why change? They welcome commitment, whether it is for a cause they believe in, or a person they love enough to marry for life, and they enjoy closure above all else. It has nothing to do with being organized or punctual or clean as a whistle, but personal beliefs.

I might be wrong. I might be talking out of my ass. But this is how I see the J/P dilemma.

 

[Jeremy8419]

Some examples.

I suck at remembering to pay bills so everything is auto pay.

I hate watching my account so i make sure my spending is way within my means.

I enjoy VERY low interest rates so i make sure my credit score is very high

I want to retire so i make sure i put money away automatically with every pay check.

I control my life so i am not controlled by life...lmao. i make sure things are low maintenance so i dont have to maintain them.

I control my life greatly, so life doesnt control it.

In regard to others, everyone has to decide what they want and do, so i am a passenger and i refuse to tell others right from wrong, should from should not. I understand my opinions are not truths.

Like the other post, i mentioned the wording sucks. Do as you will with it. I ak a passenger in that regards, i wont control. Your life is yours to learn to get the results you want.

Thanks, good info.

In regards to the OP, I wanted to separate based upon a dichotomy and did so by loading the question. The actual J/P dichotomy comes after first splitting the former unknown dichotomy. The unknown dichotomy would contaminate the J/P answers of the currently selected side of such, making it indistinguishable. Now, I may simply use the existence of this unknown dichotomy to switch the J/P results for the opposite side of the unknown dichotomy that I already split.

 

[Jeremy8419]

The way I see it, the J/P is an inward thought system of what we believe of how we should live our lives. Perceiver types enjoy living life not know where its going, leaving things up to chance, whether its their career, relationships, or hobbies. They shy away from commitment, not because of being phobic against it or anything, but because they believe life is too complex to just stick to one thing forever and that sometimes, certain things has to end and that's okay. They have a "live and let live" mindset. In a way, life is an adventure for them, whether they are an extravert or an introvert, thinker or feeler, and so on.

Judging types believe in eternity, and they find comfort in the sameness of life. They are not boring people, but they just don't see the point of always being spontaneous and changing things when they're happy and comfortable with something or somebody. That doesn't mean that they'll change something if it is causing pain or stunting personal growth, but at the same time, for many things in life, if all is going well, why change? They welcome commitment, whether it is for a cause they believe in, or a person they love enough to marry for life, and they enjoy closure above all else. It has nothing to do with being organized or punctual or clean as a whistle, but personal beliefs.

I might be wrong. I might be talking out of my ass. But this is how I see the J/P dilemma.

Well, if, say, INFJ and INFP are the same other than their J and P, would it be fair to say that INFJ is J at all the J functions and P at all the INFP functions, and vice versa?

 

[Norrsken]

Well, if, say, INFJ and INFP are the same other than their J and P, would it be fair to say that INFJ is J at all the J functions and P at all the INFP functions, and vice versa?

They're not the same, though. They share very different cognitive functions.
I hope I'm understanding your question correctly, if not, my apologies.

 

[Jeremy8419]

They're not the same, though. They share very different cognitive functions.
I hope I'm understanding your question correctly, if not, my apologies.

I mean, if you are J and Ni-Fe-Ti-Se, then you must be "J" at Ni, Fe, Ti, and Se aspects of life, and "P" at Ne, Fi, Te, and Si aspects of life, right?

 

[Norrsken]

I mean, if you are J and Ni-Fe-Ti-Se, then you must be "J" at Ni, Fe, Ti, and Se aspects of life, and "P" at Ne, Fi, Te, and Si aspects of life, right?

I'm sorry, but I am confused by what you're trying to point out here.
Can you rephrase your question? =]

 

[Jeremy8419]

I'm sorry, but I am confused by what you're trying to point out here.
Can you rephrase your question? =]

All the things represented in J and your first 4 functions should be represented in P and your shadow functions?

 

[Norrsken]

All the things represented in J and your first 4 functions should be represented in P and your shadow functions?

Don't know if that's how it works. Depending on where a certain cognitive function falls, it will in turn make a person's primary type either J or P.
Although, yes, I think the shadow functions seems switched around. INFP's shadow functions turns into ENFJ, since ENFJ's primary functions are the INFP's shadow functions.

I hope that answers your question, again, I apologize if I didn't. I posted here to sort of share my thoughts on what it truly means to be a J/P type, and it comes down to personal beliefs on how life should be lived versus outward appearances of being organized or clean or on time or whatever. It's stereotypical and doesn't really look into the larger scheme of things, I think.

 

[Jeremy8419]

Don't know if that's how it works. Depending on where a certain cognitive function falls, it will in turn make a person's primary type either J or P.
Although, yes, I think the shadow functions seems switched around. INFP's shadow functions turns into ENFJ, since ENFJ's primary functions are the INFP's shadow functions.

I hope that answers your question, again, I apologize if I didn't. I posted here to sort of share my thoughts on what it truly means to be a J/P type, and it comes down to personal beliefs on how life should be lived versus outward appearances of being organized or clean or on time or whatever. It's stereotypical and doesn't really look into the larger scheme of things, I think.

MBTI's usage of J/P is most like Socionic's usage of Mental/Vital, with the difference between Quasi-Identical simply being which dichotomy they are habitually more consciously active in. That is, I am primarily in my Mental Superblock in Socionics, and have Intuition and Feeling conscious habits first and foremost, and am introverted, but my Feeling is more habitual than my Intuition, so I am INFJ/INFj.

Back to my OP, all things Mental, I wish to be the one in a relationship to do the J of these things, being in the driver's seat for these things, while I wish to be the one in the passenger seat for all things Vital.

It's cool. You're pleasant to talk to regardless of any other effect.

 

[Bush]

I control my life so i am not controlled by life...lmao. i make sure things are low maintenance so i dont have to maintain them.

I control my life greatly, so life doesnt control it.
[...]
In regard to others, everyone has to decide what they want and do, so i am a passenger and i refuse to tell others right from wrong, should from should not. I understand my opinions are not truths.

Aaaaand same here. I can't control the actions of others. Locus of control and all of that. And I feel that I shouldn't control their actions outside of giving advice.

But I can control my actions, my surroundings, and my life overall (at least more so than I can others') and so I take responsibility for those things.

I suck at remembering to pay bills so everything is auto pay.

I hate watching my account so i make sure my spending is way within my means.
[...]
I want to retire so i make sure i put money away automatically with every pay check.

I do this stuff, too, with my main motivation being that doing it manually is just a huge pain in the ass. I used to be paranoid about my finances, though, and so I would micromanage the hell out of my finances. Took me a while to realize that tracking it all to such great detail wasn't necessary.

And I so think

I am J at my own life, i am P with others life.

is a pretty good summary.

 

[IndigoViolet11]

Some examples.

I suck at remembering to pay bills so everything is auto pay.

I hate watching my account so i make sure my spending is way within my means.

I enjoy VERY low interest rates so i make sure my credit score is very high

I want to retire so i make sure i put money away automatically with every pay check.

I control my life so i am not controlled by life...lmao. i make sure things are low maintenance so i dont have to maintain them.

I control my life greatly, so life doesnt control it.

In regard to others, everyone has to decide what they want and do, so i am a passenger and i refuse to tell others right from wrong, should from should not. I understand my opinions are not truths.

(...)

This is different then those who go through life fighting themselves in regard to J/P.

To me this very much resembles the P type being sort of a miniralist while being efficient in the particular way. That whatever you do you seem to have the overall mindset of letting the maximum possibility of everything out as much as you can sort of for the sake of not stucking to a dead end, but since I am still in progress in more discovery I cannot make a concrete point the definition of a P type for sure. And in additional to that, this trait might only be a small corner of your overall on how you take action or decide things etc. Maybe I get your mindset right, but I can be wrong too. Maybe you have a different thought, maybe you do that for other reasons I not know of.

Despite that this does not resemble myself, the way that you do things are quite of an interest. It is good so long as you can stick to it in order to avoid troubles, and so long it is decided, that is something that I will take account depending on the situation.

In oppose to this I am more decisive and there are times that I knew despite that there will be little loophole, but still get myself to do it. Meanwhile at times when there is no answer to something I stuck like anybody else would. The OP post is very limited (and at times even wrong as in not resembling at all) and many aspects of life I did not see it fit to a whole picture the world that we live in. It is just bad info overall. I would leave this guy alone because I see way too many similar types of post.

Life is complicated. Even the J side of things are complicated. I might well can describe the J myself experienced, but I see that it is harder than I thought. Yes I am decisive because of my intuition, but at the same time I see people doubt it, and I go doubting it lol.