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[MBTI General] Does everyone struggle with authority, or only certain types?

Madisonclark

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ENTP
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3w2
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so
I'm an ENTP, and I have struggled with listening/following authority ever since I can remember. Whether it's because I think my authority isn't qualified to be in a position of leadership, or because I just don't want to be bossed around, I've always hated it.
My ISFP brother, however, has no problem being told what to do. He follows, listens, and was always the perfect child. Am I just a brat, or does this have something to do with how our brains work..? Thanks! [emoji16]
 

Forever

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NiFi
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sx/so
I think anyone can, just with differing levels according to types. I have a minor problem with them, but it isn't a huge deal.

When it comes to jobs, I do prefer more freedom and structure and when I can accomplish certain things within my own time frame than some set schedule with someone breathing over my shoulder.
 
Last edited:

Norrsken

self murderer
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sx/so
I never really had any issues with authority, assuming they wield their power in a respectable and commendable manner and not so to push subordinates down.
 

Verona

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INFP
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sp
I have always reacted unfavorable to dictator-type authority. Basically if someone tells me they want me to do something in a really bossy way I will deliberately not do it. My report card at school always said I was a gifted student but I had an attitude problem. I was also hugely rebellious towards my parent's authority as a child. As an adult I still avoid situations where I feel controlled but it isn't as strong of an aversion.

I don't know if it is type related or not. A friend of mine said it was unlikely I was an SJ based on that.
 

ceecee

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I don't think much about it, unless the authority is completely incompetent. I don't approach people with a mindset of - they are the authority and I should treat them in some other way than I would anyone else. Maybe this approach keeps people from trying to boss me around, I don't know.
 

wolfnara

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sx/sp
Hm, this reminds of how Socionics outlines the values of Extroverted Sensing;

"The individual feels at home among people who are actively doing something and interacting with each other directly (visibly), and is able to organize people, move them around as necessary, and guide them in achieving a specific goal. He or she likes obedience and even subservience in others, since it allows him to "make things happen" more effectively".

Extroverted sensing - Wikisocion

Other than that, I don't know.
 

prplchknz

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yupp
any type can struggle with authority. I don't think struggling with authority is type related although why they do might be.
like Te doms i feel would struggle with it because they often want to be the ones in charge
Fi doms I feel would struggle with it because they don't give a fuck and want to be left alone (at least this is why i struggle with it)
the rest i dunno there's probably reasons

but at the same time any type can also be ok with authority.

now before people jump down my throat, not all te or fi doms feel this way.
 

cascadeco

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Re being a 'perfect child' and listening, pleasing, etc, a lot of that could be tied to being F, too, and disliking conflict or liking to please....so it may not have much to do with the authority figure concept.

I think as a young child I probably respected all of my teachers and wanted to please/not get in trouble.

Now that I'm older, I will question or not automatically agree if the person in charge asks me to do something that doesn't make sense, or makes a decision that I question.
 
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246
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ISFP
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9?
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sp
The more I find out ultra-independent, anti-authority people like the OP (and others I've encountered online who are even more so) exist, the more I feel disgusted with myself for being how I am.

I'm naturally deferent to authority and always have been. Heck, the culture shift towards more casual workplace relations, even, often feels weird to me, though I think I've adapted okay. However, someone in authority is always more qualified, intelligent, etc than I am, plus they hold power over some aspect or moment of my life - so, shouldn't I be afraid of them and take care not to get on their bad side?
 

Virtual ghost

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It all depends how constructive and competent is authority. I don't believe in rising hell for the sake of hell.


But I will be honest. (perhaps too honest)

I don't see authority as something static and irreplacable. Back in the fall of 1991. airforce of the neigbouring country launched surprise attack under a direct order to hit presidential office in my country. What is exactly what they did but they had bad luck that for some reason president wasn't there. Since this happened in my home city when I was a kid I remembered this event, especially because of the insight it gave me: Authority can be really powerful and dominering, it can also be very good or very bad ... but no matter what authority is basically always replaceable if you try hard enough. Therefore if I consider authority to be of value and use I will even try to protect it since I KNOW that it is replaceable. (if not I will just try to go away) Some people never get to such realizations but in my case it happned very early in life.


Therefore I always had more like buddy/equal relationship with various authority.


Challenging my teachers openly in their claims.
Writting a schedule for groups to my ENFP professor that got "lost in the mess".
I have destroyed many figures of authority in video games.
I convinced my parents many times of what they should do under current cirrcumstances or I completely avoided what they say.
I say openly to authority/boss "Look, this and this is bad. We should change it".

Etc.
 

Eric B

ⒺⓉⒷ
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I'm an ENTP, and I have struggled with listening/following authority ever since I can remember. Whether it's because I think my authority isn't qualified to be in a position of leadership, or because I just don't want to be bossed around, I've always hated it.
My ISFP brother, however, has no problem being told what to do. He follows, listens, and was always the perfect child. Am I just a brat, or does this have something to do with how our brains work..? Thanks! [emoji16]

I have always reacted unfavorable to dictator-type authority. Basically if someone tells me they want me to do something in a really bossy way I will deliberately not do it. My report card at school always said I was a gifted student but I had an attitude problem. I was also hugely rebellious towards my parent's authority as a child. As an adult I still avoid situations where I feel controlled but it isn't as strong of an aversion.

I don't know if it is type related or not. A friend of mine said it was unlikely I was an SJ based on that.

Respect toward authority is what would be connected with what's called "wanted Control" in the APS temperament system I always talk about (which is derived from FIRO-B, which divides behavior into "expressed" and "wanted"). NT's are "Choleric in Control". Choleric has a low "Wanted" behvior, which indicates a strict criteria for coming under others' control. For the NT, it's the iNtuition and Thinking. Things have to make intuitive sense, or he'll think it's "nonsense" and likely resist.
This is what Keirsey/Berens-based temperament theory would consider an "abstract structure". The other structure-focused temperament is the SJ. That's the Melancholy in Control. Melancholy also has low Wanted behavior. Now, when you think of Melancholy or especially SJ, you usually think of the "guardians" who would never rebel against authority. But then, they're also "cooperative" (which would be low expressed Control, based on the need to find out what's "right", before acting), which will be slower to take self-initiated action. (NT's are "pragmatic" which will a higher expressed Control acting on whatever "works") So the SJ's "Structure" is "concrete". They operate off of introverted Sensing (the Sensing + Judging), and so their strict criteria for coming under control is a concrete, "authorized" authority, as well as familiarity. Hence, "Guardians", who will seemingly always follow. However, when this is not met, then their low Wanted behavior will come out (very strongly, often), and the corresponding FIRO scores were even labeled "the Rebel". Since FIRO looks more at negative behaviors, while MBTI and Keirsey look more at positive, you don't really see this in SJ descriptions. But ask anyone who's around them what they're like when they don't get their concrete structure, and they're being pushed into a lot of "abstract" plans with no certainty or authorization!

The cooperative/motive-focused (low expressed, high Wanted) NF can be either Supine, who will also be more of a "follower", or a Phlegmatic, who can be very stubborn when pushed. So we see NF's can go either way. (While the pragmatic/motive-focused SP is operating off of extraverted Sensing, which will go with the flow of the current sensations, and so the "Sanguine in Control" is described as "swinging" between independence and submission).

All of this is also tempered by Interaction Style (I/E + T/F/J/P) or "Inclusion" temperament. So my tendency to "rebel" will be hampered by wanting to be accepted or responded to favorably. Like NF, the ISF/INP group can be either Supine or Phlegmatic, and the Supine will tend to be more yielding, while Phlegmatic will be more stubborn or sluggish, or may yield, just to "keep the peace".
 

Madisonclark

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so
Respect toward authority is what would be connected with what's called "wanted Control" in the APS temperament system I always talk about (which is derived from FIRO-B, which divides behavior into "expressed" and "wanted")

How do I find info on this system? Are there any books or websites on this that you would recommend?
 

Eric B

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Being virtually unheard of in the type community, until I started discussing it, and I only knew about it because my wife got a license with the Christian ministry producing it; the most info is on my own page: http://www.erictb.info/temperament1s.html

A book by a licensed counselor in the system (so this is more closer to being an "official" presentation of the theory than my page) that introduces the theory and gives a lot of detailed descriptions of the temperaments can be downloaded here: http://jacksonsnyder.com/mgi/studies/GCY.pdf

You can also see detailed descriptions of all the possible temperament variations (17 each, in the three areas of interaction) here: Free Temperament Reports for Clients
 

miss fortune

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depends on how competent they are and how they wield their authority... if they're incompetent pricks I won't respect them, but if they're good at their jobs and don't get in my way, I don't care one way or another (and if they're helpful and nice I might even like them!)
 

á´…eparted

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depends on how competent they are and how they wield their authority... if they're incompetent pricks I won't respect them, but if they're good at their jobs and don't get in my way, I don't care one way or another (and if they're helpful and nice I might even like them!)

Yeah this is more or less how I am as well.

Just because I don't have problems with authority, doesn't mean I won't cause problems for it if it seems like it's not doing it's job correctly. I can actually go to very great (sometimes very manipulative) lengths to circumvent or change it if it's shitty. Such as the ISTJ professor I had to TA for this term :dry:.
 

Santosha

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I have tended to have problems with authority for much of my life, and am aware that any kind of perceived power-abuse comes in on my radar, more-so it seems, than many of my friends/family. Seems to be common for CP6, and interestingly..the more blocked I've been from my own 'inner-authority' or guidance, the more rigid and high of standards I've projected outside of myself. It is only in the last year or two, that this relationship has softened a bit. The more I trust my own mind, the less critical I become of authorities. I can accept their imperfections/mistakes/flaws more easily...because it isnt experienced as such a 'threat'.
 
Joined
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ENTP
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8w7
Always had a problem with authority except for the most competent and respected. I think I've always given authority figures a chance to show they deserve any authority over me, but often the chance is over blindingly fast or a straight up challenge. After all, an authority figure who can't win a challenge by his subordinate isn't really authority - more of a placeholder for the real authority institution. Placeholders were tolerable as long as they didn't micromanage.
I suppose that what I've always wanted to establish up front the most is an appropriate degree of autonomy. I absolutely understand the need for authority structures, so if I can see eye to eye with whoever is in charge, we'll get along great. Just don't insult me by assuming I won't whipe my ass if I'm not told when, how, and the number of squares per wipe. I know what the macro objective is, so let me so my job. Don't flex your authority at me unnecessarily, and when I'll support your use of it when it is necessary.

Also, to some extent (a big one) being told not to do something is a direct challenge. It's not necessarily malice (though that'll usually develope in time) but competition or sport. Pretty stereotypical.
 

Yama

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I tend not to question authority unless they're really shitty or incompetent. I don't really have a problem with accepting others' authority at all. I appreciate a friendly but strict authority figure when they're able to do their job right.
 
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