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Disorders and perception of personality

Flybylikeahurricane

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I once talked to a CPP consultant that said that Asperger's syndrome basically causes the inferior function to show up as the dominant function with an inverted attitude to other people. That makes sense, because people perceive me as Se to the point of myself getting annoyed. I think that Asperger's brings out the thinking function to a faulting extent, making others perceive aspies as a dominant or auxilliary thinker. What do you make of this? Do you agree with this? I also created a theory for ADHD and Bipolar when it comes to perception by others. ADHD basically puts on a front in which the Pe function dominates the personality. This may seem normal for EPs, but what I mean is that the Pe function while dominating the personality, pretty much adds a lack of focus on other functions, which causes the ADHD minds racing thoughts and lack of attention, and I think the the Pe front put on has something to do with the S/N preference, putting on a Se front for Si and a Ne front for Ni, while simply staying the same for Pe doms or auxes. With Bipolar, I don't think bipolar changes anything, except it makes the feeling function pretty much overtake the thinking function no matter what position its in and pretty much erase all signs of thinking to other people's perception. Tell me what you think of these theories, because I haven't really proven them yet, although the Asperger's one seems promising. All I know is that people perceive people with disorder's personalities as different from what they really are, because I see people with a deviating pattern of thinking typed wrong all the time, and the pattern seems consistent with Asperger's ( Ne typed as Se, Fe typed as Te etc) I also wouldn't mind hearibg the insights of other people, so whatever you can bring to this thread, no mattet how significant, please speak your mind. And if you're trying to debunk my theories, please use observation and other theories instead of just telling me that my theories are wrong because they sound stupid and illiogical. I don't care how logical they are, as long as they make sense and are right.
 

Flybylikeahurricane

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This will also be an ask me thread incase anyone has any questions :) any questioms you have to help improve the perception of an ENFP in the general community, have at it.
 
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BING BING BING!

I once talked to a CPP consultant that said that Asperger's syndrome basically causes the inferior function to show up as the dominant function with an inverted attitude to other people. That makes sense, because people perceive me as Se to the point of myself getting annoyed. I think that Asperger's brings out the thinking function to a faulting extent, making others perceive aspies as a dominant or auxilliary thinker. What do you make of this? Do you agree with this? I also created a theory for ADHD and Bipolar when it comes to perception by others. ADHD basically puts on a front in which the Pe function dominates the personality. This may seem normal for EPs, but what I mean is that the Pe function while dominating the personality, pretty much adds a lack of focus on other functions, which causes the ADHD minds racing thoughts and lack of attention, and I think the the Pe front put on has something to do with the S/N preference, putting on a Se front for Si and a Ne front for Ni, while simply staying the same for Pe doms or auxes. With Bipolar, I don't think bipolar changes anything, except it makes the feeling function pretty much overtake the thinking function no matter what position its in and pretty much erase all signs of thinking to other people's perception. Tell me what you think of these theories, because I haven't really proven them yet, although the Asperger's one seems promising. All I know is that people perceive people with disorder's personalities as different from what they really are, because I see people with a deviating pattern of thinking typed wrong all the time, and the pattern seems consistent with Asperger's ( Ne typed as Se, Fe typed as Te etc) I also wouldn't mind hearibg the insights of other people, so whatever you can bring to this thread, no mattet how significant, please speak your mind. And if you're trying to debunk my theories, please use observation and other theories instead of just telling me that my theories are wrong because they sound stupid and illiogical. I don't care how logical they are, as long as they make sense and are right.

I really think this is happening to me, in all seriousness. I was supposedly diagnosed with Aspergers by a 'specialist', a year ago, and ADHD when I was ten years old. I've been every single type at least once, which I find hilarious. But, I also think that Aspergers and ADHD [well, Aspergers anyway] has been axed from the latest edition of DSM:

Changes To Diagnonis Critera in DSM-V

Don't Remove Asperger's From the DSM

But to me, it's hard to define what Aspergers is and isn't, because there are genuinely some socially awkward people who are fine, and Introverts too, but choose not to interact with many people on a long-term basis, because they don't feel the need to. I think in Western Society, basically anyone who is Introverted, or has a temper and is smart logically, is tagged has having an ASD Disorder, when they actually don't. I notice this to be quite common, especially in IxTx types, because they fit the stereotypes.

The same for Pe Types and ADD. Pretty much every ExxP (especially young ones) fit the ADHD stereotype in some way, and end up being wrongly diagnosed. And the fact a lot of kids eat sugary crap and become hyper from their diets is another reason. I reckon cutting sugar out of their diets would cease a lot of cases of so-called 'ADHD'. You know?

I get what you're saying about Aspergers and ADHD having an impact in typing, and I can agree with you there, but we mustn't forget stereotyping and misdiagnoses in the mix, or other disorders similar to the ones mentioned.
 

Flybylikeahurricane

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Thank you for your response, and forgive me if I put words in your mouth, I basically skimmed your post to pick out the parts I thought were worth addressing. I agree with pretty much all of it. Other disorders should be considered, and people don't seem to stop and think, "hmm does this person have a pattern in thinking that can deviate their communication style?" Nah, they just seem to think people that communicate a certain way and behave a certain way are automatically thinking that way. I think the next step in the jungian community now that pretty much almost all the stereotypes have been debunked, is to educate others on disabilities, disorders, culture, and religion so that they can consider that in typing them. Typing will improve by tenfold if people would consider more than what they observe in one's communication style.
I really think this is happening to me, in all seriousness. I was supposedly diagnosed with Aspergers by a 'specialist', a year ago, and ADHD when I was ten years old. I've been every single type at least once, which I find hilarious. But, I also think that Aspergers and ADHD [well, Aspergers anyway] has been axed from the latest edition of DSM:

Changes To Diagnonis Critera in DSM-V

Don't Remove Asperger's From the DSM

But to me, it's hard to define what Aspergers is and isn't, because there are genuinely some socially awkward people who are fine, and Introverts too, but choose not to interact with many people on a long-term basis, because they don't feel the need to. I think in Western Society, basically anyone who is Introverted, or has a temper and is smart logically, is tagged has having an ASD Disorder, when they actually don't. I notice this to be quite common, especially in IxTx types, because they fit the stereotypes.

The same for Pe Types and ADD. Pretty much every ExxP (especially young ones) fit the ADHD stereotype in some way, and end up being wrongly diagnosed. And the fact a lot of kids eat sugary crap and become hyper from their diets is another reason. I reckon cutting sugar out of their diets would cease a lot of cases of so-called 'ADHD'. You know?

I get what you're saying about Aspergers and ADHD having an impact in typing, and I can agree with you there, but we mustn't forget stereotyping and misdiagnoses in the mix, or other disorders similar to the ones mentioned.
 

reckful

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I once talked to a CPP consultant that said that Asperger's syndrome basically causes the inferior function to show up as the dominant function with an inverted attitude to other people.

I just did a Google search for...

"aspergers" "inferior function" opposite

... and was unable to find any mention of this very (to me) silly-sounding notion.

If you contact this "CPP consultant" and ask them for a credible source for it, I'd be very surprised if they could point you to anything.

And if they claimed or implied that this notion was in any way supported by any of the "official" MBTI entities, and assuming it isn't, they should maybe be kind of ashamed of themselves.

If this consultant has a website, can you point us to it?
 

Dreamer

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I actually have been thinking about this myself and wonder from time to time if I should really be typed as an ENFP, since I have ADHD, and the parallels between the most common ENFP descriptions out there read akin to some parent's guidebook to ADHD. My suspicion and feeling as of late though, is that ADHD has no effect on a person's typing and is really just a gross oversimplification of the personality type and of the disorder. Though, personally I don't consider my ADHD a disorder :) If ADHD were tied or indeed showing itself through personality type, you'd think it'd be more or less subjected to certain personality types only, but at least based on my limited Google searches so far, I can't seem to find any consistencies.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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I actually have been thinking about this myself and wonder from time to time if I should really be typed as an ENFP, since I have ADHD, and the parallels between the most common ENFP descriptions out there read akin to some parent's guidebook to ADHD. My suspicion and feeling as of late though, is that ADHD has no effect on a person's typing and is really just a gross oversimplification of the personality type and of the disorder. Though, personally I don't consider my ADHD a disorder :) If ADHD were tied or indeed showing itself through personality type, you'd think it'd be more or less subjected to certain personality types only, but at least based on my limited Google searches so far, I can't seem to find any consistencies.

Would this mean that J types can have ADHD?
 

Dreamer

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Would this mean that J types can have ADHD?

Absolutely! Actually, I swear my whole family has it except that I'm the only one that actually got the diagnosis, and my brother and dad are both ENTJs and engineers, so they are extremely methodical and precise with how they approach things. ADHD like many other mental illnesses has many flavors. How it appears in my brother and dad, is that they tend to hyperfocus on subjects and cannot easily switch from one task to another. Also, they tend to prefer routine and consistency, but that can always be a learned habit or someone's coping mechanism to ADHD too. Since your mind is so full of chaos, it is so beneficial to at least have your environment as clean and organized as possible.

I on the other hand, bounce around all over the place. Even if I immerse myself in something I'm deeply interested in, I couldn't do it for too long. I still get bored eventually and I have to move on to something else. If you ever lived with me, you'd see me play part of a song on the piano, then stop and jump to my laptop, then stop and jump to painting, then before that was done, I'd jump over to the TV for maybe 20 minutes? Also, I absolutely have to have music playing while I'm studying or trying to concentrate. I also have fidget toys for me to play with to help me stay focused.

In the end, I think the only difference between Js and Ps may be how it manifests and shows itself.
 

cascadeco

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Would this mean that J types can have ADHD?

My ESTJ boss has it, though, I don't think it comes off as Se, I think she is just much more talkative/ Ne-ish in general, and the main thing is she's super hardcore Te-dom, but she ends up forgetting a % of the things she says she's going to do because she's so busy doing tons of things / her mind immediately goes to something else.
 

INTP

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But to me, it's hard to define what Aspergers is and isn't, because there are genuinely some socially awkward people who are fine, and Introverts too, but choose not to interact with many people on a long-term basis, because they don't feel the need to.

Its not about social awkwardness. The general consensus in autism spectrum disorders is that some parts of the brains are very well developed(strong connection and many neurons) while other parts have bad wiring and thus poorly developed neuronal grids. Some have much bigger difference between well developed and underdeveloped and some have their well developed parts on par or even poorer than regular person, while others have much more developed "good parts" than the average person.

So basically its sort of one sidedness of brain development, which can lead to different types of symptoms(like that social awkwardness).


I actually have been thinking about this myself and wonder from time to time if I should really be typed as an ENFP, since I have ADHD, and the parallels between the most common ENFP descriptions out there read akin to some parent's guidebook to ADHD. My suspicion and feeling as of late though, is that ADHD has no effect on a person's typing and is really just a gross oversimplification of the personality type and of the disorder. Though, personally I don't consider my ADHD a disorder :) If ADHD were tied or indeed showing itself through personality type, you'd think it'd be more or less subjected to certain personality types only, but at least based on my limited Google searches so far, I can't seem to find any consistencies.

I think its more like some types tend to have adhd or add more often than other types. ENFPs for example are maybe the most common type with adhd or add(i think add more common than adhd with them, but its often confused with adhd). Also add and adhd like any other disorders in similar manner are basically normal behavior taken to extremes. With Ne doms in general even if they dont have adhd or add, they do share some similarities with people who do have add or adhd, just that those things arent always taken to extremes. I also think that Ne doms are more easily misdiagnosed with add or adhd because of the similar tendencies, even when the tendencies arent so extreme that add or adhd could really be diagnosed(its quite common that normal personality tendencies are misdiagnosed as disorders, especially when they interfere with something like school as a kid or what ever, because doctors try to make diagnosis and maybe have skewed image of the line between normal and disordered person).
But i do agree that adhd or add can make the type appear more as another type, especially introverts with adhd as extraverts.
 
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Some have much bigger difference between well developed and underdeveloped and some have their well developed parts on par or even poorer than regular person, while others have much more developed "good parts" than the average person.

So basically its sort of one sidedness of brain development, which can lead to different types of symptoms(like that social awkwardness).

I guess this is why I thought I was an IxTP for a long time. My thinking and feeling functions are both well developed. But I'm well trained. I have trained myself socially and mentally to be prepared for society to the extent that I appear 'normal' to the average onlooker. I know when to feel, I know when to think, even when I don't want to. Everything is automated in an instant.

I thought I was completely left brained for a long time, then I realized I used both sides quite equally. I just needed to tap into my untouched creative potential. Now I have, things are a lot better. It just takes a bit of time, patience and practice. You know?
 

Dreamer

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I think its more like some types tend to have adhd or add more often than other types. ENFPs for example are maybe the most common type with adhd or add(i think add more common than adhd with them, but its often confused with adhd). Also add and adhd like any other disorders in similar manner are basically normal behavior taken to extremes. With Ne doms in general even if they dont have adhd or add, they do share some similarities with people who do have add or adhd, just that those things arent always taken to extremes. I also think that Ne doms are more easily misdiagnosed with add or adhd because of the similar tendencies, even when the tendencies arent so extreme that add or adhd could really be diagnosed(its quite common that normal personality tendencies are misdiagnosed as disorders, especially when they interfere with something like school as a kid or what ever, because doctors try to make diagnosis and maybe have skewed image of the line between normal and disordered person).
But i do agree that adhd or add can make the type appear more as another type, especially introverts with adhd as extraverts.

Ya, that's what I'm leaning towards too, that ADHD is probably represented more frequently in particular personality types. For example, I went to an art school, and if all you did was take a sampling of the general population from that particular student body, ADHD would be represented by probably about 25% rather than the 9/10% as is often estimated.
 

pluviophile

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So, for the bipolar stuff: When I get seriously depressed, past all the feelingsy stuff and into robot world, I think I pretty much run on Te. As in, that's all that seems to be left. When I'm hypomanic, I can be all feels, but sometimes that's all Te too. But, no matter how it would or wouldn't change someone's functions up, you have to remember that there are usually long stretches of being "normal." So, I wouldn't say that it necessarily makes the feeling function take over. When, I'm kind of depressed, yes. When I'm kind of hypomanic, maybe. It's like a surprise, where you never know what you will get for sure. :D But, when it's extreme, it's the opposite. I would say my Fi is most evident when I'm level or kind of depressed. Maybe it has to do with what you start with? I'm not sure. Perhaps it goes with that theory of falling into your weaker functions when you are stressed.
 

Flybylikeahurricane

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yeah I figured this post would be misunderstood. What I meant was that disorder affects perception from other people. Disorders never affect your functions, that'd be like saying the star in a completely different galaxy affects the atmosphere of earth. Basically disorders lead people to mistype you, and from what I've seen, with Asperger's people tend to perceive their inferior function the most, but when they see it, they see it in the opposite attitude that it's in. the other ones were just my best guesses, as I have not met very many people with bipolar or ADHD that I have actually typed. Thank you for your contribution however. Based on what you tell me, bipolar seems to bring out the inferior function as well, am I right?
So, for the bipolar stuff: When I get seriously depressed, past all the feelingsy stuff and into robot world, I think I pretty much run on Te. As in, that's all that seems to be left. When I'm hypomanic, I can be all feels, but sometimes that's all Te too. But, no matter how it would or wouldn't change someone's functions up, you have to remember that there are usually long stretches of being "normal." So, I wouldn't say that it necessarily makes the feeling function take over. When, I'm kind of depressed, yes. When I'm kind of hypomanic, maybe. It's like a surprise, where you never know what you will get for sure. :D But, when it's extreme, it's the opposite. I would say my Fi is most evident when I'm level or kind of depressed. Maybe it has to do with what you start with? I'm not sure. Perhaps it goes with that theory of falling into your weaker functions when you are stressed.
 

Chrysanthe

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Everyone who cares to comment about what they see of me tends to note traits more INTP than INFP. So your theory would be correct if I were indeed an Aspie. I do have to consciously train myself to be sympathetic, and so right now I sort of have...well zero sympathy.

I actually was diagnosed in Middle School for Aspergers but since I hadn't known the process by which the person figured this out, I decided to just ignore it. I definitely have some sort of social handicap but Social Anxiety better fits that in my case honestly.
 

pluviophile

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yeah I figured this post would be misunderstood. What I meant was that disorder affects perception from other people. Disorders never affect your functions, that'd be like saying the star in a completely different galaxy affects the atmosphere of earth. Basically disorders lead people to mistype you, and from what I've seen, with Asperger's people tend to perceive their inferior function the most, but when they see it, they see it in the opposite attitude that it's in. the other ones were just my best guesses, as I have not met very many people with bipolar or ADHD that I have actually typed. Thank you for your contribution however. Based on what you tell me, bipolar seems to bring out the inferior function as well, am I right?

No, I didn't misunderstand you, I just wasn't very clear. When I spoke of functions changing or whatever, I meant what I think I use more and what other people have commented on. I didn't mean they actually change or that you were saying that. I am pretty sure that isn't really clear either, but it's the best my brain is going to do today.

As far as it bringing out the inferior function, I can only speak for myself. At certain stages of it, yes. At others, no. But, other than when I'm mildly depressed or "normal", I do not experience, nor appear to experience (from what I've been told), the joys of living in Fi land.
 

Flybylikeahurricane

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Hmm interesting. So you think that with Bipolar, people generally don't show the positive traits of feeling, correct me if I'm wrong.
No, I didn't misunderstand you, I just wasn't very clear. When I spoke of functions changing or whatever, I meant what I think I use more and what other people have commented on. I didn't mean they actually change or that you were saying that. I am pretty sure that isn't really clear either, but it's the best my brain is going to do today.

As far as it bringing out the inferior function, I can only speak for myself. At certain stages of it, yes. At others, no. But, other than when I'm mildly depressed or "normal", I do not experience, nor appear to experience (from what I've been told), the joys of living in Fi land.
 
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