INFJ's, INTJ's, and not being very J-like

[greenfairy]

So INFJ's are J's, but we still have issues sometimes with J things like procrastination, motivation, discipline, consistency, timeliness, and decisiveness. INTJ's sometimes have similar issues with inertia and simply avoiding life for fear of failure. I attribute this to being Perceiving dominant (Ni), but I'd like to know your thoughts about how and why this manifests and what it's like for you. How are you like a J and how are you not and what is the psychology and type theory like behind it?

 

[big sexy]

I think this is a matter of how strong a J one is. If it had to with being perceiving dominant, wouldn't ISxJs have similar problems?

 

[uumlau]

Notice that in Keirsey that there is SP and SJ, but no NP/NJ? NP and NJ are too much alike to differentiate the same way you would SP and SJ.

Si is concretely organized. Ni is abstractly organized, which does not always manifest in the real world. The realm of ideas is organized, not the realm of things.

 

[Entropic]

I always score P except on very rare tests where J is tested more as planning for the future or how inclined you are to think about planning as opposed to actual planning, so that's how J I am.

 

[greenfairy]

I think this is a matter of how strong a J one is. If it had to with being perceiving dominant, wouldn't ISxJs have similar problems?

They do. At least my ISFJ mom totally does. She puts her taxes off until the last minute, changes her mind like every 5 minutes, accumulates piles of clutter around the house, and doesn't understand how to work technology half the time even though she's a computer programmer.

 

[greenfairy]

I always score P except on very rare tests where J is tested more as planning for the future or how inclined you are to think about planning as opposed to actual planning, so that's how J I am.

Yeah this is me too. I was thinking that INJs' Ni makes planning, predicting, and synthesizing information the primary J functions.

 

[Pionart]

I think this is a matter of how strong a J one is. If it had to with being perceiving dominant, wouldn't ISxJs have similar problems?

They do. At least my ISFJ mom totally does. She puts her taxes off until the last minute, changes her mind like every 5 minutes, accumulates piles of clutter around the house, and doesn't understand how to work technology half the time even though she's a computer programmer.

Correct.

I'm Si dominant and lazy af. The only time I am productive is at the last minute. Usually all I do up until that point is estimate how much time I will need in order to finish something. I'm also very indecisive, and people have told me so. I'm not that messy really, but I really can be. Like, my desk is covered in papers, my floor has a pile of clothes. I am also lousy with stuff like technology - basically, if I haven't already done something at least once before, I am hopeless at knowing how to do it without clear instructions.

So yes. I think this is a perception dominant thing. Do IxxP types have these sorts of problems?

--

Anyway, not Ni dom, but as for how I AM like a J - I am very focused and deliberate in what I do, at least I think so. That's the essence of it.

 

[Opal]

I thought Ni dominants' dreaminess and mild dissociation was fairly well established...

 

[Ene]

Notice that in Keirsey that there is SP and SJ, but no NP/NJ? NP and NJ are too much alike to differentiate the same way you would SP and SJ.

Si is concretely organized. Ni is abstractly organized, which does not always manifest in the real world. The realm of ideas is organized, not the realm of things.

I agree with this and want to comment on the bolded part.

I carry entire novel plots in my head. I plan murals in my mind and envision the completed project before I even pick up the paintbrush.

I am J in that I can conceptualize a plan, sometimes intricate and elaborate, from beginning to end and then execute that plan.

I and not super organized with material things, I'm not a neat freak and I often run late, because I get side-tracked doing what i "like" instead of what I'm supposed to be doing.

Toward people I am open and flexible, pretty nonjudgmental really.

 

[big sexy]

Correct.

I'm Si dominant and lazy af. The only time I am productive is at the last minute. Usually all I do up until that point is estimate how much time I will need in order to finish something. I'm also very indecisive, and people have told me so. I'm not that messy really, but I really can be. Like, my desk is covered in papers, my floor has a pile of clothes. I am also lousy with stuff like technology - basically, if I haven't already done something at least once before, I am hopeless at knowing how to do it without clear instructions.

So yes. I think this is a perception dominant thing. Do IxxP types have these sorts of problems?

--

Anyway, not Ni dom, but as for how I AM like a J - I am very focused and deliberate in what I do, at least I think so. That's the essence of it.

I am extremely messy and disorganized, haha. And a terrible procrastinator. And lazy/hard to motivate. Basically all the stereotypical 'P' problems. Could be because of ADHD.

If we speak in terms of outward organization, discipline, decisiveness, etc., I've noticed in general that xxTJs (xSTJs more so than xNTJs) and ISFJs tend to be the most structured. Not always of course, there are plenty of exceptions, just something I've noticed in a decent number of those types I know.

 

[greenfairy]

So yes. I think this is a perception dominant thing. Do IxxP types have these sorts of problems?

Here is a good article on the subject someone recommended from PerC:
Why INFPs, INTPs, INFJs, & INTJs Struggle to Act

 

[the state i am in]

more generally than inj,

f shame shit writer's block and heady disembodied e5ness of 4w5 and 5w4.
see also: methods, absence of.

for Ni specifics, being busy going into trance-mode kinda does it. the opposite of responsiveness, of presence. when i become am original seed and a withered old man at the end of the universe.